Hello amigos!
Its pretty clear that Civ 3 is not completed(just try playing a ww2 scenario, when you cant even see the damn map, and the Usa attacks Britain on 1938...)
We will all be forced to buy the game again, once is not enough for Firaxis i guess, and why should it be, they make twice the money, i would do the same if i were them.
But it doesnt mean we cant "fight" back, i love the game, and i am willing to buy it again, but they have to do more than give us descent scenraios, few more faces of leaders, and a radar...
Firaxians, you want us to buy the game again, then invest in the game again, change consepts, add things we want, it will bring you more money and reputation, and more enjoyment for us.
i have read all the comments on the Thread of Xp Ideas, and i gathered together all the ideas that most of the you agreed on.
lets start moving this thread forward, and make them listen to us, People, what they are giving us isnt enough to buy the game again, it was supposed to be on Civ3!!!!!
I want an answer about every suggestion here from Firaxis, before i buy the game again, and if you, my fellow gamers dont agree to something on the list, write it down, and we will remove it)
Once again, those are not my ideas, whats written here are ideas from the thread, so if you recognise your idea on the list, dont be mad, i admit i copied it, i only took the time to put them all together, so we can go with an organised list to Firaxis.
i divided the ideas to several subjects (this is going to be long guys...)
Here it Goes!!!
1)General Notes from the Fans to Firaxis!
First of all, i adress the thing that bugged me most about civ3 , give us the scenario editor when the game gets released, its just not the same game without scenarios, for some of us its the best part of the game, and for a year now, we cant play a descnent scenario!
more over, dont surprise us, if something is taken out, tell us before we buy the game, i only found out that there arent scenarios when i got home and tried playing one, it wasnt published, it wasnt written in the manual or on the box, and it got on our nerves...
about the expansion pack, it is nice you give add-on to the fanatic fans , like multiplayer, flag wins, and so on, but now most of us wish there wouldnt be one anyway, because it seems that when you release the game, you think on things you can exclude from it so people will buy the game again... and in any case this forthcoming expansion has some changes like radars, airfields and more civs that are going to change the game and its unfair for people who wont buy it, DONT expect that people buy the game twice, we dont want to, and dont have money... give respect to people who already bought the game and dont start talking a few months after the release about all those new things you forgot about , and will release soon, once again, most of us dont want to buy the game twice, i really am upset about this all thing.(it will sadly work this time, but dont pull it off on civ4 again)
Mr Sid, why does it hurt you so much to let us have about 40 civs?
how many hours of programming does it take, come on, in one day you can get all the 40 in, so do it!
Firaxis, dont hurry up the release of Civ4 on the expense of quality, there were too many Bugs on Civ3 when it got out, and lack of fundemental components such as SCENARIO EDITOR was upseting too(as i mentioned before, and i willl mention again!)
Major concepts that should be added/changed in Civ4
We want to get more attached to our units,they are not just pawns on the board but citizens from our empire.
first of all, and easy to implement is the ability for us to give our units names(The second battalion for example) this feature is very important for most of us.
some of us think that we should know how many people every unit contain, and if you draft about 5 units for example your population should decrease, those soldiers are our civ citizens, remember ww2, germany fought with 15 years old kids at the end of ww2, since they didnt have more men available, firaxis should tackle this subject.
Add more diplomatic options, most important missing ones are : the ability to give military support to other civs(lets say, if you give them tanks, they will arrive in 2 turns, and so on)
One more important feature is forcing a civ to stop waging a war against another, in todays politics, its the most common step, for example, my country israel is changing policies all the time since the US and EU keep on bugging us not to attack terrorists, and we have to do what they say...
Another diplomacy option that must be implemented is a nuclear ban agreement, and embargos of nations that create too much pollution, moreover , there should be an ability to call off diplomatic deals before they expire if both sides agree.
One more diplomacy option that can be hard to implement is a tready of limitation on the size of the armies, its very common since ww1, and it should be added.
