[BTS] News: BOTM 214 - Sitting Bull, (Monarch) starts June 1, 2021

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Game of the Month' started by kcd_swede, May 30, 2021.

  1. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    BOTM 214: Sitting Bull of Native America.



























    Sitting Bull on the Great Plains. Not much needs to be said about that, except the Great Plains map was altered in some rather annoying ways. My gift to you is the joy of discovery.
    For the masochists, play the Challenger save at Deity... the AI get Monarch units PLUS an extra settler and extra archer.
    Note, as per normal Monarch level, Barbarians begin with archery (in Challenger save they begin with Hunting and archery).
    Game settings:
    Playing as: Sitting Bull of Native America
    Rivals: 7 AIs
    Difficulty: Monarch
    Starting Era:
    Ancient
    Speed: Normal
    Options: No goody huts, no random events
    Victory Conditions:
    All enabled
    Map settings:
    Map: Great Plains with modification
    World Wrap: None
    Mapsize: Standard
    Map latitudes: 25°N to 45°N
    Sitting Bull is Philosophical and Protective, and you start with Fishing and Agriculture.
    The Philosophical trait gives +100% great people birth rate and double production speed of University
    The Protective trait gives free City Garrison I and Drill I promotion for archery and gunpowder units and double production speed of Castle and Walls
    Unique unit: Dog Soldier (replaces Axeman)
    The Dog Soldier benefits from: base strength = 4, requires access to nothing, and 100% combat bonus against melee units. This compares with the Axeman which has: base strength = 5, requires access to copper or iron, and 50% combat bonus against melee units.
    Unique Building: Totem Pole (replaces Monument)
    Same as monument but adding +3EXP to archery units
    Starting screenshot
    This is the start of the game (click for a bigger image):


    Note that in this game, any espionage-culture victories will be counted as cultural victories.
    Challenger Class Equalizers:
    You will play at Deity difficulty level. Your opponents start with Monarch level units PLUS 1 archer and 1 settler
    To Enter the Competition:
    This competition will open at 00:01 am on 1 jun 2021, server local time (UTC-6:00). From that date and time, you'll be able to get your chosen starting save >>>here<<<.
    Submit the save after your victory (or defeat) here, by 1 jul 2021.
    Here is a link to a list of the differences between Vanilla, Warlords and BtS.
    Software Versions
    Windows: This game MUST be played in Beyond the Sword (NOT Civ4 Vanilla or Warlords), patched to version 3.19, and with the BUFFY mod version 3.19.005 installed. You can download the BUFFY mod here. Players using Windows Vista or Windows 7 are encouraged to read the notes on Vista fixes here.
    Macintosh: This game MUST be played in Beyond the Sword (NOT Civ4 Vanilla or Warlords), patched to version 3.19, and with the Mac BUFFY mod version 3.19.003 installed. You can download the Mac BUFFY mod here.
    While playing...
    Remember - for your entry to be accepted, it MUST be your first attempt to play this game, and you MUST NOT replay any turns. If you make a mistake while playing, you have to live with it, learn from it, and carry on the game without replaying.
    We will open 'spoiler' threads during the month for players to discuss what happens in their games. Do not discuss any details of your game outside those threads.
     
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  2. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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  3. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    :rockon: ...they should be in the HOF

    As much as I'd love to settle on a PH, it very hard not to have that FP cow in the BFC ..it's a great tile.

    Based on my fairly decent Great Plains knowledge, we are likely in the SW area of the map between the SW corner and the large body of water which is always in the SE. The area immediately surrounding this location is usually a bit meh...lots of plains, cows, maybe some gems...and very often horses are in the area. I'd not be surprised if horses are in the BFC.

    The SW corner usually has an abundance of FPs (and some gold) and given proximity may be worth moving a few turns- maybe an FP corn! woot...the best tile in the game

    NW area is usually rather food poor but lotsa commerce resources. The eastern area, past the mid-point of the map + some tiles, is usually lushly green with some jungle in the S near the water. Lots of pigs/deers/furs and no horses (only on the W side unless altered). Metals can be anywhere.

    Barbs can be a bit of a pain on this map, though the extra Ai helps.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2021
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  4. DynamicSpirit

    DynamicSpirit Fear him of the pink tie Moderator GOTM Staff

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    Settling on the plains-hill gives a worker in 12 turns. I can't see in the screenshot but I think the flood-plain cow will be 4F without improvement. If I'm correct then I make it that settling either 1N or 1NE gets you all four cows +gems in the BFC and a worker in 13 turns. I think I can live with a worker one turn later for the sake of the much better capital.

    You could alternatively go 2N, which means losing a turn moving and then building a worker 12 turns after settling. That looks very tempting since you still keep all the cows and have a small possibility of an extra resource to the North. I agree with @lymond about how the great-plains map normally works.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2021
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  5. Powerfaker

    Powerfaker Warlord

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    4- yield FP/cow tile offsets giving up PH hammer (after borderpop?). When pastured it's a 7-yield tile, so I think it's a must-have
    Add to that those 3 other 6-yield cow tiles, and you have a super productive cap. Maybe head for Writing before Bronze Working here ..........

    Pro+Totem Pole makes you wanna do something with X-bows, and use Phi trait to rush Engi, such a shame he starts with Fishing.

