NiGHTS: General Discussion

[markusbeutel]

Is it intended that barbarians start as horse archer?

Part of update v9.5 allows barbarians to start off the game with Brutes/Spearmen/Archers/Horsemen/Swordsmen.

Your automatic bonus towards barbs still applies, and it's possible for a warrior to take down a barbarian swordsman or horseman if you're strategically placed. This shouldn't have a huge impact on gameplay - but it will make barbs more of a threat as opposed to just being a nuisance.

They're more or less taking the part of animals from CIV IV now, (units with varying degrees of strength/movement), and should help liven up the early game.

If you came across a barb horse archer, it would have been a horseman that's been upgraded through a goody hut. Specific Tech's now make these early barb units obsolete, (listed in the Tech tool-tips), which should add another layer of strategy to early tech choices.

Like the play more and more.. Finding really makes you thinks and not only bam-bam fight

That's my hope/goal. This also has an impact on AI Civ's, as there should be more instances of captured workers/settlers, allowing diplomacy to get an early foothold in the game, (if you choose to return the captured units).

 

[V. Soma]

playing 9.5 for two hours, I love it

no crash, no bug, just lovely game so far...

 

[riddleofsteel]

I guess I shouldn't have turned on raging barbarians, then... Makes a Warlord game much more difficult.

 

[bigstuff777]

well its only cause of the darn horsemen that have 4 moves and slay warriors in one hit.
IMHO the horse are over kill. i had a horsemen attack my city at tern 15 lost a warrior and killed it with a other warrior. well that's all find and dandy but another hit me 2 terns later so now i have 2 workers one can stay in the city other is dead and the 3rd horsemen show up at this point its ridiculousness they baby guard my city so i build a warrior he dies hurting it and rinse and repeat next thing you know 30 terns are gone and i may as well start over so please the horsemen would be fine 100 terns in on epic but at 15 is ludicrous.

 

[riddleofsteel]

Yeah, I had a hell of a time building the Great Wall while barbarian horsemen kept razing my stone quarries. That was touch and go trying to finish the wonder.

 

[bigstuff777]

well it was fun fighting off hoards of barbarians warriors but now its just aggravating. would be one thing if they were properly introduced by a time line but just not going to play a game that's going to zerg me with str 10 units and vary frequently. at tern 1-75 epic at least. Now I am sure maybe there are some ppl jumping for joy over this... but its dun took the fun out of it for me . ill keep checking back but done for now.

 

[riddleofsteel]

It is quite the obstacle.

 

[black213]

Let me start by saying that i love your mod.
I started a few games on king and had multiple Civs enter the classical era before i researched my first tech. it happened enough so, that i thought it might be normal for your mod a way to even things out.
I than started a game on Prince all standard options, continents plus, and got this Screenie. I count myself a fairly good player with over 400 hours logged in the game but im not sure ill be able to defeat longswordsman on turn 12. Actually, i probably could but still i thought you might be interested to see this I assume its from goodie huts and hopefully a fluke
anyways great work

Hmm, I also noticed Hiawatha having a LS early in the ancient era. Perhaps related to Hiawatha only?

 

[markusbeutel]

playing 9.5 for two hours, I love it

no crash, no bug, just lovely game so far...

I guess I shouldn't have turned on raging barbarians, then... Makes a Warlord game much more difficult.

well its only cause of the darn horsemen that have 4 moves and slay warriors in one hit.
IMHO the horse are over kill. i had a horsemen attack my city at tern 15 lost a warrior and killed it with a other warrior. well that's all find and dandy but another hit me 2 terns later so now i have 2 workers one can stay in the city other is dead and the 3rd horsemen show up at this point its ridiculousness they baby guard my city so i build a warrior he dies hurting it and rinse and repeat next thing you know 30 terns are gone and i may as well start over so please the horsemen would be fine 100 terns in on epic but at 15 is ludicrous.

well it was fun fighting off hoards of barbarians warriors but now its just aggravating. would be one thing if they were properly introduced by a time line but just not going to play a game that's going to zerg me with str 10 units and vary frequently. at tern 1-75 epic at least. Now I am sure maybe there are some ppl jumping for joy over this... but its dun took the fun out of it for me . ill keep checking back but done for now.

