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Nicolas Maduro Wins Venezuelan Presidency in Close Race

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by ReindeerThistle, Apr 14, 2013.

  1. ReindeerThistle

    ReindeerThistle Zimmerwald Left

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    I am not talking about guilt or innocence, I am talking about Capriles & co filing an election fraud claim. Whatever the case, why wouldn't they present it to the CNE instead of fire-bombing medical clinics?

    And what about the independent observers? Not a peep from them.

    What graphs would these be? I'm in the US, we don't see squat about the BRV elections here -- I.e. I don't have cable and ICN and CCTV come in sporadically.
     
  2. Ironsided

    Ironsided Flower of happiness

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    Mr. intellectual marvel, luiz, posted it earlier in this thread. Page 4.
     
  3. ReindeerThistle

    ReindeerThistle Zimmerwald Left

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    Not a game, why is it, after I present data, anti-Chavistas respond with vitriol and when I ask for data, none is presented and then I get a challenge.
    Read it and read it. Now, TLO, presenta la realidad, por favor.


    @PupzHaze -- Oh, THAT graph. That is a little comical. I thought it was luiz' idea of a joke, like TLO's people dressed as food.
     
  4. Ironsided

    Ironsided Flower of happiness

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    It's vocational pride for me, I know you will understand.
     
  5. ReindeerThistle

    ReindeerThistle Zimmerwald Left

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    I do. Thank you. On behalf of workmen everywhere, it is disconcerting to see intentiona, or accidental fudging of a graph like that.
     
  6. TheLastOne36

    TheLastOne36 Deity

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    I haven't been updating this thread as it seems to attract fascist sympathizers for some reason but, I'll give you a quick roundabout:

    * Another Venezuelan Senator begin shouted "Fascista! Fascista!" at Diosdado Cabello (President of the Assembly who is passing laws left and right without consent from the senate), he has subsequently been thrown into jail as a traitor without trial.

    * A top Chavista Military officer (not sure on ranking) resigned after refusing to take orders from Cuban superior officers.

    * Maduro told the truth about radicalizing the revolution and ruling with an iron fist. He has ordered the military to begin actively prosecuting Venezuelans protesting in the street. Venezuelans are being shot at by rubber bullets by the hundreds.

    * In addition to the above, the military is now under control of Cuban military officials. I guess we know now why there was 30-40,000 Cuban soldiers masquerading as teachers and doctors in Venezuela over the past few months.

    * Maduro has went back on his word to recount the votes, saying there is no point.

    * Minister of Labor has officially told that all government and labor workers who voted for Capriles are out of job, and are 'bastards', 'traitors' and 'gringos' that don't deserve any rights as Venezuelan citizens.


    I wait in anticipation on how people mean to defend all this.
     
  7. Cheezy the Wiz

    Cheezy the Wiz Socialist In A Hurry

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  8. ace99

    ace99 Deity

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    We're in conspiracy theory territory now. Cuba is clearly going to annex you and then conquer not just South America but the world. Right after the US is incorporated into the reborn Aztec Empire.
     
  9. TheLastOne36

    TheLastOne36 Deity

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    They were all reported live from Globovision, who is still up and running.

    Cuba has much more influence in Venezuela than you give them credit for. I've been saying it for months.

    Arguably one of the things that gave Capriles so much support from Venezuelans, is that he said that among the first things he'd do is kick all the illegal Cubans out of Venezuela.

    It also doesn't help that Maduro is dressed as Fidel Castro from his Bay of Pigs days....
     
  10. ReindeerThistle

    ReindeerThistle Zimmerwald Left

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    @TheLastOne: Any sources outside of an overtly hostile, US-backed TV station? According to your claims, then, 49% of Venezuela is out of a job, now. Good thing they have all of those social programs -- like FREE OF CHARGE health care, food distributions, job training....


    Okay, anyone have any reall news? I'll post more tonight, after the reactionaries are asleep.
     
  11. ace99

    ace99 Deity

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    Ahahaha.
     
  12. Azale

    Azale Deity

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    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/apr/22/united-states-contempt-venezuelan-democracy

    Ignore the tenor of the article, though I generally agree with Weisbrot. It seems like Capriles and the US are alone on wringing their hands over Maduro's election.

    Is there something I'm missing on how fraud would be carried out?
     
  13. BirraImperial

    BirraImperial Pura Vida!

