1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

New Unit: Bantu Spearman(9/15/2006)

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Unit Graphics' started by Sword_Of_Geddon, Sep 15, 2006.

  1. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2003
    Messages:
    13,278
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New England, USA

    Attached Files:

  2. Stormrage

    Stormrage Ever Present Taskmaster

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2005
    Messages:
    10,573
    Location:
    behind the scenes
    The spear goes out of the frame when he attacks, and trough his leg when he dies. Other than that, I think its just great! :goodjob:
     
  3. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2003
    Messages:
    13,278
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New England, USA
    I tried fixing the attack, but I'm not sure how to redo it other than bringing the figure into a bigger rendering area..think I should redo the attack?
     
  4. Partizanac

    Partizanac Serbian Ambassador in CFC

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,858
    Location:
    Subotica, Serbia
  5. Quinzy

    Quinzy Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2005
    Messages:
    5,402
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Éire
    just a bigger frame should suffice :)

    looks great though!
     
  6. Bjornlo

    Bjornlo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,701
    Location:
    Hjørungavåg
    Over all pretty good unit.

    Problems:
    1. East and west the spear goes out of frame. Need a larger frame or a smaller spear. Also, this is the successful attack Pose/animation from Shiro. It would be a nice touch to vary it up a little. Since you had problems before with the spear, perhaps the sheild would be a safe thing to change up. In the fortify he draws his sheild in tight, and it is not in this position during the attack. Keeping it at around this spot might make for a good looking variation on the aztec spearman.
    2. The attack does not loop back to the default settings, and it should. If nothing else make a very short victory animation which does nothing but return him to the default position.
    3. The default animation is strange. Why have a multi-frame animation and not have him wiggle? Suggestion: have him move a little. Read Utahjazz's tutorial for his suggested amount of wiggle, and then adapt it to your own.
    4: the fortify has a bug as well. It ends in the wrong frame. It goes 1.2.3.4...14.1 the 15th frame is not related to the attack.
    5: the fortify -> attack loop is a bit rough. This is only in part related to the issue above. Because the final fort animation is not that close to the attack one even taking out the errant frame. Even with a frame missing it should be closer. The attack should begin as a smooth transition from the fortify. It feels a little like it skips some.
    6: the death anim is the worst of the bunch. It is far far too slow. It should be around 65, not 80. He floats gently to the ground. And his spear does weird stuff. In frame 7 the spear is on the ground. It should move little if at all from this point forward. If you want to, or due to body mechanics need to, move his arm a little that is fine. But he slowly pushes the spear out to for a 90 degree angle. Plus the last frame bug is there again. Also, in frame 5 the spear is very clearly on the wrong side of his legs.

    Needed changes:
    1: fix the last frame in the fort and death
    2: fix the spear going through the leg in the death
    3: increase the speed of the death anim to 65.
    4: fix the spear going out of frame in the attack
    5: please add civ specific color. Change the black in clothing to medium dark blue, perhaps.

    Would be nice changes:
    1: fix it so that the spear behaves more naturally in his death.
    2: have the fort animtion loop better with the attack anim.
    3: have the attack animation loop back the the default anim.
    4: have some movement in the default, just not alot.
    5: slight variation in attack from unit to unit... the shield would be a good place to mix things up without messing up the good spear movement.
    6: the spear even goes out of frame in the Pedia icon. Easy to fix.
     
  7. Mithadan

    Mithadan Wandering Woodsman

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2003
    Messages:
    4,036
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alberta über alles ;)
    Very cool unit concept, Swoggy. And although I don't get the feeling that you're always appreciative of the oodles of criticism you frequently get, it seems to be paying off. Simply judging from the preview of the run, the unit looks much improved over your previous forays. I haven't read the tips for improvement on this unit myself, but I'm sure it's only for the good. Keep on truckin'!
     
  8. ShiroKobbure

    ShiroKobbure Still modding Civ3

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2003
    Messages:
    5,550
    Location:
    Here
  9. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2003
    Messages:
    13,278
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New England, USA
    Alright I redid the attack and sped up the death, run and such. New download on first post.
     
  10. Bjornlo

    Bjornlo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,701
    Location:
    Hjørungavåg
    That was fast.

