NiGHTS: General Discussion

Nope, this was a new game started with 9.6b :sad:

I tried loading it but got the runtime error and ctd - did you follow the complete install instructions when installing 9.6b? Any autosaves?

It's always annoying when you lose a game - I'm still not sure what could be causing these crashes. Hopefully after I release 9.7 they'll stop cropping up.
 
Started over, ran 408turns (with my usual setup of fractal world, huge map, max civs and states, emperor, quick combat, raging barbs, marathon speed) of 9.6b and no crashes here. Is there something you are building or doing right before the crash?
 
Na fresh 9.6b install ..deleted cetch files ....deleted stuff in mod user data. verified and defraged .....

for me i was at war with the Aztecs and wooping them on immortal they had so many units but walking mindless into my archers and chariot archers they were vary unhappy having that many units and citys and all i can guess was the AI* must have got pissed and corrupted the game file lol ...

Is there a way I can make my save game smaller so I can post it here?

so you can try and figure this crash out cause I have it were right when you end the tern it go for a few civs terns then makes a funny eeerr sound and then ..not responding. then it comes back on for a few seconds (sound) and (world spinning) then secs later sound go's again but this time for good.
few mins later windows gives a message that civ 5 is not working (end task)
 
Is crop rotation working? The bonus states each city gets +2 apples, but when I take it, nothing seems to happen. I had a city that had 0 growth, and had 0 growth after. When I look at the numbers, I don't see the food being added to the supply. Is it not listed as a bonus but just takes effect? If so, seems like it should have made my stable city grow again.
 
Started over, ran 408turns (with my usual setup of fractal world, huge map, max civs and states, emperor, quick combat, raging barbs, marathon speed) of 9.6b and no crashes here. Is there something you are building or doing right before the crash?

I've played around 300 in my current testing game and haven't experienced any either. I think when I released 9.6b so quickly back-to-back with 9.6 there's a chance some people didn't do some of the install steps and/or continued saves with 9.6b that they started in 9.6.

Na fresh 9.6b install ..deleted cetch files ....deleted stuff in mod user data. verified and defraged .....

for me i was at war with the Aztecs and wooping them on immortal they had so many units but walking mindless into my archers and chariot archers they were vary unhappy having that many units and citys and all i can guess was the AI* must have got pissed and corrupted the game file lol ...

Is there a way I can make my save game smaller so I can post it here?

so you can try and figure this crash out cause I have it were right when you end the tern it go for a few civs terns then makes a funny eeerr sound and then ..not responding. then it comes back on for a few seconds (sound) and (world spinning) then secs later sound go's again but this time for good.
few mins later windows gives a message that civ 5 is not working (end task)

I have had that happen a few times in vanilla games on large map sizes where you get this weird sound followed by a ctd - but that turned out to be a case of a corrupted ram stick. If you zip the save is it still too large?

Is crop rotation working? The bonus states each city gets +2 apples, but when I take it, nothing seems to happen. I had a city that had 0 growth, and had 0 growth after. When I look at the numbers, I don't see the food being added to the supply. Is it not listed as a bonus but just takes effect? If so, seems like it should have made my stable city grow again.

That policy adds the food straight to the center city tile - so if your city was at 3 food, (the normal starting value), it would have turned into the larger food symbol representing 5 food. It's possible at this point your citizens re-aligned themselves to continue working at their previous pace which would have offset any food gains unless you manually reposition them.

It should show up as food you get from terrain.
 
well could only seem to get it to compress and add to attachments with a rar file hope that's not a prob. (shrug) maybe you can find the root of the prob? file was in moddedsaves folder View attachment 299641

I'll take a look at it.

Version 9.7 released to http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=16650 and now AVAILABLE on the in-game ModBrowser.

So a funny thing happened - I've been merging/combining artwork, and every once in awhile I'll try uploading to the ModBrowser, expecting it not to work. This time it did. This update doesn't include any changes to Governments - that's coming this weekend, as I wasn't actually planning on releasing quite yet... C'est la vie.