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    I did heard on Globovision that employees from the Secretary of Sport of the state of Zulia that voted for Capriles would be fired. The Secretary of Sports was recorded saying this among other things, telling opposition members they should be "glad" that was the only measure that was being taken.
     
  14. Patroklos

    Patroklos Deity

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    You don't find it odd Maduro reversed himself on the recount and then destroyed the ballot records? You don't find his government backed violence distasteful? Nothing concerning legislatures antics bothers you?
     
  15. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    RT sees nothing wrong in North Korea, he thinks modern China is a socialist nation and is an admirer of Stalin.

    So no, he probably finds nothing of the above odd.

    -----

    Over here pretty much all the press and everybody who thinks has called the Venezuelan election a fraud. The same is no doubt true in all the rest of South American (in the countries that still have a free press, that is). So no, the US and Capriles are not alone in calling Maduro what he is, an illegitimate usurper.

    And I am not alone in calling Chavez apologists what they are, fascist sympathizers. Maduro is the living proof of the similarities of the far left and far right, all the way down to the details such as his dress code and military fetishism.

    So yeah, this thead is full of fascist sympathizers and TLO correctly stated. Luckily in the developed countries they are a tiny and pathetic minority reduced to whining on internet forums.
     
  16. JollyRoger

    JollyRoger Slippin' Jimmy Supporter

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    Is there any footage of a roll of tape being thrown?
     
  17. Azale

    Azale Deity

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    I think this is what jumping the shark on an internet forum looks like.
     
  18. Patroklos

    Patroklos Deity

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    I was talking to Azale, who bothers to reply to RT?
     
  19. Azale

    Azale Deity

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    1. Yea, it's weird. I don't like Maduro's theatrics in general, like I said before I think he is needlessly incendiary. I like Venezuela's poverty programs and some of the potential of the Chavista movement, but it remains to be seen where Maduro fits in to all this.

    I don't know anything about destroyed ballot records.

    2. I havn't read anything (from sources I trust) on government-backed violence in the streets, or opposition-backed violence for that matter.

    http://articles.latimes.com/2013/apr/17/world/la-fg-venezuela-violence-20130417
    http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2013/04/20134177162851301.html
    http://www.laht.com/article.asp?CategoryId=10717&ArticleId=751633

    If you're talking about the beating of the opposition deputies, the only thing you can do is unequivocally denounce it. It's stupid and thuggish, and if the PSUV and higher ups in the government do indeed support (though I don't think it was coordinated by them) that kind of behavior Maduro is off to a bad start.

    I hope the Venezuelan people find a way to keep the important progress from the Chavez years while being a watchdog on the overreach and excesses of the apparatchiks.

    3. Don't know enough about specifically what you're referring to. As a vague (And I'm sure frustrating) answer, Venezuela is still a third world country, I don't expect perfection. Legislative shenanigans frustrate me anywhere, it reminds me too much of Texas.

    Don't mistake me for someone who will apologize for the government though, I've just learned to be skeptical in situations like these.

    We should start a topic on Honduras or something so I feel less defensive :p
     
  20. ReindeerThistle

    ReindeerThistle Zimmerwald Left

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    QFT.
    The most entertaining thing is that I post data, links to independent media sources and the response I get is vitriol. I cite first-hand information from sources inside the country and in the BRV government, and I get accused of supporting fascism.

    Re: "defense of Stalin" -- save that for anoher thread, luiz. As for what I said about the DPRK -- all of it was citations from non-DPRK, non-communist sources, NONE of which was a defense of DPRK's nuclear posturing. I was pointing out historical data, of which there was much scuttlebutt.

    luiz, TLO, Patroklos et al post bullet points without citation or verification and this is okay with them. I spend about 12 - 14 hours a day organizing food and clothing distributions, working with low-income working people on budget plans to help them survive some very tough economic times and I fix homes for people who otherwise would not afford it. I also fight to keep people's utilities on and I often have to go against some powerful monied interests and the government agencies who work for those monied interests, and I do it WITHOUT PAY. I will tell you that the hundreds of people I deal with daily know a lot more about the effects of current US policy than any organizer, and certainly more than many of he reactionary posters on this thread and in this forum.
    100% of the people I deal with have absolutely only good things to say about he BRV, Chavez and the Bolivaia Revolution. I am certain I talk to more working people than luiz does.

    So, if any posters or lurkers on this thread take a look back at my posts, versus luiz, TheLastOne36, Patroklos, et al, reactions, ou can judge for yourself.
     

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