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OCCC1- One city Conquest

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by Kulko, Mar 28, 2013.

  1. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Exactly. That's why I wanted to build a temple or barracks in the beginning. Wealth is a big waste, we should not do that. So until we get into that archer-worker cycle, we should try and build one or two useful buildings after the initial two curraghs workers and military police.
    All this will depend on what techs we'll be able to trade, so no precise planning possible yet. If we are lucky, an AI researches CB in the first 15 turns, and we can build a temple.
    It's not that useful, but better than Wealth and better than drowning in unit upkeep... A barracks before the archer-worker cycle would be useful too. This is a building we'll need later anyway.

    Excellent, we have a second BG! :bounce: The game is won now... ;)

    We can reach size 6 in turn 21. If we build 2 early workers, that'll get delayed to something like T27-28. Is that enough time to improve the necessary 6 tiles? Two irrigations, 4 mines and 6 roads are 50 worker turns. We should probably build two workers right when getting to size 3. Something like curragh - curragh - worker - archer - worker - barracks - archer - 5 x ar/wor-cycle?
     
  2. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Deity

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    Before we build Colosus better not to build barracks. It is -1 gpt. Temple also -1 gpt and 60 Sch lost. We may use Temple or Granary as pre-build. Barracks only 20, and it is nothing. Problem is that it is 2 Mil civ, but we will not trade Alphabet for CB or BW or Potttery. Will see...

    OK, who will start and what play order?
     
  3. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    Kulko (up)
    Lanzelot (on deck)
    I.Larkin
     
  4. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    I played the first 21 to get us to an even date. IF you guys feel your turns are to boring I am fine with going 20 tuurns in the first round.

    I met Mongol, Zulu and Aztecs, the latter two sharing an island. We have one archer on MP and 3 workers. Trondheim is on size 4 and doing fine I would think. As expected now we face the question what to do with our builds from now on.



    Preturn:
    I am pretty sure, moving the worker into the other direction would have been better. It would have opened an easier road to the second worker to the third cow.

    T7 Curragh --> Curragh
    T11: Borders Expand We got Ivory right next door.
    T12: Curragh --> Worker
    T14: Worker --> Archer
    T16: We meet Genghis. He owns BW and Pottery and willing to trade either for Alpha. I decline.
    T18: Meet Shaka, Who also own Masonry.
    T19: Archer --> Worker Meet Monty, who shares an island withShaka, and brings only BW and Pottery to the table.
    T21: Worker --> ??
     

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  5. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Got it, but can't play tomorrow. If you want to switch, go ahead.

    Trondheim looks well on track! 6 more turns and we can start our cycle. What can we build till then? We can't give up Alphabet, so perhaps another archer for MP and another curragh? Or a warrior for scouting our inland? Most probably we'll disband those units anyway, when upkeep gets too high.
     
  6. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    Reading your last post I realize we had a different strategy concerning that last cow. Since the eigth food would be wasted, I started a mine here, whichbis lso what we want long term. But apparently you think we should irrigate it, to use the foreest immediately and save a few turns in the short run.

    If you want me to fix this, I will replay the last few turns sometime during the day.
     
  7. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Deity

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    I think 7 fpt+ better then 8. Good question "how many workers we want" .

    Mongols are isolated and have only 7 gpt. I think later we may trade alpha for BW+ smth to them.

    Looks that Zulu in contact with Inca or America. AIs not often research Masonry at first instance.
     
  8. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    That was my reasoning too, but we could alos work 8fpt + 1 forest, bringing us back to 7. This has the advantage of faster reaching 10 spt (no need to mine an extra grassland), But later we will definitely turn that irrigation into a mine. so its double effort.

    Yep, so we have 3 AIs on one island, which also bad luck for our strategy.


    BTW: Do we want to build the SoZ later?
     
  9. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    I think it's a good idea! The sooner we reach "the cycle", the better. We can run the cycle for one round longer and keep an extra worker that can help changing our 3 irrigations slowly back to mines, once we've hit size 12. (From the 3 workers we currently have, one will be used for the ivory colony. With the extra worker we'll have 3 again, perfect for mining the cows and any hill that we didn't manage to finish yet before the jump to 12.)

    SoZ: I built it in my test game, but only because I had two AIs on my continent and needed some defense while building the other wonders. Not sure it helps in a naval attack?! Perhaps if we have finished our other important wonders and still have nothing else to do.
     
  10. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    Well here is the new save. I managed too keep all else the same.

    As for trondheim, it shoudl working the river BG for 2 turns, before the switching to the irrigated moo to finish 20 food and get maximum commerce in the process. That way the archer should also finish in 3 turns.
     

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  11. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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  12. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    T20 (preturn): worker goes to BG. That is the only tile we still need to improve for our 3-turn cycle.
    Barracks costs indeed too much gold during our wonder-build-phase, and we need every coin for the sling. So I decide to build two more archers in the next 6 turns.

