1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Norway Now Kills More Whales Than Japan And Iceland Combined

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Cheetah, Nov 3, 2019.

  1. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The trees are actually quite lovely.

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2010
    Messages:
    17,014
    Happy cows milk better. And they don't dislike being milked. You veal out males, you milk females. Herds are kept largely as herds like to be kept, because happy cows milk better. But I get the feeling that's largely besides the point. There's a pre pastoral dream, and it has a lot of weird fetish cred.

    I want to devour the happy. Do you have anything cultured? Perhaps that spoke French?
     
    Hygro, rah and Birdjaguar like this.
  2. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    55,270
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    Illnesses like "mad cow disease" started because the animals were literally fed trash. Eg in Belgium and neighbors.

    I think it is very good that almost all humans have issues with murdering (even of animals, even for food). Shows that we aren't close to being by majority some kind of all-devouring demon.
    True, wars still happen - and some populations are more warmongering than others, and some societies are more violent than others. Yet if the more typical human urge wasn't (apparently) towards pacifism, things would have been far worse.
     
  3. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The trees are actually quite lovely.

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2010
    Messages:
    17,014
    No, mad cow disease is caused by feeding cows cows. It's a protein disorder of cannibalism. You solve it by feeding the cow bone meal to chickens and pigs, and chicken and pig bone meals to cows. Bone meal being supplemental protein made from waste product humans could eat, but don't generally want to.
     
  4. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    55,270
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    Afaik the pig illnesses in Europe were caused by trash-feeding those nice omnivores. "Like" doesn't always mean "including".
     
  5. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    42,789
    Location:
    Pale Blue Dot youtube=wupToqz1e2g
    But, that logic very quickly suggests I should start hunting people with larger footprints than I have
     
  6. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The trees are actually quite lovely.

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2010
    Messages:
    17,014
    Different illnesses have different causes. Sure. But the folded protein disorders of cannibalism are unlike many diseases. They aren't a good example of trash feeding, not being and example of one, with much different vectors.

    The statement is then, "diseases unlike mad cow disease can be caused by feeding animals trash." ;)

    In all fairness I should have called bone meal byproduct, not waste product.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2019
  7. Cheetah

    Cheetah Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    7,795
    Location:
    the relative oasis of CFC
    It's rather tangential to the point I made, I think, but yes, that does seem to follow. If you eliminate rivals in your environment there will be more resources for yourself.

    But then there's the whole thing about us generally agreeing not to kill each other because we're all humans, no?
     
  8. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    42,789
    Location:
    Pale Blue Dot youtube=wupToqz1e2g
    I think most of the objections to killing whales is that they are sufficiently human-like that they deserve moral protections
     
  9. Traitorfish

    Traitorfish The Tighnahulish Kid

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    31,834
    Location:
    Scotland
    Most of us aren't eating whale meat. The handful of nations who do could stop doing so tomorrow without any serious dietary impact. What's stopping them is the perceived political and economic impact.
     
    hobbsyoyo likes this.
  10. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    8,729
    Location:
    Chicago
    Don't those two items pretty much determine everything?
     
  11. Snerk

    Snerk Finger Lickin' Good

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    6,963
    Location:
    Norway. You'll never leave
    Then the whale eaters will buy some sausage instead and the ethical and environmental total will be less than before.
     
  12. Traitorfish

    Traitorfish The Tighnahulish Kid

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    31,834
    Location:
    Scotland
    Apparently. I just meant that humanity's "appetite for meat" doesn't extend to whales except in a few, essentially outlier cases.

    I'd say that depends on how chill you are with killing whales as opposed to pigs, and most people would tend to measure the morality of the killing based on the psychological complexity of the creature, not on complexity-per-kilo as some posters have suggested.

    Plus the "we can do both" thing.
     
    hobbsyoyo likes this.
  13. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    42,789
    Location:
    Pale Blue Dot youtube=wupToqz1e2g
    I very much struggle with the relative morality of killing a 5 tonnes of whale vs 5 tonnes of pig, if it's pleasure-eating.
     
  14. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    55,270
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    Is whale meat even tasty?
    Most people don't eat stuff like horse, camel, dog or cat meat, but there are markets for those.
     
  15. Snerk

    Snerk Finger Lickin' Good

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    6,963
    Location:
    Norway. You'll never leave
    Most people don't give a damn, they just want cheap meat. If we "do both things", one of those things must involve ending industrialised meat farming. Do you see any indications of that happening out of free will?

    And why do you think complexity per creature is a more noble approach over complexity per kg?
    It's alright but I wouldn't call it delicacy. It's very lean.
     
  16. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    55,270
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    I recall Swordfish being extremely tasty :yumyum:
     
  17. Snerk

    Snerk Finger Lickin' Good

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    6,963
    Location:
    Norway. You'll never leave
    Swordfish, tuna and the like is so yummy but also very overfished so best to leave it alone.
     
    hobbsyoyo likes this.
  18. Thorgalaeg

    Thorgalaeg Deity

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    Messages:
    4,944
    Location:
    Spain
    And then there is the mercury.

    About killing whales, I find it as killing elephants. They are so much bigger and more majestic than us... it is as killing a guy than earns more than you do.
     
  19. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2006
    Messages:
    11,167
    If it's a different species, it's morally edible on my book. Now some might be protected because having living wild animals around is nice. But I don't see how it can be universally agreed upon as some kind of fundamental moral issue, it's a choice.
    If some countries, or some groups within a country, chose to eat a particular species and that one does not require special protections to endure, what moral right have other groups to stopping them?

    I get it, we utterly slaughtered the cannibal tribes of the world because they ate people. That was genocide, and those who did it had little moral qualms with doing it. It was defended at the time and as it is done no one needs to get their knickers all twisted up arguing on the morality of it now.
    But are we going to slaughter the groups who hunt whales, genocide them? Are we going to be more "humane" and merely imprison them? Because to change such habits requires force employed again fellow humans. What is moral and what is not moral on those conflicts of choices?

    Personally I don't choose to eat sea mammals. Or birds. They look like meat but taste like fish, blegh.

    That would be white whales? :D
     
  20. Birdjaguar

    Birdjaguar Hanafubuki Retired Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2001
    Messages:
    35,654
    Location:
    Albuquerque, NM
    You might as well eat your dog, or your horse.

     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    tjs282 likes this.

Share This Page