    New suggestions:
    1: the new run has a few rough spots. The spear goes through the ground in a few places, and he is swinging the spear around too much. Also, it looks as if you spotted the spear going into the ground and mostly fixed that, but at expense of the spear having a bit of rough movement. Maybe just have him rest the spear on his should as he runs. Would be simple to do, and should look quite realistic.
    2: The faster death is alot better. Dead guys gently floating to the ground always struck me as odd.. The other issues with the anim are still there. For example, the spear going through his leg and moving after he puts it on the ground.
    3: it is really a shame he as no civ color.
    4: If you are going to render out a 15 frame default animation,you might as well have him doing something. Please re-read Utahjazz tutorial for some insight into what a real vetern with Poser does. An animated default is not needed, but it is a nice touch. Just food for thought.
    5. the new attack was done the hard way, I suspect. It looks as if you redid the entire attack rather than redo the frame size. The result is 'ok', but the spear is not quite so steady in this version.

    With the faster death, the spear flaw is not so visible. With the reworked attack, it is useable since the spear stays in frame.

    If you decide to polish it up more, you might look at the spear movement in the attack & run. And perhaps civ color. Extra credit if the spear does not passing through his leg as he dies..:)

    You've made over 2 dozen units now. The basic skills are certainly there. You can make really good units if you apply yourself and take the time to check the unit out. Just render and post isn't good enough. Your last few units have all had moderate to severe problems.

    The basic level you should probably shoot for would include:
    Does everything stay in frame?
    Does any of him move through any other part of him?
    Does he have civ color? (important)
    Are the animations reasonably smooth and at least moderately realistic?

    Little nits like the rough attack and the mild poke through and slightly rough run can be ignored. But, the question you have to ask your self is what standard to you want to hold your self to?

    Yes, I know not everyone shoots for perfection... but I'm not talking about perfect. Only to a level where it is lacking major flaws.
    I'm convinced that some, like Wyrmshadow (for example) could animate a pile of dung and make it look good. And he would have an easy time doing it. Others, like me, have to work a little harder to try and measure up.
    You make interesting models (ie: interesting ideas). That is over 1/2 the battle. Plus your units are almost always well constructed. Another big piece of what makes a good unit. But, it is not enough to have really nice still images. It is the animating that seems to really tax your patience. Parts of it is always really nice, other parts are rather obviously rushed.
     
  11. ShiroKobbure

    ShiroKobbure Still modding Civ3

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2003
    Messages:
    5,550
    Location:
    Here
  12. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias Civ3 Modding Archivist

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2001
    Messages:
    9,194
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The lone and level sands
    :lol: Bjornlo's & Shiro's comments notwithstanding ("Aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?") great unit. I especially like your approach to the shield.

    Best,

    Oz
     
  13. Grandraem

    Grandraem Alchemist

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2003
    Messages:
    2,101
    Location:
    Below.
    Good job. You can constantly see improvement with each unit.:goodjob:
     
  14. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2003
    Messages:
    13,278
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New England, USA
    These types of units look HORRIBLE with civcolor. If you remember and used Dom Pedro II's African Spearman as I did, the Civ Color only looked good in Black. In an effort to not redo what I saw as a major mistake I withdrew civ-color. I thought it was a worthy compromise.
     
  15. Tathlum

    Tathlum Gallowglacht

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2003
    Messages:
    584
    Location:
    Deise
    good call...
     
  16. Stormrage

    Stormrage Ever Present Taskmaster

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2005
    Messages:
    10,573
    Location:
    behind the scenes
    Civ color is muy importante...
     
  17. ShiroKobbure

    ShiroKobbure Still modding Civ3

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2003
    Messages:
    5,550
    Location:
    Here
    civ color is important, I agree. maybe you can put a ring on his arm. and rings around his ankels to add civ color. Or a border around his shield.
     
  18. Stormrage

    Stormrage Ever Present Taskmaster

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2005
    Messages:
    10,573
    Location:
    behind the scenes
    A part of the spear could be civ colored too..
     
  19. Tathlum

    Tathlum Gallowglacht

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2003
    Messages:
    584
    Location:
    Deise
    In the unlikely event that you have more than one Bantu civ just turn on the colour disk. Sword its your unit. If you feel civ colour would ruin it dont do it.

    If however you dont mind the extra work these guys would appreciate it. But end of the day its your call man.
     
  20. Bjornlo

    Bjornlo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,701
    Location:
    Hjørungavåg
    A major mistake.
    It is a central part of the game. It is how units are identified. There is no faster way to make your unit useless than to leave it out.
    You used a two tone color to the unit.. black and gray. That could have been two tone civ colors just as easily and it would have looked fine.
    Intentionally making your unit nearly unuseable for the sake of false fashion.. and yet managed to over look the more obvious asthethic flaws... Hmmmf.
     

Share This Page