No more....DLC!!!

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by Alex Khan, Jun 26, 2016.

  1. Plus Ultra

    Plus Ultra Conquistador

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    Count me in on the Pro-DLC side.

    DLC's allow for companies to maximize their profit by having different prices for each customer.
    As long as the released game is perfectly functional and finished, as in not missing any required pieces or a conclusion, there is nothing wrong about that.

    Think about it, completely optional extra content for those that want to spend more.

    Its the same thing with Cars. Buy the basic model (which works perfectly fine) or go crazy with the extras if you wish to spend more on your vehicle.
    Having "one price, one game, no DLC" would mean the game has too much content for some (and therefore, not worth the extra prize), and too little for others (with no hope for new content).
    How is that better? Should we go back to this?:

    Any customer can have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black.
    -Henry Ford
     
  2. Socrates99

    Socrates99 Bottoms up!

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    I feel the same way. I honestly can't think of a single game I've spent $10 on that I've sunk even 20 hours into let alone 100. I've put thousands of hours into CiV. In the long run a game with massive replayability like Civ saves me money even if it's expensive.

    As far as DLC goes, just wait for a Steam flash sale. You can usually get great discounts up to 75% off if you're patient. Most DLC, even the civs, isn't important enough that you can't wait for a sale.
     
  3. Stilgar08

    Stilgar08 Emperor

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    I'm kind of devided here since I try to neglect dlcs. My way of dealing with it is usually not buying DLC until much later when you get them thrown at you for a penny.
    Concerning CivVI buying the digital deluxe version including the first 4 dlcs was my solution (at a decent discount, too)...

    To me Khan is right stating that occasionally DLCs are nothing more than upselling crap (XCOM2 - children of the revolution - C'mon!) but if you don't want the crap don't buy it - simple. I perordered CivVI which I usually never do and I never bought a dlc as a preorder, always waited for reactions if it's worth it - sometimes it isn't, really...

    It's a different quality if mechanics were left out of vanilla and then reincluded via expansions which are completely different things to me! You can play fine without having the Netherlands as civ (no offense!) but without BNW CiV was a pain in the youknowwhat from what I've heard...
     
  4. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    enjoyment it brings purchaser=amount they should be willing to pay*

    difficulty for developer/expected purchasers=amount they should be willing to sell

    (both approximate)

    *not the amount they Should pay... if you can get it legitimately for 10c, that's good. (even if its worth $100,000 to you)


    I did not buy civ 5 until I got it and ALL DLC for the 50$, (mostly since I had computer issues with it, as well as limited time to play) I have got less enjoyment out than if I spent the $200 for everything up front, but then I was able to spend the time not playing civ on other enjoyable things like foruming about civ.
     
  5. historix69

    historix69 Emperor

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    I preordered Civ5, G&K and BNW via amazon ... for the DLCs I waited for a 75%-Steam-sale ... I have the impression that the content of an add-on for 30 Euro can be easily split into DLCs for 50 Euro ... If the devs have lots of ideas to add new civs, buildings, wonders, mechanics, I don't mind if they release 3 addons for Civ6 ... but please do not release dozens of relative expansive DLCs like Paradox ... I usually go for complete versions of a game and if you have a base game, 2-3 addons and 50 DLCs which overlap with the addons it becomes very complicated and confusing ...
     
  6. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    Those two factors are both reasonable (although difficulty of development is very hard to judge). But they do not define what a product should cost unless the two values are coincidentally the same.
     
  7. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

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    Per my econ 101 class, the cost value of a product is no more than the majority of customers is willing to pay, and no less than the producer is willing to sell it for.
     
  8. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    Right (although complicated by the fact that the cost of the game is variable by the nature of Steam sales). But I wasn't asking what the product could reasonably cost. My question was in response to the statement "Just because something can provide lots of entertainment doesn't mean you should pay a large amount for it."

    So my question is, supposing the consumer would gain more from the entertainment of the game than the loss of money, what other factor would make it so the price isn't what the consumer "should" pay? Or to put it another way, why should a consumer be unwilling to pay the price for something that would be more than worth the price?

    And I was kind of specifically asking that one poster to get an idea what they were thinking about. Hearing other people's opinions would also be useful, though.
     
  9. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    The price will be between those two values (except for people that shouldn't buy the product)


    also the consumer shouldn't be willing to spend that much on something where there is a better price available.

    Finally, as consumers we can definitely complain whenever the price of something is >0... because we would prefer it to be 0.

    If the price is close to the cost the producer has, then our complaints are more with the nature of reality than the cost (but both are valid complaints... just one goes to God for making game development so expensive, the other goes to the producer for charging more than they need to)
     
  10. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Businesses spend a considerable amount of time to find a line between consumer happiness and profit. The good ones at least. Its not a strategy that will make everyone happy. I dont mind paying extra for quality. Im more annoyed when the product is cheap but mediocre and hope got crushed than I am when I spend what id say is overpriced for a product I love.
     
