Obama embraces faith based funding!

[bhsup]

Reaching out to religious voters, Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama called for expanding President Bush's program steering federal social service dollars to religious groups and — in a move sure to cause controversy — supported some ability to hire and fire based on faith.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080701/ap_on_el_pr/obama_faith_13

Smart move on his part. He's obviously trying to appeal to the majority of Americans rather than the lunatic fringe left. SO do you guys think this will help or hurt? I definitely land on the "help" side.

P.S. - first person to actually say the words "this could hurt Obama politically" gets my flea curse.

 

[philippe]

This could hurt McCain politically

 

[Trajan12]

Damnit. Stop trying to be centrist.

 

[MobBoss]

Of course he would be for this. How do you think the Trinity Church got so big?

 

[bhsup]

This could hurt McCain politically

You asked for it!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your armpits!

 

[I'm Cleo!]

Well, it's also the case that the AP reported the story wrong. Obama's plan does not support the groups' ability to discriminate on the basis of faith. Here's from the actual speech:

“Now, make no mistake, as someone who used to teach constitutional law, I believe deeply in the separation of church and state, but I don’t believe this partnership will endanger that idea – so long as we follow a few basic principles. First, if you get a federal grant, you can’t use that grant money to proselytize to the people you help and you can’t discriminate against them – or against the people you hire – on the basis of their religion. Second, federal dollars that go directly to churches, temples, and mosques can only be used on secular programs. And we’ll also ensure that taxpayer dollars only go to those programs that actually work.”

On the larger point of actually implementing faith-based initiatives -- well, if it's for a secular purpose and the program works, how can anyone not support it?

Cleo

P.S. Is anyone else tired of "make no mistake?"

 

[philippe]

You asked for it!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your armpits!

I said McCain, jeesh, for an absolutist who takes everything literal, you sure are figurative today.

 

[Trajan12]

Of course he would be for this. How do you think the Trinity Church got so big?

He's doing something you should ideologically agree with and you still find reason for an attack.

 

[Patroklos]

BUSHAMA!!!!!

No Bush Third Term!!!

Oh God, the Obamaniacs must just be loving this, not simply approving of but full on adopting a Bush agenda item. I can't wait for the rationalizations

He's doing something you should ideologically agree with and you still find reason for an attack

Its his hypocricy (and especially that of his supporters) that makes this an "attack." Hell with stuff like this and Clark a few days ago who needs to attack him?

 

[jessiecat]

Who are this "lunatic fringe left" he keeps going on about, anyway?
A couple of nerdy Trotskyists in hippy squat in NY? Or is it just trendy
East Coast liberals he's so worried about again?

EDIT

And of course this won't hurt Obama one little bit. He doesn't hold positions long enough to have to have any impact either way. If you keep ducking and dodging they'll never lay a glove on you.
Now that's what I call a "liberal"! Trouble is, people who always stick to the middle of the road have a nasty habit of being run over.

 

[nonconformist]

Who are this "lunatic fringe left" he keeps going on about, anyway? A couple of nerdy Trotskyists in hippy squat in NY? Or is it just trendy East Coast liberals he's so worried about?

I think it's pretty much the four members of Rage Against the Machine at the moment...

 

[nihilistic]

WTH is this? Why am I voting for Obama again? Is this the 'change we can believe'? Changing into a fundie Republican? I wonder how this is going to play out with his base.

I guess the in the 'change we can believe', the stress should be on the 'believe'. Wow, 'principled politician' my ass. I expected him to be another politician, but I expected that after the election.

 

[Trajan12]

BUSHAMA!!!!!

No Bush Third Term!!!

Oh God, the Obamaniacs must just be loving this, not simply approving of but full on adopting a Bush agenda item. I can't wait for the rationalizations



Its his hypocricy (and especially that of his supporters) that makes this an "attack." Hell with stuff like this and Clark a few days ago who needs to attack him?

He can do this if he wants. And I'll disagree with him. Just like I and many people disagreed with him on FISA, and like many disagreed with him on campaign finance. It's only you who pretends to know that Obama supporters agree with everything he does.

Did he ever say that he disagreed entirely with Bush's faith program? Then it would be hypocrisy. As of now, it's a strawman.

 

[skadistic]

Sweet another politician wants to give my money to a church!

How is this change? Where is the hope?


Just more of the same from Obama.

 

[Patroklos]

Did he ever say that he disagreed entirely with Bush's faith program? Then it would be hypocrisy. As of now, it's a strawman.

Please look up the definition of strawman, because you are doing it wrong

Oh God, are you really that partisain. Is it or is it not a fact that any time Obama or his supporters can find any link, similarity, or coincidnece between the McCain campaign and Bush all of a sudden it is "BUSH THIRD TERM, BUSH THIRD TERM, BUSH THIRD TERM *faint*"? Is it really beyond you to see the hypocrisy in that? Really? Seriously?

'change we can believe'

How is it you missed his whole campaign is based on faith?

 

[I'm Cleo!]

Trajan12,

And, don't forget, Bush's faith based program was a joke. John DiIulio, the man Bush appointed to head the program, decried the efforts of the "Mayberry Machiavellis" and their inability to do any meaningful policy work. You can criticize Bush's program on a number of grounds, including that it didn't do what it was supposed to do, and that you could implement a program that would do what it's supposed to do.

Cleo

 

[Grimz101]

Its been shown Religious based youth services are more effective, then Goverment ones. These Youth services reduce crime thus are a good use of your tax dollars..

 

[Trajan12]

Please look up the definition of strawman, because you are doing it wrong

Oh God, are you really that partisain. Is it or is it not a fact that any time Obama or his supporters can find any link, similarity, or coincidnece between the McCain campaign and Bush all of a sudden it is "BUSH THIRD TERM, BUSH THIRD TERM, BUSH THIRD TERM *faint*"? Is it really beyond you to see the hypocrisy in that? Really? Seriously?

No one's ever said that everything Bush did was just all wrong. I also would like Obama to adopt Bush's immigration policy. But when it comes down to it, which of these candidates is the one who agrees with Bush almost 100% of the time?

Not Obama. So I'll give him the leeway of having one or two strikes. But to epect me to decry him, when John McCain is a total 180 from everything I believe in, is irrational.

Now if Obama decided he agreed with Bush with the frequency that McCain does, I'd hope they'd smear his ass.

 

[downtown]

It would be difficult for anybody who has a background in community organizing, or local politics to ignore the productive power of churches and faith-based groups.

 

[skadistic]

Its been shown Religious based youth services are more effective, then Goverment ones. These Youth services reduce crime thus are a good use of your tax dollars..

Good parenting works better then both and doesn't result in the feds taking money from me.