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Open Letter To Steam and Firaxis Games

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Aerion, Nov 16, 2010.

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  1. Maniacal

    Maniacal the green Napoleon

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    Mass Effect 2 is $19.99 USD on Steam, I'm in Canada and we get the exact same Steam store people in the USA get. I bought it on sale and pre-order on GamersGate though.

    However since you're in Australia then yeah, you guys are almost always ripped off by prices anyways. And Steam is inexcusably bad at converting the $s to Euros or £s. Steam prices for new games (In North America) are on par with retailers but I don't think I've ever bought a game for full price on Steam, always on sale/discount or marked down if its a few years old.

    In the UK I've heard that its completely worthwhile to check Amazon, Play and other retailer's websites for new game prices as they are often cheaper. I haven't seen an example of than here in North America though.
     
  2. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    Not really, unless you're talking specifically about steam. I haven't had any problem buying games cheap over the last several years, using ebay (for games that can still be sold second-hand, which is sadly fewer and fewer these days) and webstores who import games like the one I already mentioned. It's been a while since I've bought a game from a large store unless it was in the bargain bin. Actually I think BtS was the last one, and I was probably a bit ripped off there too. :lol:
    I went into EB when I wanted to check out the civ5 collectors edition preorder. It was $130 with a $10 deposit. lol, when the salesperson realised I was interested in that edition they suddenly became much more interested in me. No way was I putting an order on a game that expensive though - even if it is civ.

    I suppose Steam can charge such high prices here because there isn't enough competition. For some reason I don't understand, not enough people are switching over to the much cheaper options that are available to them. (Don't know how to use internet?:))
     
  3. Maniacal

    Maniacal the green Napoleon

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    Yeah VALVe's overseas pricing is a bit of a mystery for new games. Its not like it costs them shipping. Eh the sales are still good though and a few games are correctly priced.
     
  4. Varanid

    Varanid Warlord

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    Every time a thread on Ars Tech becomes a PC vs Console thread I think this to myself! I mean, by the time I was in middle school consoles were not a rarity (I'm 26). But they weren't anywhere near as common as today either, with all three having 10s of millions sold by now.

    I think your take on ages is incorrect though; I know lots of 30+ year old gamers. Gaming started taking off in the late 70s/early 80s from what I understand (this is before I remember stuff personally though) so the first generation of people that grew up playing video/pc games is now in their 30s. And there's an amazing amount of second generation gamers where parents and kids will game together (it's cute watching a 5 year old play MarioKart or Wii Sports!).
     
  5. /solar/

    /solar/ Chieftain

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    I'm from New Zealand and bought the game on steam for $79USD. Even the discount online retailers here are charging ~$70USD and then you have to pay a few $$ shipping so its pretty similar.


    On the main topic, Steam is excellent.
    1: I currently have 9 games in my steam library (out of about 20) which I could not have purchased over the counter here for any money.
    2: As far as collecting data about peoples actions, gaming trends, interests, preferences etc. goes, whats the worst that can happen? Valve develops their product further to be more inline with what I want? Shame on them! I get a few emails that immediately drop into my spam folder? Evil!
    3: Steam is amazing for having groups of friends who play the same games as you. Best multi-player enabler ever.

    If you just stop thinking about it it will cease to be annoying.
     
  6. Minmaster

    Minmaster Prince

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    3 words:

    DEAL WITH IT

    your whining about it won't change a thing.
     
  7. Maniacal

    Maniacal the green Napoleon

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    Yeah the average age is supposed to be around 33 (maybe 34 by now :p).
     
  8. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    That's why in my comment I said the younger generation of gamers (intending to imply there are still plenty of gamers older). If were to be more specific I'd be talking about 16-24 year olds. I'm not trying to imply that it's anywhere near the average gamer age. Below that age group you aren't going to find many kids buying their own games on steam except with help from parents.

    Ozgameshop.com sells games to New Zealand as well. ~ 40AUD at release for civ5, now only 35AUD. It's a relatively new business though, only becoming separated from ebay (they were an ebay store before) a month or so before civ5 was released.
     
  9. Cordycep

    Cordycep Chieftain

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    Anyone notice that the OP hasn't replied.

     
  10. Alan McG

    Alan McG Cannelloni

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    On the original topic (haven't read the last 5 pages).. I don't thinks the steam application is exactly 'light' as it has been suggested before. Looking at my task manager right now, steam is fourth in terms of memory consumption, with only Firefox, thunderbird and explorer surpassing it. That is a *really* high load for an application that is doing absolutely nothing.

    And I have seen it escalate considerably. I am in offline mode now, maybe it goes up when you go offline (which I try to avoid as much as possible)

    Before Civ5 I didn't give steam a second thought, I was neither for nor against. After civ5, I deeply dislike it. Not only because of the resources it needlessly consumes.. Off the top of my head I can think about:

    - Even though you are supposed to be able to play offline, sometimes when I have been on the move I was unable to boot the game in offline mode. My guess is it had something to do with steam shutting down incorrectly the previous time I play. But regardless, this is annoying. Now I can never be sure if I'll be able to boot the game or not when I'm away from home/office.

