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Outplayed by the AI, share your sad stories

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by PaulisKhan, Jul 2, 2009.

  1. PaulisKhan

    PaulisKhan Physicist

    Joined:
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    I was interesting in seeing how many people who have been in a dominant position in a game of civ only to lose to a backdoor AI victory because they weren't paying proper attention.

    I'll start the ball rolling.

    I was playing a HoF space game which usually involves rushing a bunch of civs and leaving just a couple of tradepartners alive to help backfil the techs.

    So there I was with most of the available land to myself, Mansa and Gandhi backed into a corner with different religions. I had both at a level where they would trade me the techs I needed and everything was on track for one of my quickest finishes ever.

    Mansa and I are Jewish, Gandhi is Buddhist. Of course Gandhi builds the AP first just to annoy me but I'm not fussed, I rarely pay attention to religion other than as a relationship modifier.
    The AP vote for leader comes up and naturally Gandhi is the only candidate.
    A few turns later the first resolution comes up "Diplomatic Victory"

    At this point I'm vaguely aware of religious victory as something that apparently happens in other peoples games but I control 80% of the old world landmass on a terra map, have a huge techlead and over a dozen very productive cities with more being settled at that very moment. I'm about to hit two consecutive MoM fueled goldens ages (48 turns of GA!) from the coloseum event and the Taj Mahal with a GProph ready to fire off a third if I feel I need it at at that point.

    Next turn I get the message

    "Gandhi has won a diplomatic victory". Apparently Mansa voted for Gandhi at pleased despite sharing different religions. I'm left scratching my head and looking like an idiot.


    :lol:

    Grats Gandhi!
     
  2. Tatran

    Tatran Deity

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    Wang Kon only used 4 casings and got lucky with the RNG. :mad:

     
  3. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    Inca builds the UN.

    I have a higher net diplo displayed with everybody in the world who matters. They are also friendly with him but have less + total.

    All three nations with a higher net diplo displayed toward me voted for inca instead.

    Similar to PK's example where musa voted for someone in a different religion, this is an example of getting raped by hidden modifiers. That was the second way I learned the interface could lie to the player about the AIs relative disposition.

    The first way resulted in a loss too. Friendly alexander, who was huge and my ticket to winning, declared on me. What? The no war probs say that's impossible! It was only after I pointed this out that someone mentioned to me that the civ IV interface lies to the player, deliberately misleads them by showing a - diplo that doesn't begin to represent reality, and puts them in a losing position if they're not aware of the lie.

    I've also lost a game here and there to an INSTANT WHEOOHRN on contact, because I'm a worst enemy. What? I'm in free religion...there should be no demerits! What? It's because you cheated to detect my trade with the worst enemy? There's more? The mere act of doing this isn't capped, so it can make ME a worst enemy?

    The only other way I got a "backdoor" loss to the AI was a very huge shaka in one of the LHC games. He was ridiculously large but backwards...but that didn't stop him from toting his vassals during UN resolutions, and the RNG actually picked correctly for a change: diplo win.
     
  4. Cronos

    Cronos Chieftain

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    Sydney
    Yes I was going to win a diplomatic victory, my vassal Ramesses was the other candidate and it was the perfect puppet election :lol:

    Ramesses, however, somehow managed to screw up the elections and voted for himself instead of me... then Isabella snuck in a Space race victory just to rub salt into the wounds.

    I thought mistakenly that your vassal would vote for you in all elections.... not to be!! It was especially galling as there were something like 17 civs running around and i was only around 50 votes off.

    Civ4ScreenShot0126.JPG
     
  5. civvver

    civvver Deity

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    I've heard you mention this before. Does this mean his attitude wasn't really friendly toward you, or that he can declare war at friendly? Is there any way to know his real attitude?
     
  6. Killroyan

    Killroyan Deity

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    Everybody always tells you that Sitting Bull is a pacifist but in one of my games he somehow came to hate my guts. He attacked me and dragged his 3 religious buddies into the game. They managed to get 3 SoD outside one of my border cities. Lost 3 cities after that.

    Outplayed by Alex on a arboretum map (the one with all the trees). He declared war on me from the other side of the island. I thought what could happen. He marched with a stack of 12 phalanxes straight to my capital. Wooooooooooops.

    And I hate it when that same Alex declares on me in another game and comes with a SOD with 45 cavalry !!!!! in it. I was defending my city with 20 infantries and already sacked 10-15 canons on that stack. He lost about 75% of his stack but took my city. I guessed I will retake it, but then his second SoD comes in with 20 more cavalry. That will teach you not to watch the power ratings :)

    About not getting a diplo win because of the hidden modifiers, I hate that too. Here you are having +14 with a certain leader and he votes for the one with +9. What the hell??? :p
     
  7. RRRaskolnikov

    RRRaskolnikov Goldfish

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    Same as you... I lost to Gandhi in one of my attempt at GMajor 51. Had destroyed the americans and Gandhi... and the little guy was down to one 1/2 cities!... Obviously it's enough to build the AP :rolleyes: I was on Ashoka when the message popped (in the early ADs): "Gandhi won a religious victory" ... :lol:
    And we lost a SG with Toku this way too... I think... Apocalypse Now :D
    Finally, I remember being crushed in monarch/marathon by Shaka the insane with more than 140 units in a stack (knights, muskets, grenadiers, and cannons)... :cry: conclusion: when you share a continent with him, don't let him go on conquest while you tech peacefully to space.
     