Changelog
  • Implemented new Policy Screen artwork by OrsonM.
  • Spearmen now obsolete with Pikeman and not earlier.
  • Fixed tool-tips regarding previous changes to certain Governments on the Policy screen
  • Merged artwork - some custom icon artwork has temporarily been removed to get the size of the mod down enough to upload to the ModBrowser.
  • The version on the ModBrowser, (and the one posted here) - are now listed as 97, or 9.7, as the MB doesn't allow decimal places.
  • If ever in doubt, the version posted here on CivFanatics will be the most up-to-date.
  • Some Wonders have been removed/altered for ones that have better art compression , but the benefits they grant have remained the same for these new Wonders.
  • Removed Temple of Artemis, Mausoleum, International Space Station -> replaced with Alhambra, Temple of Solomon, and the Sky Tower.

IMPORTANT: DOWNLOAD/INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS!
1. Delete any previous versions of the mod from C:\<username>\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 5\MODS
2. Download and copy file into C:\<username>\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 5\MODS
3. Delete your cache folder in C:\<username>\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 5\cache
4. Delete the contents of the ModUserData folder in C:\<username>\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 5\ModUserData
5. Verify your cache and defrag your CIV V files through Steam (right click, properties, local files, verify integrity.
6. Make sure your game is up to date with Patch 1.0.1.383!
7. Load CIV V and click Install button in the ModBrowser.

All of this merging and combining should be to the mods benefit, and you shouldn't experience any crashes with this latest version. Eventually, all of the current vanilla building icons will be replaced with custom ones. This current process is purely to get the mod out there to as many people as possible who perhaps aren't familiar with CivFanatics, (if that's even possible). :)
 
Nice job man getting it uploaded to the ModBrowser!

On a sidenote how often does it happen to you guys another civ's settlers beats your to build a city on the perfect spot by 1 turn? :cry:
 
Hello,

let me start by saying that version 9 and onward has been a real pleasure to play!
Techs and policies are very well thought out and fairly balanced. The improvments to barbarians in 9.4 are awesome, really makes you struggle in the beginning.

The biggest flaw with the mod is that it gets too easy about halfway through, after you "win" (meaning the AI has no real chance of beating you in combat anymore) you still have to play 100 turns or more to actually get a victory. This is of course a problem in vanilla civ too.

A few bugs and things that might be too overpowered, imo: (in a 9.5 game, Continents, Standard size, Immortal, Standard speed)

- I still got the Logistics promotion for free in my capital. Possibly from the wonder that add a free Black Market? (forgot name of the wonder) - This bug alone made the game a bit too easy, two chariot archers could conquer cities easily.
- Somewhere around 100-150 turns in you get too much gold, probably it's when you get up a few Markets. When you get 500+ GPT you can easily buy yourself out of problems, ie buying Walls in a city that gets attacked, buying units. Or buying a Harbor, Docks and a couple of fishish boats in a newly settled coastal town, and it goes from nothing to powerful in 1 turn. Also you can of course pay all CS to ally, meaning more food/culture/happiness.
- It's too easy to get a really high Happiness. The AI might struggle, since it usually builds alot of units, but I can always win with as little as 3-5 units, even in the endgame. (One of the reasons Alpacas old PWM was so fun, with NO healing to units it really changed how you build units).
- AI gives up war a bit too easy, and gives way too much in their peace offerings. This could be different for different leaders i suppose, but in my game i was fighting Japan, and when i had the upper hand (had taken two of his cities) he gave me all his 6 remaining cities except the capital. It would have taken me more than 10 turns to conquer those 6 cities, and after the 10 turns of peace i attacked his capital, so he just speeded up his demise.
- Too easy taking cities, i guess since the defence upgrades are quite costly now, the AI doesn't build alot (or he doesnt research the techs needed). Even in endgame cities often had 20-30, sometimes 40 strength. With just one cannon (with logistics, the gamebreaker...) i reduce that to zero in one, max two turns. In the first 150-200 turns i didnt even need siege, just the two chariot archers and a swordsman and/or knight.
- I had +100% Golden Age length, not sure why. 50% came from the Sphinx (which by the way might also be overpowered, i never researched Divine Right, easy to skip that one since it's a dead end.) but the other 50% i dont know. Maybe from the Chichen Itza? Tooltip doesn't say, it's just a guess since it's in vanilla. The 100% bonus meant i was in a constant GA the last ~100 turns of the game, since i could just keep it up with specialists (first specialist 16 turns of GA, next 14 etc).
- Might need to up the cost of some mid- to endgame wonders. My first playthrough (on 9.0 and 9.2) was with Catherine, and the +50% made it a bit too easy (good change there!). This last game was with Bismarck, i figured i could use the defence bonus at start vs the new Barbs, but still wanted a wonder trait of course! Anyway, i could still build wonders a bit too fast towards the end.
- Like others have mentioned, Monarchy is too good, no other is even close. The only reason i picked something else twice during my last game was that my capital didnt become the Origin city of the revolution (is this random?), but my second city did, which was a city with horrible production. This forced me to pick something else, i took the "free policy" once and "75% lower upgrade cost" once (since i was about to research rifleman and cannon, so knew i had some upgrading soon)