There has to be much more bigger role to barbarians, or as we call it in our days Terrorists , for example you can fund and harbour terrorism against your neighbours(see iran helping terrorists, pakistan supporting "freedom fighters" against india and so on)
More over , not all the cities on the board must be owned by the empires, some of them can be terrorists cities, and some can be neutral cities that will only have the ability to have one city, it will bring so much more to the game, and make it more realistic, there are more than 300 nations on the planet, it can add a lot to the game(by the way , in the chat with firaxis , i asked them why terror doesnt get a more important role, i mean, isn't there a global war against terror, doh? the reply i got was: "we dont want to tackle this painful subject, so i told them that if thats the case , they shouldnt release a ww2 scenrio since its a painful subject too, i got no reply...)
in conclusion, we are big boys, this is a war and world domination game, we know there are terrorists around, and ignoring them wont make them go away...
There must be new units in civ4, and the ones that were mentioned the most in the forums are :Ballistic Missles that are not nuclear(scuds for example), 2 kinds of radars, and mine fields(which could be tough to add , cause it can make the game get stuck although there could be a way to defuse them, by a special unit, for example, in iran iraq war, the iranians compiled a brigade of 15 year old kids, whose job was to be the first to walk on mine fields, and defuse them, it was an effective unit, but not many volunteered to it...
There should be more representation to Intelligence in the game, its a very important feature, if your neighbour is preparing for war,and producing lots more units than the usual , and sending terrorists against you, then your Intelligence(C.I.A, satellite system and so on) will notify you about it.
the quality of the intelligence should be as good as the amount of budget they get.
Talking about realism, whats more important in our world today then religions? this is a delicate subject, but there must be a role for religions in the game.
The basic idea is that your civ will choose its religion for example-christian/muslim/ jewish/ atheist/ pagan and so on...
Muslim countries are more likely not to attack other islamic nations, and attack israel instead, and so on, there can be a lot more added on this subject.
The next subject is problematic, and its the mother earth effects, i am not talking about weather, but it will give a lot of spice and realism to the game if there were Volcanos, Floods,hurricanes , Earthquakes and alien abductions(kidding about the last one...) more over, there should be diseases like aids, that is a major factor today in many countries, and drug problems too( i am not sure that getting those two in is possible, but try thinking about it)
I have read about provinces ideas, its realistic, but too complicated, although , when you control such a big empire, its not possible that you wouldnt have problems, so the most common solution is that if your leadership is a failure, and your approval rates are low(lots of civil disorder,losing wars, and so on) those far away cities can suddenly revolt and become nuetral(once again, a lot of us feel that neutral cities can add a lot for the game)
Another realistic option that is very hard to implement is the UN role in the game, there should be one in the modern times, but i have no idea how to put it in, do you?(i havent seen any specific suggestions on this at the forum)
Bring those back from the Civ2!!!!!
Give us back the spy!! we all liked it alot, the new espionage system isnt much fun ,and the spy is the most important unit to represent terrorists who sabotage your city, poison water, and blow up, i think its fair to say we want it back!
The sentry command, god damnet, we miss it...
Partisans were awsome,and realistic, how come they are gone?!
We want the Wonders movies just like in Civ2, it was great, and now it feels so empty when i build the Statue of Liberty...
Where are the Airfields(Once again, no one understands why they are gone, i sure hope its not related to the fact they will be on the expansion pack...)
Good things on Civ3 that has to be kept and developed!!
The resource and luxury system is the major improvement of the game, great job, keep on developing it(add more resources and luxuries like gas, and oil in water squares, and dont go back to those stupid trade rouths from civ2... )
Civ3 is making a good job at making the game simple,and not tiresome, keep it going in Civ4, we dont want double irrigation, and trade routes. on that subject, the idea of food supply exchange between cities should be done only if it wont be complicated for us to manage
Keep on working on the AI, make it better, and i mean better , not by letting them cheat... lets face it , this game cant work well on multiplayer, the AI is very very important.
