New Version - September 19th (9/19)

[grmagne]

I don't really see why the Inca shouldn't see sheep, I mean there were no horses or cattle anywhere in the Americas, should all america-based civs just not see any pasture-resources because of that?

This mapscript thing affects one situation and one situation alone, when a sheep spawns on a hill next to multiple mountains, and yes that does happen a lot, mainly because mountains don't have any food on them. But it's honestly not like there are more mountain-hills with sheep on them than without sheep on them. This whole discussion just feels a lot like 'game is conspiring against me'-syndrome, confirmation-bias and straight up over exaggerations.

Let's figure out a way to make the terrace-farms that you actually get to build feel cool and rewarding rather than upsetting the pasture-balance, and making ridiculously ugly terrace-sheep tiles that in the end won't really change anything.

I agree with Funak. Not giving sheep to the Inca sounds like a very inelegant solution. The last two times I played the Inca I used Tectonics & Planet Simulator and both maps were perfectly playable. Is it just the Communitas map that overfills hills with sheep?

What will the map look like from the Inca player perspective? Will they see pastures in enemy land but without visible resource inside? What happens if they conquer that city, will the sheep disappear so they can build a terrace farm?

 

[Freaky Freddy]

I don't really see why the Inca shouldn't see sheep, I mean there were no horses or cattle anywhere in the Americas, should all america-based civs just not see any pasture-resources because of that?

This mapscript thing affects one situation and one situation alone, when a sheep spawns on a hill next to multiple mountains, and yes that does happen a lot, mainly because mountains don't have any food on them. But it's honestly not like there are more mountain-hills with sheep on them than without sheep on them. This whole discussion just feels a lot like 'game is conspiring against me'-syndrome, confirmation-bias and straight up over exaggerations.

Let's figure out a way to make the terrace-farms that you actually get to build feel cool and rewarding rather than upsetting the pasture-balance, and making ridiculously ugly terrace-sheep tiles that in the end won't really change anything.

Yeah i agree with this tbh

 

[Gazebo]

If that's the case then the terrace farm remains as-is. Getting into exclusivity and overriding becomes very complicated.

G

 

[matlajs]

pitty you have no ehh survey(?) where we could vote in that matter. in the end is up to you, but i dont like when one shout over the others( doesnt mean here are more those desiring change than those who not). Funak just like sheeps no offense

 

[Funak]

I really don't think it's confirmation bias.

On the worst Hun game I've ever played, I got to plant a bunch of Ekis that just weren't next to eachother.

On the worst Inca game I've ever played, I got to plant two terrace farms total and had to rip one of them out because it had been planted on uranium.

Roll ten inca starts. Disable hidden resources. Count your valid terrace farm locations on your continent. Compare this to valid Kasbash locations, valid eki locations, valid polder locations, valid pyramid locations, etc.

The inca UI would have to be something along the order of magnitude of a natural wonder to make up for its current placement issues, unless you tweak the map by setting "sparse resources."

I pretty much always have like half the tiles as hills maybe 40%, and then I have like maybe one fifth of them at most covered with sheep. Of course I never have any mountains so I do have more tiles to work with .

Just finding random hills out in nowhere to place terrace-farms on is absolutely no problem for me, the real problem is that those tiles are just really uninteresting. they spend more than half the game as 1f 3p tiles and then turn into 2f 3p tiles in the industrial era.

pitty you have no ehh survey(?) where we could vote in that matter. in the end is up to you, but i dont like when one shout over the others( doesnt mean here are more those desiring change than those who not). Funak just like sheeps no offense

Right back at you

If that's the case then the terrace farm remains as-is. Getting into exclusivity and overriding becomes very complicated.

Maybe do some minor tweak to the improvement itself and leave the tile-requirement as it is? I mean the Inca have hillbias, which usually results in 40% hill situations, and having 40% of the tiles filled with unique improvements just wouldn't look very pretty. I mean they shouldn't exactly be super-rare, but every hill-tile would be a bit heavy.

 

[Gothic_Empire]

If that's the case then the terrace farm remains as-is. Getting into exclusivity and overriding becomes very complicated.

G

Is there a way to tell sheep not to hug mountains?

 

[matlajs]

lol thats bcoz their main bonus should be in food surplus on basic farms. im not one who want change their abilities rather than completely rework them.