    T21: The Aztecs and Zulus now know Alphabet :wallbash: The Zulus know CB in addition. Meet Incaland, they know the usual BW, Masonry, Pottery.

    T22: Zulus start the Colossus in Zimbabwe (size 3). That's going to be a tough race.

    T23: Trondheim grows to 5, archer is finished. Treasury is almost empty now, so I need to reduce science rate from 80% to 50%. We are already paying 3gpt unit upkeep. Perhaps we should indeed switch to wealth for a few turns?! After all, we'll be building 10 more units over the next 15 turns! With 8 shields (thanks to the forest) wealth gives us 2gpt, so not too bad. That allows 70% science.
    Hmm, the Mongols would give us BW, Pottery and 10g for Alphabet. They indeed look isolated and backward. Should we risk it? It would allow us 80% science for the next 12 turns.

    I'm pausing now to let you take a look. Questions:
    - Wealth?
    - Take the Mongol deal?
     
  13. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    It is my experience from my game already that there will be long phases in the. Beginning of the game where its wealth or wonder or drowning in upkeep.

    As for the deal it nets us two useful techs, as well as a larger prebuild. So I am all for taking it. But I haven't got much experience at successful trading at deity level.
     
  14. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    PS: I am on holiday from tomorrow onwards for a week. I will have my mobily with me, so I will probably have access to read this thread, but I am normally to lazy to type, so dont be surprised if you get none or very terse replies from me.
     
  15. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Deity

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    Looked at save. I think start Colossus is our only chance, but we may loose it.

    Zimbabwe may have 7 spt now and larger when grow.

    We may delay with trade Alpha for 3 turns starting settler "as pre-build".

    Later trade masonry and use Pyramids as back-up for GLib.
     
  16. Kulko

    Kulko Innocent Bystander

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    Zulu: 120 shields at 7+spt =16-18 turns
    Viking: 200 shields at 10,5 spt =18-20 turns.

    No way we are making it. Looks definitely like a glib game.
     
  17. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Hmm, if we can't make it (Colossus) anyway, then there is no reason to delay our growth. So I would continue with the original plan and not get "sidetracked" by a desperate wonder-race. 3-4 more workers, then we can jump to 12. We have 11 river tiles, that gives good commerce and increases our chance to at least get the Republic sling. And with 20spt (maximum will be 23spt) we will have no trouble building the remaining wonders.
     
  18. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Deity

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    Looks that Zulu connected with America and Aztecs. We will compete with cluster of three AIs.
    Really, I think that GLib is best choice, but we can make decision later. We may try to build Colony ASAP.
    Continue plan with Workers.
     
  19. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Ok, sounds indeed like the safest option.
     
  20. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    T23, cont: set science back to 80%.

    T25: Treasury is now empty, so I trade Alphabet to Incas (they may get it from Zulus or Aztecs anyway) for Bronze, Masonry and 10g. Then trade Masonry to Mongols for Pottery and 10g.
    Now we have enough gold for finishing Writing quickly.

    T26: The Incas start the Pyramids.
    Trondheim reaches size 6. Switch from Wealth to archer (the last missing mine will finish interturn). Not sure yet, whether I will really build one archer in every 3-cycle, but a few more for scouting our island for more luxuries and for protecting from barbs can't hurt.

    Zululand knows Iron Working.

    T27: The Incas start the Colossus. They know Iron Working as well.

    T28: Archer -> worker. The Zulus know the Wheel and suddenly have 20g. They must have met someone.

    T29: The Aztecs start the Pyramids.
    Worker -> Archer

    T30: Dyes discovered! Need to lower science to 70%.

    T31: Archer -> worker. Science back to 30%.
    The Mongols know Iron Working. I buy it for Alphabet and sell it to the Aztecs for 10g. Science back to 60%

    T32: Worker -> Wealth.
    Find America. They are up CB and Wheel. They don't have gold. So probably they traded Wheel + 10g to the Zulus.
    Disband this curragh. (The other one already moved.)

    T33: The Aztec start the Colossus.
    Ivory connected. I make two more moves with our other curragh, then disband it as well.

    The Aztecs know Writing! That drops the prices so much that we can finish it exactly next turn. Science to 20%.

    T34: Wealth -> worker.
    The Zulus now also know Writing, the Aztec got CB and 20g for it. (We need to make embassies and then forment some wars asap, I guess...)
    Big Question now: CoL or Philo?

    The Zulus have 22% pop vs our 12% and their cap is size 6, so they potentially have quite a good research. The Aztecs look rather small though.
    Alternative would be to take Philo, pick CoL and do Rep at 10%. But how will we be able to build GLib and Lighthouse then? (Lighthouse might be important as it could allow us to trade luxuries later. Aztecs, Zulus, Incas and Mongols all have 2 or more of their Lux already connected. They only need a harbor and we can trade over sea tiles.)
    Or: pick Literature, then do CoL normally and Rep at 10%. Hope that GLib gives us MapMaking.
     

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