Borders are a great idea, so great that they should be sacred, so that if you attack a unit that is within your borders, its not a war act, and its legal, god damnet, if a mexican bunch of settlers and 2 armor divisions get into texas, will Bush ask them politely to leave for 3 years?!
Light changes that will make the game more comfortable
THE diplomacy screen, combine all the civs together, no one likes it that they dont all fit in one screen , i once havent talked to the americans through the entire game, cause i forgot they were even there!
We are all troubled that a F-16 jet fighter cant destroy a warrior,or a bomber cant sink a frigate, i dont know why, but it doesnt make sense, i know it is for the balance of the game, but you guys at civ team have to sort it out for us, realism is important, as i said before...
Multiple unit movement- its bugging most of us, make it more efficient, in the late stages of the game most of the time goes for ordering units around...
An ability to build canals would be nice...
An option that will allow you to wake all your units, lets say, if you plan to attack, or you were surprise attack, you might miss fortified and sentried units , so wake them all up with a click of a button!
War weariness should not occur in civs that were betrayed and attacked, and are fighting for the existence, and it should be linked to the success on the battlefield, lost units are not just strategic tools, they are your citizen's family, and if the cause is wrong and the death toll is high, it should be linked to war weariness (did anyone say Vietnam?)
There must be more World wonders: Eiffel tower, World trade center
, Taj Mahal, Internet, Hubbble Telescope , and much much more!
There should be more goverment types, such as Syndicalism, Fascism and so on...(not more than 3 though, it will mess things up!)
There should be about 3 leaders you can choose from every civ, if you are england, you can choose one of them stupid kings, or maybe sexy Thatcher, or the only god of history, WINSTON CHURCHILL.
well, thats it, i hope some of you are still reading this, and start commenting, i just want this to be a messege that would clarify to firaxis we deserve more if we buy the game again, i hope it can even make a diffrence.
if you agree to all this, just say it, so we can have a large number of names connected to this list, and if we debate about something, then we will post a survey and decide democratically
take care!!!
Its pretty clear that Civ 3 is not completed(just try playing a ww2 scenario, when you cant even see the damn map, and the Usa attacks Britain on 1938...)
We will all be forced to buy the game again, once is not enough for Firaxis i guess, and why should it be, they make twice the money, i would do the same if i were them.
But it doesnt mean we cant "fight" back, i love the game, and i am willing to buy it again, but they have to do more than give us descent scenraios, few more faces of leaders, and a radar...
Firaxians, you want us to buy the game again, then invest in the game again, change consepts, add things we want, it will bring you more money and reputation, and more enjoyment for us.
i have read all the comments on the Thread of Xp Ideas, and i gathered together all the ideas that most of the you agreed on.
lets start moving this thread forward, and make them listen to us, People, what they are giving us isnt enough to buy the game again, it was supposed to be on Civ3!!!!!
I want an answer about every suggestion here from Firaxis, before i buy the game again, and if you, my fellow gamers dont agree to something on the list, write it down, and we will remove it)
Once again, those are not my ideas, whats written here are ideas from the thread, so if you recognise your idea on the list, dont be mad, i admit i copied it, i only took the time to put them all together, so we can go with an organised list to Firaxis.
i divided the ideas to several subjects (this is going to be long guys...)
Here it Goes!!!
1)General Notes from the Fans to Firaxis!
First of all, i adress the thing that bugged me most about civ3 , give us the scenario editor when the game gets released, its just not the same game without scenarios, for some of us its the best part of the game, and for a year now, we cant play a descnent scenario!
more over, dont surprise us, if something is taken out, tell us before we buy the game, i only found out that there arent scenarios when i got home and tried playing one, it wasnt published, it wasnt written in the manual or on the box, and it got on our nerves...
about the expansion pack, it is nice you give add-on to the fanatic fans , like multiplayer, flag wins, and so on, but now most of us wish there wouldnt be one anyway, because it seems that when you release the game, you think on things you can exclude from it so people will buy the game again... and in any case this forthcoming expansion has some changes like radars, airfields and more civs that are going to change the game and its unfair for people who wont buy it, DONT expect that people buy the game twice, we dont want to, and dont have money... give respect to people who already bought the game and dont start talking a few months after the release about all those new things you forgot about , and will release soon, once again, most of us dont want to buy the game twice, i really am upset about this all thing.(it will sadly work this time, but dont pull it off on civ4 again)
Mr Sid, why does it hurt you so much to let us have about 40 civs?
how many hours of programming does it take, come on, in one day you can get all the 40 in, so do it!