But like i said, i enjoyed it alot! Just trying to help improve it even more :)
Also i really like the change to tile improvements, that you always get +3. That was one of the biggest flaws in vanilla civ imo, since it didn't matter much when you placed cities. Well done!

I see that you have released new versions, so i guess it's time to fire up a new game! Hmm... which civ to play this time?

ps. I attached my endsave if you wanted to check anything, it's on the turn where i win by Diplomacy (standard win for me, since it's always the fastest, and the game has been sorta boring for 100 turns, but i still want to finish... stupid game has that influence on me, hehe)
 

Attachments

  • Bismarck_0282 AD-1824.Civ5Save
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Nice job man getting it uploaded to the ModBrowser!

On a sidenote how often does it happen to you guys another civ's settlers beats your to build a city on the perfect spot by 1 turn? :cry:

This would have happened to me earlier today, but I decided an early war would be less detrimental. :)

Hello,

let me start by saying that version 9 and onward has been a real pleasure to play!
Techs and policies are very well thought out and fairly balanced. The improvments to barbarians in 9.4 are awesome, really makes you struggle in the beginning.

The biggest flaw with the mod is that it gets too easy about halfway through, after you "win" (meaning the AI has no real chance of beating you in combat anymore) you still have to play 100 turns or more to actually get a victory. This is of course a problem in vanilla civ too.

A few bugs and things that might be too overpowered, imo: (in a 9.5 game, Continents, Standard size, Immortal, Standard speed)

- I still got the Logistics promotion for free in my capital. Possibly from the wonder that add a free Black Market? (forgot name of the wonder) - This bug alone made the game a bit too easy, two chariot archers could conquer cities easily.
- Somewhere around 100-150 turns in you get too much gold, probably it's when you get up a few Markets. When you get 500+ GPT you can easily buy yourself out of problems, ie buying Walls in a city that gets attacked, buying units. Or buying a Harbor, Docks and a couple of fishish boats in a newly settled coastal town, and it goes from nothing to powerful in 1 turn. Also you can of course pay all CS to ally, meaning more food/culture/happiness.
- It's too easy to get a really high Happiness. The AI might struggle, since it usually builds alot of units, but I can always win with as little as 3-5 units, even in the endgame. (One of the reasons Alpacas old PWM was so fun, with NO healing to units it really changed how you build units).
- AI gives up war a bit too easy, and gives way too much in their peace offerings. This could be different for different leaders i suppose, but in my game i was fighting Japan, and when i had the upper hand (had taken two of his cities) he gave me all his 6 remaining cities except the capital. It would have taken me more than 10 turns to conquer those 6 cities, and after the 10 turns of peace i attacked his capital, so he just speeded up his demise.
- Too easy taking cities, i guess since the defence upgrades are quite costly now, the AI doesn't build alot (or he doesnt research the techs needed). Even in endgame cities often had 20-30, sometimes 40 strength. With just one cannon (with logistics, the gamebreaker...) i reduce that to zero in one, max two turns. In the first 150-200 turns i didnt even need siege, just the two chariot archers and a swordsman and/or knight.
- I had +100% Golden Age length, not sure why. 50% came from the Sphinx (which by the way might also be overpowered, i never researched Divine Right, easy to skip that one since it's a dead end.) but the other 50% i dont know. Maybe from the Chichen Itza? Tooltip doesn't say, it's just a guess since it's in vanilla. The 100% bonus meant i was in a constant GA the last ~100 turns of the game, since i could just keep it up with specialists (first specialist 16 turns of GA, next 14 etc).
- Might need to up the cost of some mid- to endgame wonders. My first playthrough (on 9.0 and 9.2) was with Catherine, and the +50% made it a bit too easy (good change there!). This last game was with Bismarck, i figured i could use the defence bonus at start vs the new Barbs, but still wanted a wonder trait of course! Anyway, i could still build wonders a bit too fast towards the end.
- Like others have mentioned, Monarchy is too good, no other is even close. The only reason i picked something else twice during my last game was that my capital didnt become the Origin city of the revolution (is this random?), but my second city did, which was a city with horrible production. This forced me to pick something else, i took the "free policy" once and "75% lower upgrade cost" once (since i was about to research rifleman and cannon, so knew i had some upgrading soon)