    I would expect an AI to start in the SW corner, and be our closest rival for land grabbing.

    Great Plains with modification.
    What is that mysteriously added phrase? Is that an existing map type, or something special added manually?
     
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  6. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Every AI will be landlocked on their own little island such that all of the barbs will target us.
     
  7. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Prince

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    That's some special mischief, courtesy of our mapmaker.

    I also hate to leave the PH, but agree that moving is better. Probably to NE instead of N, since it gets rid of the desert square (thinking very longterm!)

    Once our happiness cap has grown enough for the capital to work all of the cows and mine the gems and the other two hills, I'm thinking this map will call for cottages instead of farms on all of those plains. Lots of food and hammer, but we need more commerce!
     
  8. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Looks like a flood plain 2s2e of the gems also. With the warrior to the north who knows what settling south east might have in the fat cross. This looks like the better commerce location whereas to the north is a far better production site.

    settling south or south east has one other advantage, the eastern portion of the river will be within the cultural borders so that both cities to the north and cities to the west will automatically be connected by the river without any roads.
     
  9. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    IIRC, the gems are usually NE of center or simply east of center, so I'm thinking we're not that close to the SW corner. The lush green area should be just a little further east. But the mapmaker likely put water or mountain range between.
     
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  10. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Gems can def be left of center, but they do indicated a more central location usually. There's usually a concentration of hills in the center. FPs are rarer E of center.

    My guess is we are SW of center but maybe not as southernly as I thought. My reasoning for the SW quadrant is that it tends to be rather flat.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
  11. DynamicSpirit

    DynamicSpirit Fear him of the pink tie Moderator GOTM Staff

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    After reading this thread, I generated a few great-plains maps. One thing that struck me is that cows are very common in the North but much less common in the far South. Flood plains are much rarer outside the deep South, but it's not unknown to see a cluster of 3 of them in the NorthWest. Not so much the NorthEast. So, based on 4 cows in the starting position I think we're more likely to be in the North of the map, possibly slightly West towards the mountains. If that's the case, then finding other city locations after the capital that have much food is going to be tricky - we'll be surrounded by plains, cows, and the occasional wheat. But of course that's without knowing what changes the mapmaker has made to the map.

    Gems by the way are pretty rare - normally only one or two on the map, so starting next to them is quite a nice bonus.
     
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  12. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    I ran many maps just now and only once were the gems below the center line and that was at (11,15) on a map that’s (44,32). Your prediction seems most likely to me. Especially with only one forest tile visible.

    One interesting aspect of unmodified great plains I noticed is that all rivers on the entire map seem to drain into the southeast water body. With proper defogging and sailing one could theoretically connect to all AIs your cities.
     
  13. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    True, but I figured most of those FP's were edited in. I didn't think FP+cow happened naturally for example.
     
  14. DynamicSpirit

    DynamicSpirit Fear him of the pink tie Moderator GOTM Staff

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    Most of the maps I generated had one or two flood-plain-cows on them. It's not common - in the sense that you won't normally find more than one or two on the entire map, and some maps didn't have any, but they definitely do occur.

    It seems to me that the starting screenshot is generous - 4 cows and gems is pretty good - but there's nothing in it that couldn't occur naturally in flood plains, given a reasonably lucky map. So I suspect @kcd_swede's modifications are elsewhere on the map.
     
  15. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    On GP FP cow is not that uncommon. GP is a non-standard script btw. There's some odd resource/tile occurrences like desert cow and FP corns. You can also flat roll starts with no food resources, and actually no visible resources at all.

    My initial take on SW area was just by feel from rolling GP maps in the past, but as DS said, NW is possible here.

    But to be clear, what I really mean is that we are left of Center here, as saying NW or SW can be construed as the corners, which I did not mean. We know the uncooked far west on a GP map has lotsa forest, little food (except maybe SW), and a lot of commerce resources.

    There's usually a noticeable hill cluster in the center/right of center area which I don't see hint of here.

    edit: I think we are def left of center, but can't really say with certainty if N or S. Could be either N, Middle, or S
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
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  16. Powerfaker

    Powerfaker Warlord

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    The north(west?) part of the center would be the historically correct place to start for SB (of the Sioux?) right? If we project this on North America / US........
     
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  17. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    My observation was that the entire north to south central portion of the plains were sporadically dotted with floodplain tiles. If the gems tile was not added by the map maker then I think, like you said, that is the most significant indicator we have to go on.

    The only fantasy realm tile I managed to notice was one case of a spices on floodplain. Unless you want to include a cow on desert tile.
     
  18. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Now this is the fantasy:

    Spoiler best tile in the game (non-standard) :
     
  19. Qactus

    Qactus Romani ite domum

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    Ha, there even is a Mapfinder option to have it look for FP corn and cow (and Great Plains is probably the only HoF-valid mapscript that can feature these tiles:
    Spoiler :
    Mapfinder CowFP.png

    I don't think they're really that rare. I posted a fun always war map a while ago (https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/great-plains-always-war-emp-sumeria-nhne.651125/) that featured not one but two BFC floodplain corns. And that was generated by only rerolling a couple of times for a corner start (for AW defense).
     
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  20. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    Yeah, corn-FP is very common on this map.
     

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