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On the Importance of the United Kingdom

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Pillager, Mar 24, 2003.

  1. MrPresident

    MrPresident Anglo-Saxon Liberal

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    English with German parents.
    First country you enter.
     
  2. Akka

    Akka Moody old mage.

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    Facing my computer.
    :lol:

    Well, that's becoming ridiculous. I give up.
     
  3. phoenix_night

    phoenix_night Deity

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    parents nationality is perfectly acceptable for determining nationality.
     
  4. MrPresident

    MrPresident Anglo-Saxon Liberal

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    I don't think it should be but I can accept that it will be.
     
  5. ferenginar

    ferenginar Grand Nagus

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    On the question of Citizenship and nationality please visit attached link on Dual Nationality which should clarify that it is not solely down to where you are born as you cannot be born in two countries.
    Dual Nationality

    ferenginar
     
  6. gael

    gael Ard Ri

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    In Northern Ireland you can hold a British and Irish passport.
    I suppose that could be called dual nationality.

    I don't know if any of you have heard of Emian De valera. He was born of a Spanish father, Irish mother, in Americia.
    He went to Ireland to fight for Irish nationalism, and latter became the first president of the republic.
    I suppose this is an example of feelings of national identity that go beyond your parent country.
     
  7. Hamlet

    Hamlet Manic Depressive

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    Whereas I respond with with actual criticsms of your argument, you have to respond with insults.

    So childish. Not that I was expecting any better.

    Who sets that? You?

    Who says they don't have a choice? They seem to think they can chose.

    Liberalism is determined by what you hold to be true ideologigcally, not what you 'think' Liberalism is about, or what you chose to think it's about. It's not about 'my kind of Liberalism.' What Liberalism is about is not up for interpretation; There is an objective standard.

    The nationality issue is something totally different as it's a subjective value judgement.

    Okay, perhaps you'd like to answer my fundamental question and go someway towards deciphering your argument: Why is nationality 'set' by where you were born?

    Saying nationality is set by where you were born is not an argument; it's a statement. So far it's been just about the only thing you've said, albeit in about a hundred different guises so far.
     
  8. Kinniken

    Kinniken Riding with William

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    :rotfl:

    Just for the fun of it, what if you were born in a plane? Are you a citizen of the coutry you happened to be over at the time? And what if the plane cross a few boundaries while your mother is giving birth?
    Oh, and if the plane is over the sea, is it the first country you fly over that counts? Or maybe it's the first country the plane lands in... but then, does a simple refueling stop counts, or do you need to get out of the plane?
     
  9. MrPresident

    MrPresident Anglo-Saxon Liberal

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    Why wouldn't you be a citizen of the country you were over at the time? I didn't know it mattered how high you were at the time. What if you were born on the third storey of a building? What about the fifth? Or heaven forbid the tenth?
    It is very simple. It is the first country you enter. The reason for entering doesn't matter. How long you enter for doesn't matter. If you only went there to take pictures of famous attractions, guess what, it doesn't matter. It is the first country you enter, nothing else matters.
    :lol:
    Let me respond by asking a question. Who decides that we are human? Because they are the ones who decide where we are born.
    Then why don't all liberals believe exactly the same thing?
    Because that is nationality. There is no proper answer to this question. It is like asking why is your species set by what DNA you have?
     
  10. Hamlet

    Hamlet Manic Depressive

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    Expand, please. I don't quite understand what you mean. Are we talking about humanity as a general term, or about a case by case basis?

    I never said all Liberals did. I said there are fundamentals to Liberalism that all Liberals will accept.

    Crock. There is no mysticsm about nationality; my argument here should destroy any idea there is. Nationalities are chosen and/or sustained by people on the back of their attachment to certain values, ideas, and so on. There is no mystique about it.

    And on the basis of that point, is there nothing mroe to nationality than were you were born? Nationality is that simple, is it?

    If you can't offer any more convincing explanation than 'Nationality is one of teh great mysteries of the Universe' as your position, then I'd prefer to stick with my idea of how people affiliate themselves. It seems a bit more obvious, logical, and based on common sense to me.
     
  11. Oruc

    Oruc Reactionary

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    hamlet u dont make no sense how can u decide that your nationalty is different from where your born

    so i could one day decide i was russian or mongolian another
     
  12. Hamlet

    Hamlet Manic Depressive

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    Why is saying "Nationality is based on whatever national identity you chose to ally with" more nonsenscial than saying "Nationality is based on where you were born."

    ?

    Yes. I'd think you were a bit foolish, because you'd have no reason for doing it, but you could.
     
  13. gael

    gael Ard Ri

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    Heres a few dictionary interprations of the word 'Nationality'.

    Cambridge:
    nationality noun
    1 [C] the official right to belong to a particular country:

    Webster:
    'national status; specifically : a legal relationship involving allegiance on the part of an individual and usually protection on the part of the state b : membership in a particular nation'

    Your dicionary.com:
    'The status of belonging to a particular nation by origin, birth, or
    naturalization'.

    'Naturalization'
    'To grant full citizenship to (one of foreign birth).'

    So i think, if you are born into a country/nation, your nationality is legaly bound to that country, even if you have strong 'nationalist'
    feelings for another.
    If you apply for citizanship of another country, then you will become formly, and legaly, a national of that country/nation.
    If you have dual citizanship, then your nationaliy is both.

    If your born in a plane or any thing else like that, then i think the nationality of your parents would probably pass onto you until you land and they do the paperwork.:)
     

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