  8. Fluxx

    Fluxx Mr. Almost There

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    Hmmmm.

    I had a game along time ago on a continents like map.

    I controlled my entire continent, which was like 40-45% of the entire landmass. I build a good sized naval invasion force, and was just about to go for Willem.

    The moment I hit my fleet in the water and when I am 2 turns away from his land, a diplo vic question pops up, and you guess it already he actually wins the diplo vic, because the entire world hated me because I just was an evil warmongerer.

    The worst TWO losses were that barb event in 3250 that came for the Indians, but instead they went for me and I lost in 3100 BC.
    Also my first game on Deity, where Cyrus Dow'd on me around 1800 BC with a stack of 12 Immortals.
     
  9. TwoShedsJackson

    TwoShedsJackson Chieftain

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    Yeah I always check who has the most culture in their cities before I decide on whether to go for Domination or Space Race. It's only happened a couple times but it's painful to sit through a couple of hours of hitting Enter while you build the ship only to have Gandhi (or Sitting Bull, they're the main culprits) win a cultural victory two turns before the ship lands.
     
  10. J-man

    J-man Deity

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    I once lost an OCC, I was building my space and Montezuma(!) won a cultural victory.
     
  11. uncarved block

    uncarved block Prince

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    You don't just have to watch the power ratings, or the land and population percentages on the F8 screen, but the Culture as well. I learned this the hard way after what I thought was a rather well played game. Hemispheres, IIRC, with three AIs on my land mass. Got pinched for territory early by Hatty, and even though I usually find her a good neighbor, there was nowhere else to go but through her after a while. Took two cities, and she capitulated very quickly. It was good for a long time; she was a good trade partner, and strong enough to actually help a little when I went to war later. Unfortunately, I didn't take any of her three starting cities, and didn't realize things were going to end badly until her capital hit Legendary . . when I realized there was nothing I could do to stop the other two from getting there either, since I'd beaten the heck out of our neighbors. Oops!

    Now I make sure to take a fair number of cities off an AI before I end the war.
     
  12. Tatran

    Tatran Deity

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    IIRC, you can use spies against your vassals.
     
  13. superclean

    superclean Chieftain

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    I always drive straight to the capital when I am at war now, some advice I took from Attacko, always helps avoid AI winning cultural, which happened to me a lot in earlier games (usually when I was trying to win cultural myself.)
     
  14. JTMacc99

    JTMacc99 That's a paddlin'

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    Yeah. I learned a hard lesson from Mansa once. DON'T accept a volunteer vassal if he or she happens to have a pretty clear shot at a cultural victory. I tried like hell to win a domination victory before he got that third city up over the limit, but I fell just short.
     
  15. Guardian_PL

    Guardian_PL Emperor

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    Curious - can't you just amass Spies into said city and keep it in permarevolt while you're stomping others for Domination? Just wondering...
     
  16. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    If you notice sooner, you can sabotage all their health buildings in one of the culture cities, then poison water.

    The effect is knocking that city down to 1 pop, and it's cheaper than repeated revolts.
     
  17. JTMacc99

    JTMacc99 That's a paddlin'

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    Ooh. Both good ideas. I didn't think about spies at the time.
     
  18. Charonicus

    Charonicus Warlord

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    Once back in the early days I misclicked during AP voting and voted for the Ai instead of myself. Not exactly a case of being outplayed by the AI but boy was my face red when they won the next turn.
     
  19. PaulisKhan

    PaulisKhan Physicist

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    haha nice one!
     
  20. Meatbuster

    Meatbuster formerly Robo Kai

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    I hate you De Gaulle.
    We were at +11 relations since 1200 AD, and I never refused a demand.
    When 1600 AD came about I saw a fleet of 5 galleons and 4 frigates. I thought he was going to dogpile on my enemy but those guys landed on my shores after a war declaration. Turns out all those 5 galleons were full of units. And my entire army was on a rampage just over on the neighboring continent.

    All right, someone please tell me about those "lying" modifiers... or is De Gaulle just a backstabber like Alex...

    No one ever won a cultural victory under my nose though. I'm paranoid and I always watch that victory screen once in a while. I get those freak AI diplomatic victories once in a while, though. I swear that there's always a conspiracy inside every game with diplo victory on.
     

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