Firaxis, dont hurry up the release of Civ4 on the expense of quality, there were too many Bugs on Civ3 when it got out, and lack of fundemental components such as SCENARIO EDITOR was upseting too(as i mentioned before, and i willl mention again!)
Major concepts that should be added/changed in Civ4
We want to get more attached to our units,they are not just pawns on the board but citizens from our empire.
first of all, and easy to implement is the ability for us to give our units names(The second battalion for example) this feature is very important for most of us.
some of us think that we should know how many people every unit contain, and if you draft about 5 units for example your population should decrease, those soldiers are our civ citizens, remember ww2, germany fought with 15 years old kids at the end of ww2, since they didnt have more men available, firaxis should tackle this subject.
Add more diplomatic options, most important missing ones are : the ability to give military support to other civs(lets say, if you give them tanks, they will arrive in 2 turns, and so on)
One more important feature is forcing a civ to stop waging a war against another, in todays politics, its the most common step, for example, my country israel is changing policies all the time since the US and EU keep on bugging us not to attack terrorists, and we have to do what they say...
Another diplomacy option that must be implemented is a nuclear ban agreement, and embargos of nations that create too much pollution, moreover , there should be an ability to call off diplomatic deals before they expire if both sides agree.
One more diplomacy option that can be hard to implement is a tready of limitation on the size of the armies, its very common since ww1, and it should be added.
There has to be much more bigger role to barbarians, or as we call it in our days Terrorists , for example you can fund and harbour terrorism against your neighbours(see iran helping terrorists, pakistan supporting "freedom fighters" against india and so on)
More over , not all the cities on the board must be owned by the empires, some of them can be terrorists cities, and some can be neutral cities that will only have the ability to have one city, it will bring so much more to the game, and make it more realistic, there are more than 300 nations on the planet, it can add a lot to the game(by the way , in the chat with firaxis , i asked them why terror doesnt get a more important role, i mean, isn't there a global war against terror, doh? the reply i got was: "we dont want to tackle this painful subject, so i told them that if thats the case , they shouldnt release a ww2 scenrio since its a painful subject too, i got no reply...)
in conclusion, we are big boys, this is a war and world domination game, we know there are terrorists around, and ignoring them wont make them go away...
There must be new units in civ4, and the ones that were mentioned the most in the forums are :Ballistic Missles that are not nuclear(scuds for example), 2 kinds of radars, and mine fields(which could be tough to add , cause it can make the game get stuck although there could be a way to defuse them, by a special unit, for example, in iran iraq war, the iranians compiled a brigade of 15 year old kids, whose job was to be the first to walk on mine fields, and defuse them, it was an effective unit, but not many volunteered to it...
There should be more representation to Intelligence in the game, its a very important feature, if your neighbour is preparing for war,and producing lots more units than the usual , and sending terrorists against you, then your Intelligence(C.I.A, satellite system and so on) will notify you about it.
the quality of the intelligence should be as good as the amount of budget they get.
Talking about realism, whats more important in our world today then religions? this is a delicate subject, but there must be a role for religions in the game.
The basic idea is that your civ will choose its religion for example-christian/muslim/ jewish/ atheist/ pagan and so on...
Muslim countries are more likely not to attack other islamic nations, and attack israel instead, and so on, there can be a lot more added on this subject.