    - When the previous patch was released, I couln't play because the patch had to be downloaded first. This took a hefty 6 hours (and I have fiber, I can literally download a movie faster than going to the video store around the corner for it). It was useless to cancel the download and try re-entering the game in offline mode because the game would not start without the patch. I have no idea how big the actual patch was, but I doubt it was worth 6 hours.

    - It takes me 3 additional (steam) confirmation steps every time I boot the game to actually boot it, so I can tell steam that yes, I want to play the game, I want to play offline, and I don't care about my savegames in the cloud.

    I do understand the need to fight piracy but this seems excessive. There must be simpler and less intrusive ways to ensure the same protection. Great perhaps for online communities and multiplayer, but do they really need to force it into everyone? I coulnd't care less about multiplayer in civ, steam offers me nothing I want but I am still forced to have it permanently in my HD. I will seriously think about buying any other game that needs steam (although let's be honest, will probably get civ5 complete as well), and will be looking forward any legal 'crack' that enables civ5 single player without steam ( a la no-cd crack from previous civ titles)
     
  11. Akka

    Akka Moody old mage.

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    You plainly lie about Impulse, as I've also bought Elemental, and I certainly NOT need to launch Impulse every time I play it. You can just launch the Elemental exe without even have Impulse installed on the computer.

    Misleading and lieing isn't a good way to make a point.

    As for game sold over Steam that don't require Steam to run them, I've no problem with. But that's not about what we're complaining, precisely because of the previous sentence.
    No it doesn't, because - at least AFAIK - there is NO game that REQUIRES Impulse to play.
     
  12. evrett37

    evrett37 Prince

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    I havnt seen Gamersgate mentioned here..they are a good digital downloaded that doesnt require a client.
     
  13. CyberTyrant

    CyberTyrant Emperor

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    True. None of the games I've bought off Impulse require it.
     
  14. Kerosene31

    Kerosene31 Prince

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    People who don't like Steam connecting to the Internet seem to spend a lot of time posting on the Internet about it.

    The resources taken up by Steam is irrelevant. Your web browser takes up more processor time (and you Steam haters have no problem with web browsers being open) :) It just isn't relevant on modern hardware.
     
  15. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    This is not a good argument. A web browser is using up those resources in order to do a task you want it to do. Most of the people who object to Steam like to have control over the apps/processes running on their machine where possible. Steam takes away some of that control, and a tiny amount of resources.
     
  16. Kerosene31

    Kerosene31 Prince

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    You do have control. You installed Steam. It is just evil because it "just is" isn't an argument. The resources are irrelevant and it does nothing sinister to your PC.

    I used to run a script which turned off all non-essential services so I could maximize resources for gaming. However now on modern equipment it just isn't relevant technically.

    I can guarantee there is really sinister software on most every PC out there unless you are running a web browser with scripts turned off. Web browsers and other common programs have all sorts of vulnerabilities and spyware.

    People are entitled to the opinion that they just don't want it. However most of the arguments against it are pretty much silly. A few people have technical problems with it, which is annoying, but that kind of thing happens with every PC game.
     
  17. Dale

    Dale Deity

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    Say what you will, everytime I launched ewom it launched impulse on my laptop.
     
  18. Term

    Term Chieftain

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    The Steam model is not gonna last long, its not a sustainable long term business. Seems to me that piracy is a lost battle as you can download ANYTHING, ANYWHERE and at any given time, so I really dont think current protection systems work, they just give developers a false sense of security. If I were to bet, i'd say that in a not-so-distant future(well its happening now, kinda) the whole PC game industry will probably develop towards free game distribution + b.net-like subscription model, and whole communities will support it by modding and further developing the game... at least for strategy games.

    Well, look at SC2, battle.net only works with a real SC2 Serial/ID, and the multiplayer is SC2 main concern(and my favorite part of the game), hell, the pirated version probably helped SC2 in the road to glory.

    Obs: Not to mention what is currently being done with cloud computing... could it be that in the future we will be playing CIV VII remotely with our futuristic TV through a Firaxis account paid monthly??
     
  19. Maniacal

    Maniacal the green Napoleon

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    Yet despite piracy (which often doesn't allow access to the multiplayer) lots of people still buy games and there are ~30,000,000 people with Steam accounts. OnLive is trying the play through your computer or TV with the actual game being hosted on their servers and you are watching a live streaming video of what you are playing. However that technology is still not terribly excellent due to the poor coverage of their servers, poor internet infrastructure in North America (compared to, say, Korea) and noticeably high pings (response times).

    Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Of which Steam uses very very little (like 5 MBs when its just in the tray not doing anything, like during a game).
     
  20. Kerosene31

    Kerosene31 Prince

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    Yeah 7 years and still going strong... imminent failure is upon us.

    People don't like it and they are entitled to their opinion. However these blanket statements are just silly. Many many people have willingly installed Steam long before Civ V came out. It is something I use not because I have to but because I want to.

    I got the Civ 4 complete edition off Steam on sale a few years back, even though I already had all the CDs. Why? Because for $5 digital distribution was a great option for me.
     
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