It is quite the obstacle.

I'll come up with a solution to make this a little bit more balanced in the early going. Thanks for the feedback everyone.

Hmm, I also noticed Hiawatha having a LS early in the ancient era. Perhaps related to Hiawatha only?

I'll look into this - seems strange how the problem's limited to Hiawatha.

 

[looorg]

I'm not sure if is just a tooltip thing or not but Tradition:Legalism, it's halfway down in tradition and it's supposed to give you a culture building for free in your first four cities. I only get it in three cities, usually you already have a monument in your first city by the time you reach this tech so in the first city you really get nothing. The free thing isn't pushed onto your fifth city either due to not getting anything in the first. Also for a while I think i misread this tooltip cause I somehow mixed up "free" with no maintenance but it still cost maintenance, you just don't have to build it. But that is somewhat besides the point.

More barbarians is awesome. With the swordmen camps they live for a bit longer since they are somewhat harder to dislodge. I run with raging barbs. That is what makes the inital few hundred rounds (yes, i only run marathon games) or so interesting before you can really start pushing them back.

 

[markusbeutel]

I'm not sure if is just a tooltip thing or not but Tradition:Legalism, it's halfway down in tradition and it's supposed to give you a culture building for free in your first four cities. I only get it in three cities, usually you already have a monument in your first city by the time you reach this tech so in the first city you really get nothing. The free thing isn't pushed onto your fifth city either due to not getting anything in the first. Also for a while I think i misread this tooltip cause I somehow mixed up "free" with no maintenance but it still cost maintenance, you just don't have to build it. But that is somewhat besides the point.

More barbarians is awesome. With the swordmen camps they live for a bit longer since they are somewhat harder to dislodge. I run with raging barbs. That is what makes the inital few hundred rounds (yes, i only run marathon games) or so interesting before you can really start pushing them back.

I'm using the "official" tool-tip from the base game - which I agree could be worded a little bit better, and probably will be in future updates. It's also a policy that seems to be a little bit on the glitchy side, (along with the vanilla free GP policy), but I'll leave it in the game for now.

As for the barbs, personally I like the change, but I think it's going to be a dividing issue among the aggressive vs builder play-styles. I'll probably end up doing something with the Horseman to reduce their overall impact, while leaving the rest of the starting barbs in tact. The thing to remember is that you can obsolete any of them from re-spawning by choosing the appropriate techs.

 

[riddleofsteel]

@ markusbeutel, don't take my words too hard. I'm a noob even though I've been playing civ games for years. So the heavy-duty barbarians hitting so early on was a big hurdle. For other people it might be huge fun. I also had raging barbarians on, so that made it more noticeable.

 

[markusbeutel]

@ markusbeutel, don't take my words too hard. I'm a noob even though I've been playing civ games for years. So the heavy-duty barbarians hitting so early on was a big hurdle. For other people it might be huge fun. I also had raging barbarians on, so that made it more noticeable.

No worries riddleofsteel - they're a tad overpowered at the moment, and I'll look at either cutting their movement or strength for the next update to avoid any completely game-breaking early scenarios.

 

[Fabiano79]

Thank you! Im having one of my most fun games on ciV since I bought it months ago. I really liked the culture revolution concept and the new tech tree.

For sure theres still some problems, one turn Im getting +12 gold the next one Im losing -15. I guess some tweaks are needed.

But, congrats! Job well done!

 

[Karantaner]

I'm still playing my 9.4 game and encountered something odd: sometimes I cannot enter the territory of a CS - it is just not possible. Only if i have friendly relations with that CS I can enter its territory. But with other CS I can always enter - quite strange. Is this a new feature?