The next subject is problematic, and its the mother earth effects, i am not talking about weather, but it will give a lot of spice and realism to the game if there were Volcanos, Floods,hurricanes , Earthquakes and alien abductions(kidding about the last one...) more over, there should be diseases like aids, that is a major factor today in many countries, and drug problems too( i am not sure that getting those two in is possible, but try thinking about it)
I have read about provinces ideas, its realistic, but too complicated, although , when you control such a big empire, its not possible that you wouldnt have problems, so the most common solution is that if your leadership is a failure, and your approval rates are low(lots of civil disorder,losing wars, and so on) those far away cities can suddenly revolt and become nuetral(once again, a lot of us feel that neutral cities can add a lot for the game)
Another realistic option that is very hard to implement is the UN role in the game, there should be one in the modern times, but i have no idea how to put it in, do you?(i havent seen any specific suggestions on this at the forum)
Bring those back from the Civ2!!!!!
Give us back the spy!! we all liked it alot, the new espionage system isnt much fun ,and the spy is the most important unit to represent terrorists who sabotage your city, poison water, and blow up, i think its fair to say we want it back!
The sentry command, god damnet, we miss it...
Partisans were awsome,and realistic, how come they are gone?!
We want the Wonders movies just like in Civ2, it was great, and now it feels so empty when i build the Statue of Liberty...
Where are the Airfields(Once again, no one understands why they are gone, i sure hope its not related to the fact they will be on the expansion pack...)
Good things on Civ3 that has to be kept and developed!!
The resource and luxury system is the major improvement of the game, great job, keep on developing it(add more resources and luxuries like gas, and oil in water squares, and dont go back to those stupid trade rouths from civ2... )
Civ3 is making a good job at making the game simple,and not tiresome, keep it going in Civ4, we dont want double irrigation, and trade routes. on that subject, the idea of food supply exchange between cities should be done only if it wont be complicated for us to manage
Keep on working on the AI, make it better, and i mean better , not by letting them cheat... lets face it , this game cant work well on multiplayer, the AI is very very important.
Borders are a great idea, so great that they should be sacred, so that if you attack a unit that is within your borders, its not a war act, and its legal, god damnet, if a mexican bunch of settlers and 2 armor divisions get into texas, will Bush ask them politely to leave for 3 years?!
Light changes that will make the game more comfortable
THE diplomacy screen, combine all the civs together, no one likes it that they dont all fit in one screen , i once havent talked to the americans through the entire game, cause i forgot they were even there!
We are all troubled that a F-16 jet fighter cant destroy a warrior,or a bomber cant sink a frigate, i dont know why, but it doesnt make sense, i know it is for the balance of the game, but you guys at civ team have to sort it out for us, realism is important, as i said before...
Multiple unit movement- its bugging most of us, make it more efficient, in the late stages of the game most of the time goes for ordering units around...
An ability to build canals would be nice...
An option that will allow you to wake all your units, lets say, if you plan to attack, or you were surprise attack, you might miss fortified and sentried units , so wake them all up with a click of a button!
War weariness should not occur in civs that were betrayed and attacked, and are fighting for the existence, and it should be linked to the success on the battlefield, lost units are not just strategic tools, they are your citizen's family, and if the cause is wrong and the death toll is high, it should be linked to war weariness (did anyone say Vietnam?)
There must be more World wonders: Eiffel tower, World trade center
, Taj Mahal, Internet, Hubbble Telescope , and much much more!There should be more goverment types, such as Syndicalism, Fascism and so on...(not more than 3 though, it will mess things up!)
There should be about 3 leaders you can choose from every civ, if you are england, you can choose one of them stupid kings, or maybe sexy Thatcher, or the only god of history, WINSTON CHURCHILL.
well, thats it, i hope some of you are still reading this, and start commenting, i just want this to be a messege that would clarify to firaxis we deserve more if we buy the game again, i hope it can even make a diffrence.
if you agree to all this, just say it, so we can have a large number of names connected to this list, and if we debate about something, then we will post a survey and decide democratically
take care!!!