But like i said, i enjoyed it alot! Just trying to help improve it even more :)
Also i really like the change to tile improvements, that you always get +3. That was one of the biggest flaws in vanilla civ imo, since it didn't matter much when you placed cities. Well done!

I see that you have released new versions, so i guess it's time to fire up a new game! Hmm... which civ to play this time?

ps. I attached my endsave if you wanted to check anything, it's on the turn where i win by Diplomacy (standard win for me, since it's always the fastest, and the game has been sorta boring for 100 turns, but i still want to finish... stupid game has that influence on me, hehe)

Thanks for the report Toor. :) I think I've managed to tackle a decent amount of these points in 9.6/9.7.

Logistics has been removed as a free promotion. (I thought I had removed it in 9.5, but had actually only removed the tool-tip).

Gold maintenance costs have been ramped up considerably from the Renaissance era onwards. This will be a work in progress to balance correctly. (Early vanilla versions of the game had inflation for buildings/units, but this mechanic has since been removed from what I can tell - and this plays a large part in why late-era values start to become unbalanced).

Happiness has been scaled back a bit, but this still needs work. It's difficult to balance this over different map types and game speeds, but I'd rather it be too high than too low at this point.

Happiness ties into Golden Ages, and the Spiritual trait that boosts these has been reduced by 50% which should limit the end game 30+ turn Golden Ages that were occurring. Again, a work in progress.

I've also boosted the values of City defenses and initial City strength - but these will probably need further buffing as I've noticed it can still be too easy, especially if an AI focuses on other areas of the game and ignores city defense.

Catherine's trait has been reduced to +30%, (with the minor industrious trait reduced to +15%), which takes her down a notch. She also previously had the major +1 Happiness Charismatic trait which has also been halved to +0.5. This alone will have a huge impact on overall happiness values in a game. Also, annex/puppet costs have been increased in 9.6/9.7 which also helps reign in overall happiness to some extent.

Finally, Governments in general are going to get quite a bit of work leading up to this weekend's release. I'm planning on adding some negative modifiers to certain governments to scale back their overall effectiveness - and overall effects in general are going to be tweaked quite a bit.

That's great that you're enjoying it up till now despite some of these drawbacks. I'm looking forward to going through your save and comparing the results to my test games as this is probably the most effective way for me to achieve proper balance in the mod, (since I don't always have the time to do complete playthroughs while balancing school/work/schoolwork.) :goodjob:
 
I would also point out that Alpaca's PWM mod was great
having units not healing via insta heal promotion..
also, units had 20 HP and slow healing.

Player had to build units for supply, it kinda made the AI a better opponent,
as it evened out AI weakness in unit planning
 
I would also point out that Alpaca's PWM mod was great
having units not healing via insta heal promotion..
also, units had 20 HP and slow healing.