 

[grmagne]

Can we compromise and give terrace farms 1 extra food for every sheep being worked in the city

 

[Funak]

lol thats bcoz their main bonus should be in food surplus on basic farms. im not one who want change their abilities rather than completely rework them.

That's their main purpose since a few months ago, before that their main purpose was being foodheavy super-tiles. I don't necessarily think going back to that would be the worst idea ever. But that wasn't what I was suggesting either.

 

[matlajs]

also next thing which deserve a change IMHO is that Order national wonder. i dont know how others feel this one keep step with other ideological NWs, but for me defense pact is something rly uncomon compared to DoF or capturing capitals as Autocrat.

 

[matlajs]

That's their main purpose since a few months ago, before that their main purpose was being foodheavy super-tiles. I don't necessarily think going back to that would be the worst idea ever. But that wasn't what I was suggesting either.

hmm didnt play that version, but sometimes something more simply is better so you might be right in this.

 

[Gothic_Empire]

and then I have like maybe one fifth of them at most covered with sheep. Of course I never have any mountains so I do have more tiles to work with .

I think 1/5 describes my sheep ratio fairly well. With the remaining 4/5 being distributed among "boring / not very valuable 2f/3p tile near no farmland," "has a mining lux," "Has no mountain and no farm adjacency" and then, finally, "That looks like a hill but it's actually glitched plains."

The problem, I guess, is that the tile is capable of creating a natural-wonder-esque farm, but the conditions on which you can do this are so strict that it might as well be "Inca had a slightly higher chance of starting next to a natural wonder." The rest of the terrace farms you're allowed to place are boring or aren't worth working.

With polynesia, Maya, the huns, etc, I always want someone on my UIs. With the Inca, you either play as if you don't have a UI (because it's basically a mine with one food that you're allowed to have only occasionally and that doesn't improve) or else you get that really weird perfect storm of super tiles.

The more I think about it, the more they remind me of BNW Spain.

 

[Gothic_Empire]

...it might also just be that communitas happens to be a bad mapscript for the Inca, and that I'm responding to a different problem than others are.

 

[Funak]

...it might also just be that communitas happens to be a bad mapscript for the Inca, and that I'm responding to a different problem than others are.

Actually, I'm not even sure the Sexysheep thing is even present in Communitas, I only know it is in the standard mapscripts.

With polynesia, Maya, the huns, etc, I always want someone on my UIs. With the Inca, you either play as if you don't have a UI (because it's basically a mine with one food that you're allowed to have only occasionally and that doesn't improve) or else you get that really weird perfect storm of super tiles.

This is exactly the thing, everything needs to align perfectly for you to have a terrace-farm that actually feels good, and since it is so damn rare, you get really pissed off if it happens and that 1/5 sheep is on that tile (contradiction, considering if the sheep is on the tile, things didn't align perfectly). This is actually the main reason why I suggested a less RNG dependent approach to the TF in the first place.

 

[tu_79]

...it might also just be that communitas happens to be a bad mapscript for the Inca, and that I'm responding to a different problem than others are.

Exactly. I don't play in Communitas since a long time ago, and I don't see that situation often.

It's not like Inca didn't have cattle, so removing sheep doesn't seem right. Just let the terrace farm be over animal resources on hills (are they just sheep?) and all be happy. Better than changing Communitas map. (Granting a little happiness for specialists would be great for a civ that only yields more food, too).

 

[Freaky Freddy]

Can't the incas just get some bonus yield on hills next to mountains that have resources or something(kinda like the old japan culture bonus from atols and fishing boats). It's thematic and makes up for the potential terrace farm you lose.

 

[Enrico Swagolo]

How about giving Slingers the ability to kill hill Sheep?

It makes sense. A slingshot can kill a sheep.

 

[notque]

How about giving Slingers the ability to kill hill Sheep?

It makes sense. A slingshot can kill a sheep.

It is pretty funny we're talking about what should be a bonus resource being a pest.

Pest tiles that you must clear, isn't a horrible idea.

 

[tu_79]

Pest tiles that you must clear, isn't a horrible idea.

Yes, I am completely against it. Hope it was just a joke.

 

[grmagne]

How about giving Slingers the ability to kill hill Sheep?

It makes sense. A slingshot can kill a sheep.

Best suggestion yet.

I'm also reminded of a Sioux mod that I played a couple of years ago where the bison would randomly roam around your territory.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=280806564

I wonder if we could combine the ideas so that slingers could chase sheep away to another random location on the map?