  11. Reboot

    Reboot Privateer

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    I took reference from reviews of the latest EUIV and CK2 expansions - the mixed reviews show a sign of real DLC fatigue. I do think they're a bit much. I've decided not to pick up their expansions this Steam Sale on the backs of those reviews, for example.

    I think Firaxis so far has been doing OK with the DLCs - they're substantive and do add to the game enough for the price. Of course it depends on the player, but I think what EUIV and CK2 did would be even worse for those who already have problems with the current way DLCs are done in Civ.
     
  12. True_Candyman

    True_Candyman Emperor

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    I think the good thing about CK2 and EU4 DLC that noones yet mentioned is you don't actually NEED to buy it, it gives you more ways to play the game, but it's modular add ons by a developer who is shoswing the strongest will to support a game post release that i have ever seen outside of MMO's.

    Of course they have to charge for this work, or else they literally cannot continue to support and develop the game. Whether you think each of these expansions are still adding to the game or not is your choice, but that is exactly why they are optional, small DLCs available at your disgression, and do not rely on your purchase of any others to function.

    I don't think there's anything actively wrong with their DLC model, i think consumers have got too used to being handed content on a plate for free. If you're unwilling to pay for the extra content, it literally does you no harm to just ignore it. And clearly enough people are still interested for them to continue to develop new content, so its good for the developer and the consumers.

    Moreover, most games these days have a development cycle pre-planned before release. Civ games are very predictable in this regard as we will get the base game, then almost always 2 expansions down the line. In the case of civ V, i cannot see how no DLC would have changed this plan, or changed the quantity of content in expansions. We would simply have got less content. There is no opportunity cost in a case like this. They have money to make and we have content to gain (or not if you so choose), so what is the harm? :confused:
     
  13. daft

    daft The fargone

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    And so I shall, well, hoping for more like in late 2018, till then I got all kinds of games to play/finish on the previous iterations.

    Planning to buy vanilla only CVI in mid-to late 2017.

    I just wait them out, senseless overpaying for something that should be included in the game instead of added as bonus (DLC's) in the first place.

    I just wait for the Complete Editions.

    I know their tactics, they won't work on me.
     
  14. darko82

    darko82 Emperor

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    DLCs are optional; and they are great. To those whiners, do you really think the base game will be richer without DLCs? No more civs. Nothing. Then, you would complain that there is not enough content etc.

    The more DLCs, the better. Nobody makes you buy them.
     
  15. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    You know their tactics and they *are* working on you. You're still buying the game. They know people like you will wait until the complete bundle is available. That's why they make the complete edition available.

    Their tactics will just result in you having to pay relatively less while others will pay relatively more (to get the content earlier). And you'll get more content overall because DLC profits will make it viable to develop.

    Those sneaky corporate tactics... ;)
     
  16. SMcM

    SMcM Emperor

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    Lots of entertainment as in hours of entertainment. I think that is clear in my comment; you don't quite seem to have understood what I am saying.

    You're point is really off anyway. Some of the best things in life are cheap. Some don't even cost a thing. Even in terms of video games, the idea that some of the best can also be cheap still holds true; I've probably brought some of my favorite games at much lower prices than some other games I got at higher prices even if the games were brought first hand at launch in both cases.

    And, it's also worth pointing out that the prices of games are NOT determined by their enjoyability anyway.
     
  17. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    Yes, some things that are cheap are enjoyable. And if you have enough cheap enjoyable things in your life, then it's not really worthwhile to buy expensive things that are equally enjoyable.

    But if something is expensive and more enjoyable than the alternatives, then why shouldn't someone be willing to pay that price?
     
  18. SMcM

    SMcM Emperor

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    Not saying you shouldn't be willing to spend that much (if you can afford it obviously; if people are on state benefits, then spending £200 on something like a video game is entirely undreasonable), just that I am not :p.
     
  19. Socrates99

    Socrates99 Bottoms up!

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    By the time this is released maybe £200 won't be all that expensive....:mischief: sorry couldn't help myself.
     
  20. historix69

    historix69 Emperor

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    Recently I had a look at the xml-files of Civ5 for modding ... due to expansions and DLCs, the xml-files with definitions of game-objects are spread over more than 10 different folders ... vanilla, expansion, expansion2, DLC1 to DLC7, DLC_Deluxe, DLC_Maps ...
    Different Expansions already make things complicated, and a bunch of optional DLCs adds complexity ...

    I would not mind if the devs would regularly add new stuff with a patch or an expansion ...
     

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