Newbie needing advice

[Rosschild]

@Hawk. See? Told you there's be people along who knew better what they were talking about than me. I'd say if Tomoyo and scoutsout say 1 worker per city is good in the early game, then it probably is (with no disrespect to Mistfit. I'm just more familiar with the posts of the other two and I know they give good advice). I guess I'll lower my standards (I wasn't living up to them anyway ). I'm still learning too, just like you so there's always room for improvement.

@scoutsout: Yeah, you could say I've been lurking for awhile. Joined in August 2003, posted for the first time probably about a week ago. I'm really glad you think my advice is okay. I've been worried that I'm unknowingly leading the few new players I've tried to help astray.

@Tomoyo: your Industrious comment has given me an idea for a new thread which I hope hasn't been done before, or at least recently. Stay tuned...

@Hawk again: continue to post with questions and maybe some updated save games and we'll continue to help as long as you want.

 

[JoeBas]

Just to offer my $.02 into the "how many workers" question, generally speaking, I usually start out with one per city... while my initial worker builds up 4 or 5 tiles around the capital, I make my initial scouts/warriors for wandering/exploring, and then get to work on my first settler. Generally I try to work my capital worker (bonuses or rivers notwithstanding) in the direction I intend that first settler to go, and by the time the first little bird leaves the nest, I've got 3 or 4 tiles fully improved around the capitol. Since my capitol is usually cranking out settlers like nobody's business, that's enough improvement for that city for now. That worker then gets sent on a road-building programme... he starts roading in the direction the settler is going, and often has that city connected very quickly. City #2 builds it's own worker to improve the area around that city, while the "original worker" keeps on moving down the line (or bends/doubles back), and essentially becomes the "department of transportation", always building roads in the direction of the next settler. By the time I'm settling in more than one direction, the 2nd city's settler has improved the 4 or so tiles around his city, so he too joins the "department of transportation" in building roads out down the line.

Now, that being said... (and not to hijack your thread), I'm still getting out-expanded on Emperor pretty consistently, and can't understand why... even on my current game as the Mongols, I had my capitol handed to me in a perfect 4-turn settler factory position. It built a couple scouts, aa warrior for MP (wine on grassland was part of the deal), my first settler, and a granary, in that order, and sent the settlers out unescorted (as my "random barbarians" turned out to somehow be NONE, which meant no goodie huts, which rendered my expansionist trait somewhat useless )... and STILL the damnable AI out-settled me somehow, including sending them into my core cities areas with that blasted "I can see that Uranium will pop here in 2500 years, so I'm gonna settle here now" ability it has. (I've surrounded those cities closely, so hopefully they're gonna flip to me eventually). So maybe there's something different I need to be doing with my workers or something, I dunno... just seems like the AI never had this kind of settler advantage on me before.

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

Now in 90AD. I've expanded, and cut off the Russians from expanding. I've started trading & communicating with France, Japan, Babylon, Mongolia, & the Ottomans. Tell me if there is anything I could improve on.

 

[Mistfit]

It's easier for a lot of us to look at a save.

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

Here you go.

 

[Mistfit]

Ok - I don't have the game with me right now but I looked at what I could using Mapstat and your pictures.

My Thoughts:
6 workers (good)
4 warriors - upgrade them if they are Veretan units. If not keep them for MP duty.
1 Archer
5 Swords
2 Horses.

Not a bad little military. Do not build anymore reg units. You have enough military right now not to get picked on by your neighbors. I would not waste anymore shields into regular units.

Cities:
Chengdu: If this were my game I'd switch out the build from walls to a temple. I'd also get a couple of units there to help against flipping. Personally I rarely build walls. The only time I do is if the town is in an area where a future war is going to break out and I know the city is going to be attacked. I wouldn't have a problem with you putting walls in a city like Tsingtao seeing that it is a choke point city and the Russians will likely attack there 1st once your war starts.

Nanking: You have 2 mined desert tiles and 1 mined plain. It's a size 2 city and not growing. I'd prefer to see the worker turns going towards bringing irrigation to this town from wither Canton or the river to the south. Also the settler you are building will never complete with only 2 citizens, you need 3 for it to complete. I think I'd use this town to get a couple of ships in the water to explore the world and make more contacts. You Currently only have knowledge of 12% of the world,

Canton: Size 1 town with at least 8 workable tiles including 3 mined hills that won't get used for quite a long time. You can only use hills or mountains if you have Extra food in a city because they do not make enough food to support a citizen on their own. Why the Walls?

Tsingtao: Good choice on the harbor! I think you must be planning on a attack of the Russians by the small SoD there. They would be my first choice as well.

Xinjian: Instead of the worker roading the hill I think I'd have him chopping the forest for the shields. Just make sure they are foing towards somthing like a rax/harbor/lib. Again no more reg units.

Shanghai: Again to many worker turns wasted on a size 3 city. Try to get water to those two plains tiles.

Beijing: Get that cow irrigated. It's a bonus tile that should have been your first priority to be worked. As for the wonder being built there OK. But I'd suggest your next game you try to not build any wonders at all. This was one of my big faults when I first started playing. Think of how many units you could have pumped out with the shields used up there.

Overall you are doing pretty well. with some concentrated efforts on worker turns and builds you will be on your way.

