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Opinion: Unique Wonders

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Creation & Customization' started by GigaNerd, Oct 23, 2007.

  1. GigaNerd

    GigaNerd His Nerdiness

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    Read title.

    Well, Vanilla gave us UUs, Warlords gave us UBs, why not have BTS give us UWs?

    Think about it: There's lots of cool wonders out there in the world. But not all can make the cut. For instance, the Great Ziggurat of Ur. It's really cool, but it couldn't even pass off for a national wonder!

    But, we could have it in there, unique to the Sumerians! It could replace the Pyramids, and have the government civics unlocked, as usual, but, also giving you extra espionage. What do you think?

    Another example: The Great Obelisk. A really good tourist attraction, but it's dwarfed compared to others like the Pyramids and the Sphinx. So, for Egypt, we could have Stonehenge replaced by the Great Obelisk, which will give you a free priest or two, along with Stonehenge's benefits! Why would the Egyptians need Stonehenge anyways?

    Consider the idea please. Who knows, there's a 0.17% chance that I might become video gaming history if this works! It's either me or the "Penguin Units Possible?" guy! :crazyeye:
     
  2. TheJopa

    TheJopa Šumar

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    IMO it wouldn't work. It's just that concept of wonders is such that they ARE unique anyway. Every single wonder is unique to some civ. And as a game mechanic, it would be very bad idea. Someone beats you to your wonder, you are screwed. I don't know but I really think this just wouldn't work.


    eDIT: If I understood it right, what you suggest is that lesser wonders that couldn't make it in standard civ replace Great Wonders, and also have better bonus? So you won't be building a Great Wonder but it's lesser, less famous version, and actually that lesser version is better?


    Perhaps unique national wonders could be a good idea.
     
  3. Dom Pedro II

    Dom Pedro II Modder For Life

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    Yeah, I would like to see unique Forbidden Palaces for each civ.
     
  4. Edgecrusher

    Edgecrusher King

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    I think Unique National Wonders might work, but not Unique Wonders on the sense you are talking about.

    For example: as Don Pedro suggested have a Unique Forbidden Palace for America as "The White House" and a unique Heroic Epic for Greece called "The Iliad".

    Something to that effect.

    Say for example the The Iliad gives a bonus production to water units in addition to the normal production bonus for military units provided by the Heroic Epic.
     
  5. TheJopa

    TheJopa Šumar

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    That makes sense too.

    Though I don't think it's really a must for a vanilla game, I'd be interested to see such a mod.
     
  6. Dom Pedro II

    Dom Pedro II Modder For Life

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    Yes, in fact, not surprisingly I wanted the American UFP to be the White House :) Although that's probably more of a palace than a forbidden palace role...

    I probably wouldn't recommend making a unique national wonder for each civ for all national wonders...

    I would recommend one of two options:

    1) Make a unique version of one national wonder (like the Forbidden Palace) for all civs.

    2) Make it for different national wonders but not one of every kind. So for example, maybe you give the Mayans the Popol Vuh as a Heroic Epic replacement or Macchu Picchu as the Incan replacement for the Forbidden Palace.

    Either way, you're looking at 30+ additional buildings.
     
  7. Edgecrusher

    Edgecrusher King

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    If my opinion means anything, I would think option "2" is better. Similar to how Unique buildings are done, i.e. each civ has 1 UB that replaces a different building.


    I mean, if you make say, a unique forbidden palace for every civ. then you are in a sense eliminating the Forbidden palace (since every civ has a unique version of it, no-one will build the norm).

    with that said. I think each civ should have a unique national wonder.

    in BTS there are 34 Civs.
    Including the palace (which I dont think should be replaced) there are currently 14 National Wonders,

    that translates into replacing them all at least twice.
     
  8. Dom Pedro II

    Dom Pedro II Modder For Life

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    Well, it's not that no one would build the norm... it's that there would not BE a norm. The Forbidden Palace would become the Chinese version of itself. This is in the same way that there are seven different kinds of the old temple and cathedral for each religion but there is no default "normal" one.
     
  9. black baron

    black baron Daemon Prince of Tzeentch

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    it doesn't have to be national wonders does it?
     
  10. 6underground

    6underground Resident Welshie

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    That's exactly what I'm trying to make happen with my mod, basically the Welsh Civilization get a unique national wonder to build after they research certain technologies and/or fulfill a Colosseum quota:

    Wonder Video: Millennium Stadium - Took a few hours to render (sorry for the quality, youtube compresses alot).

    I'm not sure if anyone has done this before, but it should be possible?
     
  11. Dom Pedro II

    Dom Pedro II Modder For Life

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    No, it doesn't have to be a National Wonder. You could make it so that every civ has its own version of a particular world wonder... so, for example, if you're upset with the prospect of being the Sumerians and building something like Chichen Itza, you could make a Sumerian equivalent of Chichen Itza like the Great Ziggurat. And then when somebody builds Chichen Itza, the other player will be unable to build the Great Ziggurat, or vise versa.

    The only reason I would caution against this is because 1) Finding wonders for every civ will be very difficult, and 2) It will be a lot of extra buildings most of which will never be built in any given game.
     
  12. GigaNerd

    GigaNerd His Nerdiness

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    @-BlackBaron: Thanks for reviving the thread!

    @-6Underground: Nice video! I'd suggest that you have three phases of construction instead of two. Not like anyone cares about my opinions, but.....

    @-DomPedroII: My replies are;
    1)-No, it actually isn't that hard. With these two sites (below), I can pretty much find a wonder for every civ.
    http://www.wikipedia.org/
    http://www.hillmanwonders.com/
    2)-People make pointless mods all the time! If you're going to say that this mod is worthless, then go say that to everyone else too!
     
  13. Dom Pedro II

    Dom Pedro II Modder For Life

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    Whoa! Whoa! Hold on... I never said that it would be worthless. I was merely mentioning things to keep in mind. If this is the only change you want for your mod, then it's not a big deal about the extra buildings. But each new building you add creates a slight increase in processing time... if you add a unique wonder for every wonder in the game, you could be talking about hundreds and hundreds of additional buildings.

    I wasn't trying to put you or your idea down, and I'm sorry if you interpretted it that way.
     
  14. GigaNerd

    GigaNerd His Nerdiness

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    I'm sorry for misinterpreting your words :blush:

    Well, I wasn't planning to make civ unique wonders for every wonder, just one per civ.

    I guess I'll go with the Unique National Wonder idea people have been talking about.
     
  15. Gaius Octavius

    Gaius Octavius Deity

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    Well, if you really want my opinion on it... ;)

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=199622

    I never did manage to get this going because I figured that it really needed custom artwork to make things shine. And while I proposed replacing many of the national wonders, I suppose you could just do one apiece, as with the UUs and UBs. Still, finding somebody to make the art is the problem. If you can do that, I just might do this project for you. :D
     
  16. NikNaks

    NikNaks Deity

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    Oh, I have to be a part of this. It would be awesome! Unique national wonders. :drool:
     
  17. Mexico

    Mexico TR senior programmer

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    in TR mod, we already have implemented unique national wonders for most civilizations....
     
  18. Alkyon

    Alkyon Warlord

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    Hmm, UNW sounds interesting...but some of them could be kinda hard to replace. Who would get uniques for the Moai Statues?
     
  19. black baron

    black baron Daemon Prince of Tzeentch

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    you don't have to do nationals some wonders like liberty could be applied to their original nation(Kremlin to Russia, taj mahal to India, hanging gardens to Babylon, so on so forth).
     
  20. GigaNerd

    GigaNerd His Nerdiness

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    The Chinese! ;)

    My list so far:

    America: Metropolitan (Hermitage)
    Arabia: OPEC (Wall Street)
    Aztecs: Florentine Codex (National Epic)
    China: Terracotta Warriors (Moai Statues)
    Egypt: Karnak (Hermitage)
    England: London Tower (Forbidden Palace)
     

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