Player had to build units for supply, it kinda made the AI a better opponent,
as it evened out AI weakness in unit planning

I'll try these settings in a test game and see how they play out. My only worry is that it's probably easier to pump out troops in NiGHTS with increased production, (as opposed to vanilla CIV V), and I wouldn't want to increase the chances of carpets-of-doom with the increased Unit HP.

Removing insta-heal though, that's a definate possibility. What do other people think about this?
 
I dont agree with Removing insta-heal.
 
ood i started a 9.7 game and i am getting +1000 culture per tern ! lol this cant be intended i got like 6 or 7 policies the first tern!

yeah insta heal do not even make sence as a promotion(promotion) means a upgrade of state.. and intsta heal is not a upgrade to a unit at all its a cheap and stupid thing built to give a noob a second chance on a mistake if there were to be some thing that functions the same i would like to see it not be a promotion at all and some thing that you can buy for a unit... or better yet make a healer class ...shaman..witch doctor...medics...that's kinda thing have them have groovie healing rates and heals for gold...prob a lot of gold heh OR it could be a siege weapon called a healer tent ! yeah you would have to set it up like a catapult and it would raise you healing rate but it should not heal the same tern it got set up in.... the model should be a wagon or jeep depending on era and when it sets up it terns in to a tent with a red cross on it... lol i think that would be neat!
 
ood i started a 9.7 game and i am getting +1000 culture per tern ! lol this cant be intended i got like 6 or 7 policies the first tern!

argg. That was from using washington to test out some policies... Will upload a fix... Thanks for finding this so quickly bigstuff777 - would've been annoying to wake up to this and not have time to upload a fix before work. :)

EDIT: Fixed in CivFanatics version 9.7 http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=16650 - also fixed on the ModBrowser version.
 
I wouldn't mind removing instant heal from units - but I guess it would make the AI even weaker in combat...

Yesterday I started a new game (Kind level) and the start was quite funny: Alexander and Monte started an early war (I think in turn 30) and Monte already had an huge army: 2 pikeman (!!), some swordsman and some of his Jaguars!! He crushed Alexander within 25 turns - and now Monte is my neighbour... doesn't look so good for my pathetic army :)
I do hope he will stay peaceful because I built too many cities and now do not have the happiness left to improve my armed forces right away....
 
I'll try these settings in a test game and see how they play out. My only worry is that it's probably easier to pump out troops in NiGHTS with increased production, (as opposed to vanilla CIV V), and I wouldn't want to increase the chances of carpets-of-doom with the increased Unit HP.

Removing insta-heal though, that's a definate possibility. What do other people think about this?

Removing insta heal works TOGETHER with higher HP (say, 20) AND slower healing.

In PWM production was also increased, that was not a problem ;)
Just try it out, Markus, and see how it feels :)
As I remember, it was fairly well accepted by players of the PWM mod...
 
Removing insta heal works TOGETHER with higher HP (say, 20) AND slower healing.

In PWM production was also increased, that was not a problem ;)
Just try it out, Markus, and see how it feels :)
As I remember, it was fairly well accepted by players of the PWM mod...

Also, as you remember, he disabled upgrading of units completely. This together with slow healing (1/turn everywhere, even in cities. Medic promotion removed aswell) meant you had to keep building new units, and that existing old units that had gotten good promotions could still be useful, but not overpowered like they usually get in vanilla (and Nights) since players can keep their units alive, but AI often doesn't.
 
Hi Mark--just wanted to chime in with my latest game in 9b. Iam not sure what info is helpful in giving feedback. Played Nappy on continents. Riam out early leading with resources, gold especially and conquering. I trialed.
I decided to go for globalization win. Bottom line on turn 326 Riam had 90K in gold (1031 per turn)
On my end i had 20K gold (315 gpt) with some from selling a few buildings. This should have been a slam dunk for Riam. So I made as many allies as i could one turn before last vote reversing some of Riam's allies. Riam never responded to one up me before his last chance and lost when he was clearly dominant.
Is this a glitch? exploit? etc. Just wanted to throw this in the refinement process. The AI does not seem to quickly respond to the UN end game and max his buying votes making him thw winner.
 
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