In my current game I play again on King and have again obscene happiness: +660 in 1913. I really enjoy your Mod - all the games make much more fun!!!

 

[markusbeutel]

Thank you! Im having one of my most fun games on ciV since I bought it months ago. I really liked the culture revolution concept and the new tech tree.

For sure theres still some problems, one turn Im getting +12 gold the next one Im losing -15. I guess some tweaks are needed.

But, congrats! Job well done!

You're welcome. I've probably enjoyed making it just as much as people enjoy playing it.

Gold is probably one of the tougher elements to balance, but overall I've tried to guide the economy in this version of the mod towards initial tile improvements in the early era's, and then towards buildings and policies later on. With good tech/policy choices, you shouldn't have too much trouble with gold in the long run.

It will also probably take a little bit of time to familiarize yourself with the tech tree and policies, (what routes to take), and these will all be undergoing small checks/balances over the coming weeks/months. If you find you are having trouble with gold, I'd suggest playing the one of the Financial/Organized Civ's, as their bonuses can make a huge difference in a game.

I'm still playing my 9.4 game and encountered something odd: sometimes I cannot enter the territory of a CS - it is just not possible. Only if i have friendly relations with that CS I can enter its territory. But with other CS I can always enter - quite strange. Is this a new feature?

In my current game I play again on King and have again obscene happiness: +660 in 1913. I really enjoy your Mod - all the games make much more fun!!!

Yep - those kinds of numbers don't surprise me for v9.4. 9.5 has leveled those numbers out a little bit, but if you play a charismatic leader, you should still easily get to around half of that in peaceful games by the later eras.

I haven't encountered that particular bug involving city-states and it shouldn't be happening. Has anyone else experienced this? I'd guide you towards the install instructions, but you've been playing NiGHTS for awhile so I'm assuming you've already done them.


I'm currently working on a small update - nothing major, just adding trait text back to the loading screens and adding tool-tips to techs that obsolete specific buildings. I'll start taking on a number/letter system with these small updates, so expect 9.5b to appear sometime later tonight.

I'm also working on reducing the size of the mod so it can be uploaded to the Mod Browser, but this won't happen anytime soon as loads of art assets have to be merged before that can work.

No one's mentioned anything along those lines regarding CS's in 9.5, so maybe/hopefully it's just an isolated bug.

 

[christos200]

One question. Do you need the DLC's to play this mod.

 

[markusbeutel]

One question. Do you need the DLC's to play this mod.

You do not. However, if you have purchased them, they are available in-game, (except the Wonder DLC's, as modded versions of these have been included instead).

 

[looorg]

No one's mentioned anything along those lines regarding CS's in 9.5, so maybe/hopefully it's just an isolated bug.

I probably forgot how Civ5 was pre this mod so I don't even know if that wasn't in the game. But that has been in the mod for quite a long time I think, it just never really bothered me. If a citystate is really angry with you (even tho not at war) they don't allow you to walk across their land. I have not checked in 9.5 if its there.

Come to think of it there are other weird things that I don't know how long they been there, if forever. Like not being able to "unclick" open borders if you add it into a trade proposal. To clearify I can unlick it from my part of the window but I can never adjust it in "his" (as in the opponents) window. That is very annoying.

Also today for some reason I tried a game with the MAX amount of civs available (24 or whatever), you get doubles of some civs then if you don't have the DLC. So I had two France, one acted normal when you spoke to them as in "Traditionalist .. blahblah Napolean" while the extra one presented himself as "I am ERROR. Napoleon of France".

 

[Karantaner]

Also today for some reason I tried a game with the MAX amount of civs available (24 or whatever), you get doubles of some civs then if you don't have the DLC. So I had two France, one acted normal when you spoke to them as in "Traditionalist .. blahblah Napolean" while the extra one presented himself as "I am ERROR. Napoleon of France".

I had this message in my diplo-screen as well. I think with Gandhi and with the Inca. But I play on a regular map, standard size.