NEW Songhai nerf poll

[balparmak]

It was obvious from the first poll that people wanted the minor nerf, and possibly even a bigger one. Adding new options turned that into a mess, so we're starting anew. Had to shorten some of the options, here's the long versions for clarity:
1) Remove embarked sight bonus, reduce embarked defense bonus to 50%. This is our baseline.
2) Remove embarked sight bonus, embarked defense bonus, and attack from sea without penalty. All Songhai units can still cross and attack over rivers without penalty.
3) Remove embarked sight bonus, embarked defense bonus, and attack from sea without penalty. Only melee&mounted melee Songhai units can cross and attack over rivers without penalty.
4) Remove embarked sight bonus, embarked defense bonus, attack from sea without penalty. Remove cross and attack over rivers with no penalty from all Songhai units.

In all of the options above, Songhai keeps "road movement along the river".

5) Remove embarked sight, embarked defense and attack from sea without penalty bonuses. Remove road movement along rivers, but all Songhai units can cross and attack over rivers without penalty. Civilian units didn't have this before, so we're trading "river road" movement with river acts as a normal terrain (see @SpecifiedUsername's post below). Rivers still create city connections.

The big nerf option is pretty close to the recent poll, but civilians can cross rivers here.

 

[azum4roll]

Note that if River = true, crossing rivers always takes 1 MP regardless of terrain.

 

[Zuizgond]

Can we just remove river road movement and keep the rest?

 

[SpecifiedUsername]

5) is justice.

Note that all units will be able to cross rivers without losing all movement, I got a little confused at first cause I treat that as "river movement" too. Removing river as roads means no bonus movement along rivers, not attacking or moving to the other side.

My rudimentary explanation:
Songhai will keep green movement (and gain it on civilians from now).
Songhai will lose red bonus movement.

 

[balparmak]

Yeah, exactly this. The vote options had word limits but I'll try to update the post for clarity,

 

[Grassland Farm]

I voted 5 and all options are very precise so it's easy to get lost ; but in any case in my opinion the priority is that all sea-related bonuses have to go. As far as I know, real-life Songhai had ZERO coastline.

 

[rkkn]

I voted 5 and all options are very precise so it's easy to get lost ; but in any case in my opinion the priority is that all sea-related bonuses have to go. As far as I know, real-life Songhai had ZERO coastline.

all sea bonuses are removed in everything except option 1

 

[pineappledan]

I vote just removing war canoes entirely, and let them keep amphibious.
1 less unique promo to memorize.

 

[Zakuzelo]

It's disappointing to see how many people want the river roads gone. They're strong, yes, but more importantly fun as hell.

 

[Jdoug312]

It's disappointing to see how many people want the river roads gone. They're strong, yes, but more importantly fun as hell.

Agreed. I voted option 1 but voters for the first 3 may need to consolidate our votes to save river roads lol

 

[Zuizgond]

An alternative could be to keep river road movement but only on river tiles with no features (hills, forest, jungle, marsh)?

 

[saamohod]

An alternative could be to keep river road movement but only on river tiles with no features (hills, forest, jungle, marsh)?

That would make no sense imo because the "river road movement" reflects Songhai's perk of moving on the river itself, not along the river bank.

 

[CppMaster]

Why is the topic not under Leader Balance section?

 

[balparmak]

Polls have always been under the main section afaik.

About the nerf, Songhai won't have the embarked sight nor the embarked defense bonuses in the next version,i.e. no more War Canoes. "No attack from sea penalty" stays because that required splitting the Amphibious promotions, which causes some other issues. Thanks everyone for participating

 

[Jdoug312]

Polls have always been under the main section afaik.

About the nerf, Songhai won't have the embarked sight nor the embarked defense bonuses in the next version,i.e. no more War Canoes. "No attack from sea penalty" stays because that required splitting the Amphibious promotions, which causes some other issues. Thanks everyone for participating

I'm really glad to hear that we're starting small with this nerf.