New Version - March 11th (3-11)

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Sorry for rehashing an old complaint, but does anyone else feel that diplomatic victory is too slow? It’s turn 310, and I’ve just proposed World Ideology. It’ll be another 10 turns before we vote on it, and another 10 turns before the actual Global Hegemony vote. I already have enough votes to win, so that’s 20 turns of doing nothing but defending my dominance, with no way to speed up the win. In the late game, 20 turns is an eternity. The game has not been easy up to this point; I’ve fought tooth and nail to get to the top, but now that I’m here, I have nothing left to do.
I know we’ve already discussed and rejected moving World Ideology back, but could we consider making votes happen more frequently in the later eras? A wait time of 10 turns rather than 20 would be much more reasonable, I feel.

Other than this minor issue, I’ve been loving this current version. I feel VP is in a better place than ever before. Cheers!
 
Blue Ghost said:
Sorry for rehashing an old complaint, but does anyone else feel that diplomatic victory is too slow? It’s turn 310, and I’ve just proposed World Ideology. It’ll be another 10 turns before we vote on it, and another 10 turns before the actual Global Hegemony vote. I already have enough votes to win, so that’s 20 turns of doing nothing but defending my dominance, with no way to speed up the win. In the late game, 20 turns is an eternity. The game has not been easy up to this point; I’ve fought tooth and nail to get to the top, but now that I’m here, I have nothing left to do.
I know we’ve already discussed and rejected moving World Ideology back, but could we consider making votes happen more frequently in the later eras? A wait time of 10 turns rather than 20 would be much more reasonable, I feel.

Other than this minor issue, I’ve been loving this current version. I feel VP is in a better place than ever before. Cheers!
Click to expand...
Where are you compared to science victory ?
Diplomatic victory should occur approximatively at the same time (a little before if your are good).

In other words, is the problem "Diplomatic victory is too long?", or is the problem "Diplomatic victory boring at the end?"
 
Moi Magnus said:
Where are you compared to science victory ?
Diplomatic victory should occur approximatively at the same time (a little before if your are good).

In other words, is the problem "Diplomatic victory is too long?", or is the problem "Diplomatic victory boring at the end?"
Click to expand...
More the latter. The issue I see is that once you’ve reached a certain point, there is nothing you can do to make diplomatic victory come faster. With science victory, you can focus all your efforts on science and engineering to help it along. But with diplomatic, after you’ve gotten all the required techs and votes, there’s a long period where you have nothing to work toward and can do nothing but wait.
 
One thing that could be fixed would be the calculation of the peace value.
Several times the value in peace negotian is extremly low or jump from one turn to another like 10 ->500 without any big change of war points.
The warscore is 25 for me.
I see, he has no money, but still luxuries to trade. But the peace deal value is ZERO.
 
Venice is really cool and exciting to play as now, and may even be too strong lol since I'm able to keep my own on Immortal (something I can only do with warmonger aztecs otherwise lol). Thanks for the awesome patch!
 
RAuer2 said:
I used the No Bad Events option in a game I started with the Fed-27 version of VP and did not have a crash to desktop. Not conclusive, but it is something.
Click to expand...

I was having regular (save-ruining, consistent) crashes a couple months ago. I eventually realized it was always happening on the same civ's turn (a different civ in every game, but always THAT CIV in that game). After trying a few different things, checking the "no civ-specific events" checkbox has made it so I haven't had that sort of game-ruining crash in three or four months.

EDIT: I would prefer to have events off entirely, but the last time I tried, that option just seemed to plain not work if using Really Advanced Setup. I would welcome a fix for this if anyone knows anything; last time I looked (a while ago), I didn't come up with anything helpful.
 
ridjack said:
I was having regular (save-ruining, consistent) crashes a couple months ago. I eventually realized it was always happening on the same civ's turn (a different civ in every game, but always THAT CIV in that game). After trying a few different things, checking the "no civ-specific events" checkbox has made it so I haven't had that sort of game-ruining crash in three or four months.

EDIT: I would prefer to have events off entirely, but the last time I tried, that option just seemed to plain not work if using Really Advanced Setup. I would welcome a fix for this if anyone knows anything; last time I looked (a while ago), I didn't come up with anything helpful.
Click to expand...