 

[braclayrab]

Hawk, don't let these guys confuse you, I'm finally playing comfortable under monarch diffuculty, possibly my 20th or 25th game or so (I also played Civ 1) and I still don't understand some concepts that are discussed. (Corruption for example, i only recently learned). Any how, as Misfit said,
"Remember that during the beginning of the game Despotism will take away 1 food away from any tile making more than 2. This of course changes as you reach a more enlightened for of government."
I realize you don't feel like figuring out what this means, but essentially, early in the game, you shouldn't irrigate tiles that are making two food, like grassland. (this actually doesn't apply to your current game, but keep it in mind)

In addition, as someone mentioned, the cow and grass bonus tiles should be improved ASAP. These, in fact should have been some of hte first tiles that you improved. I personally would have irrigated them and began producing as many settlers as I can (people on CFC call it a settler farm), but you may want to mine them, since once your capital becomes size 6, it'll get capped off until you can build an aquaduct, which will require the extra shields from the mines anyway.

Also, i should mention that I prefer something closer to 2 workers per city, and often find that i change tiles as the game progresses, mining when my cities are capped at 12 for instance.

Hope this wasn't too wordy or lengthy. Good luck!

Edit: I agree with the walls comment, they're relatively cheap and can be bought if a war breaks out. If you do build them, also be sure to sell them once your town becomes a city (ie gets above size 6) since they no longer serve a function but cost 1 gold/turn

 

[JoeBas]

Edit: I agree with the walls comment, they're relatively cheap and can be bought if a war breaks out. If you do build them, also be sure to sell them once your town becomes a city (ie gets above size 6) since they no longer serve a function but cost 1 gold/turn

Actually, from what I can tell, they no longer have an upkeep cost... in my city screen, they no longer have the red coins next to them...

 

[scoutsout]

Actually, from what I can tell, they no longer have an upkeep cost... in my city screen, they no longer have the red coins next to them...

Did you build the Great Wall? If so...that's why the walls are free. Now read Ision's "wonder addiction" article.

OTOH...if you CAPTURED the Great Wall...I'm proud of you, and you are well on your way to understanding the fact that a dozen Swordsmen are cheaper than the Great Library.... :devil2:

 

[Northern Pike]

HC, a very simple piece of advice: while you're learning, avoid large and huge maps. You need to play as many different games as possible to improve, and games on the bigger maps take too long.

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

It's now 650 AD. I've captured 3 Russian cities, but somehow they escaped to another continent. I have 13 cities total, have built the Pyramids to give each city a Granary. I'm in the process of building the Forbidden Palace near the border with Arabia. I'm not sure why Moscow isn't growing. It was in disorder with one citizen. I changed that citizen from production to an Entertainer. What should I do?

 

[TimBentley]

I'm not sure why Moscow isn't growing. It was in disorder with one citizen. I changed that citizen from production to an Entertainer. What should I do?

The unhappiness must have been due to the war. By the way, if all of the people in a city are specialists, it's better to have tax collectors or scientists instead of entertainers.

 

[JoeBas]

Did you build the Great Wall? If so...that's why the walls are free. Now read Ision's "wonder addiction" article.

OTOH...if you CAPTURED the Great Wall...I'm proud of you, and you are well on your way to understanding the fact that a dozen Swordsmen are cheaper than the Great Library.... :devil2:

Nope, neither built nor captured the Great Wall (though I did capture it in my last Monarch game, along with every other wonder on the huge map earth). I don't built most wonders, I'm pretty damn selective in that... I'll build Leo's if I can (or alternate to Sun Tzu/Sistene if I get beat to that), and always go for the ToE/Hoover slingshot when I can... Oh, and always try to get my hands on the UN, even when playing warmonger, just to prevent the vote. I'll also pre-build Statue of Zeus if I get an early source of Ivory, since there's a lot less AI competition, but that's the only ancient age great wonder I'll even consider trying for.

But in my current game, I have walls in my border cities with the Americans... free of upkeep. Go figure.

 

[Tomoyo]

Walls don't require a maintainance gold anyway.

Scoutsout, I'm disappointed in you. Surely a warmongerer like you should know about walls...

 

[JoeBas]

LOL, that's what I'm sayin'! Just had to present some anecdotal evidence...

 

[scoutsout]

Scoutsout, I'm disappointed in you. Surely a warmongerer like you should know about walls...

Walls... are useful when defending a corrupt town that can't build any useful units... in an AW game...

Now... compare and contrast the tactical and economic value of Walls, Aqueducts, and Rivers. Tell me - how often does your artillery destroy an enemy's walls? Market? Temple? (I've destroyed these and more with bombardment...)

Now...how often does your artillery destroy an enemy's aqueduct? Maybe in the late Industrial ages, after all the enemy units are redlined and the rest of the city is rubble...

Now... what's the defensive value of Walls? And what's the defensive bonus for a size 7+ city?

 

[Tomoyo]

As far as I know, I said nothing about the AI building walls...

I meant you building walls. (Oh yeah, you're the reincarnation of Charis ) I guess you don't build them after all.

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

It's now 1255AD. I've expanded to where my borders touch Zululand & Arabia. I've taken over one Zulu city because of culture. Russia tried to invade my border with 2 Warriors, which I easily defeated. I bribed the Arabians to declare war on the Russians.
Here is a jpeg:

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

Do I invade the Zulu's or keep trying to win over their cities with culture? I've started creating Riders & put them in stacks. How many units & what units would I need to defeat the Zulu's?
Here's another jpeg:

 

[Hawk Chieftain]

Here's my save file: