Thorburne said:
Well, in order for the map 1UPT to work in a more reasonable level, the map would have to be so huge that even the most top-of-the-line computer 5 years from now wouldn't be able to run it. And as I have said, I am already suspending so much belief to enjoy CIV. The more you stack on to that, the less enjoyable it is. There is a limit!
As you yourself recognise the fact it would take immense computer power to generate the true size of theese maps, adding to that the large amount of activity on it. It really forces the devs to drop it down alot, sometimes we have to take things that ruin immersion to be able to play at all.
It honestly doesn't take much suspension of belief to enjoy a game like civ, if you are incapable to get past things like this then maybe games in general aren't for you?
Thorburne said:
Unit Micromanagement is not referring to the standard micromanagement that comes with strategy games, but with the fact that you have to move each and every unit one-by-one. As far as I know, there is no function that would allow you to select a group of units, then select a point on the map and they all maticulously march to that spot and form up around it. If there was, I am certain it would have been mentioned and discussed to death.
That said, just wait until the first time when you move your army of, say, 6 or 7 units toward an unprotected enemy city and have to take several turns manipulating them through a checkpoint allowing the enemy to pull units from the other side of their empire and form them up to defend. It WILL happen and people WILL get frustrated... even the 1UPT apologists!
I sure hope they add such options, but even without that you could select a move point that goes far and you won't have to give orders every turn for that unit.
6 or 7 units is nothing to me, and im most likely not alone to be used to far greater numbers in other games.
Ye sure navigating a crevice would slow you down enough for an opponent to mobilize defences, and most likely affect your attempt to take that town yes. Will it frustrate me? not likely, I knew about that crevice or I wouldn't know about that town.
You need to plan for that, that's part of strategy. And lets not forget it works both ways, if they want to attack you that same crevice is going to help alot. That's how it should be, an army should be hindered by rough or inaccessiable terrain.
I understand that it's a issue for some people, but I don't think the devs will be catering to thoose at this point.
I'm sorry for thoose that are angered or frustrated with the solution the Devs made for this game, if it was up to me I'd have added the option to use stacks of some sort if one wants to. I always like options to customise gameplay to fit as many people as possible, but as it is now you will have to hope for mods to solve the issues you have or others have.
Earthling said:
No, see, this doesn't answer that question at all - it's not really a fair statement. There's a lot of reason to say that 1upt is going to specifically make AI play worse than it would otherwise.
It's like that in most other games that have ever had such systems and is a limitation of AI, such as understanding pathing or "kiting," overextending lines, optimal formations and many other things already discussed around here.
People with lots of experience as game programmers have stated so, people with lots of experience just playing games often have seen it, and I too would agree unless someone has strong evidence otherwise for civ5.
So you saying that a AI can't possibly manage to play OUPT comptetently because it couldn't handle the requirement of formation and the koncept of kiting, yet such functions are entierely possible to program. AI doesn't understand things true, it merely carries out what it's programmed.
You can program it to recognise there is a melee unit within reach for it's archers and if they are within a certain distance the archers should be moved back before attacking. Then they can add lines to thoose that add or remove them depending on difficulty.
Formation itself is harder but again it's possible, program some preset formations and set the AI to put it's units in their patterns. Any AI can put X unit on Y spot, unless they left it out from the programming. Yes this is oversimplified but the point should still be clear, the limitation of AI is that it cannot do anything beyond it's programming. Even the smallest mistake can cause it to act irrationally, and finding all thoose minor mistakes is difficult.
So I don't see how OUPT would cause the AI to fail any more than before, each stack from CIV4 is basically a unit now. It can simply check the relative powers between each unit and then decide who to attack with what, the same thing that calculates success rates for you is what the AI uses to decide what or how to attack.
Yes there will be some things that the AI won't be programmed to handle, but the same thing happened in CIV 4. I recall there being an issue mentioned where the AI would basically self destruct when it couldn't reach the player during it's "war setting" stages.
Where are thoose people you mention anyway? where are thoose statements?