If you check all the boxes for all the event types there seems to be no events when using Really Advanced Setup.
 
ridjack said:
Fantastic, thank you. I had seen that recently but hadn't even considered using it for the events system, since I'd long ago just accepted I'd be stuck with them.

Hope that works. Thanks again!
Click to expand...
It works, you'll notice the events pop-up in diplo corner will be gone. So you'll know it's disabled. Also, you can verify by checking the logs if you have logging enabled.
 
BiteInTheMark said:
One thing that could be fixed would be the calculation of the peace value.
Several times the value in peace negotian is extremly low or jump from one turn to another like 10 ->500 without any big change of war points.
The warscore is 25 for me.
I see, he has no money, but still luxuries to trade. But the peace deal value is ZERO.
Click to expand...

I think (not 100% sure) peace deals "rewards" are based on some factors:
1- Availability of resources. If they have no money and are in a negative GPT, the only things they could offer is luxuries or cities, which sometimes can be more valuable than the peace deal for them. If they are having hapiness trouble, that non duplicate luxury is worth A LOT to the AI. Also cities can be worth a lot depending on pop/strategic location and if they have a wonder or buildings (I think).
2- You need to be over a certain "threshold" of warscore to actually get something out of war (not only the win itself), and obviously the more warscore, the better the peace value deal. But smaller or poorer civs have less to offer, so even with a good warscore in your case Ashurbanubal can't offer much. You'd probably have to push the warscore some more to get a lux or a city.
3- Not have reached capitulation status. If you reach the point where the AI is willing to capitulate, my experience is the peace deal gets a value of 1000 and the capitulation is worth 500, so not much to haggle there.
4- Not sure about this one, but I have the impression if the AI really hates you they won't be willing to give you good peace deals, and luxuries will be worth more than they normally are worth.
 
ridjack said:
I was having regular (save-ruining, consistent) crashes a couple months ago. I eventually realized it was always happening on the same civ's turn (a different civ in every game, but always THAT CIV in that game). After trying a few different things, checking the "no civ-specific events" checkbox has made it so I haven't had that sort of game-ruining crash in three or four months..
Click to expand...
If the problem was really that applicable. You could have just gave us your lua.log or report it on Github to have the issue resolved. :dunno:
 
Rafs said:
I think (not 100% sure) peace deals "rewards" are based on some factors:
1- Availability of resources. If they have no money and are in a negative GPT, the only things they could offer is luxuries or cities, which sometimes can be more valuable than the peace deal for them. If they are having hapiness trouble, that non duplicate luxury is worth A LOT to the AI. Also cities can be worth a lot depending on pop/strategic location and if they have a wonder or buildings (I think).
2- You need to be over a certain "threshold" of warscore to actually get something out of war (not only the win itself), and obviously the more warscore, the better the peace value deal. But smaller or poorer civs have less to offer, so even with a good warscore in your case Ashurbanubal can't offer much. You'd probably have to push the warscore some more to get a lux or a city.
3- Not have reached capitulation status. If you reach the point where the AI is willing to capitulate, my experience is the peace deal gets a value of 1000 and the capitulation is worth 500, so not much to haggle there.
4- Not sure about this one, but I have the impression if the AI really hates you they won't be willing to give you good peace deals, and luxuries will be worth more than they normally are worth.
Click to expand...
Ok, I could agree, if I have only 4 or 5 warscore, but not 25.
And I could understand it, if I have 100 peace deal points, but the AI rated its last copy of luxuries as 200 points. The result may be the same, but reach 25% the value for a capitulation and have ZERO points for deal, this feels weird.
 
BiteInTheMark said:
Ok, I could agree, if I have only 4 or 5 warscore, but not 25.
And I could understand it, if I have 100 peace deal points, but the AI rated its last copy of luxuries as 200 points. The result may be the same, but reach 25% the value for a capitulation and have ZERO points for deal, this feels weird.
Click to expand...

If nothing the AI has is under or equal to the peace deal value they will only white peace. Otherwise they won’t accept the deal anwyays.
 
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