Blackmantle
King
Lately the Grigori (and Illians, but they are not finished yet so not fair to talk about them) where reduced to the point where they seem extremely dull and streamlined.
They have been barred from Druids (which have massively improved in 0.31 / thanks to what happend to divines in the meantime. Something the Grigori couldn't even leverage to the full anywas even if they had Druids since they are barred from Priests.
So Agnostic whould hamper them here one way or the other.) by the Lunator-Change to Druid-UU (can understand flavorwise but its a bit painful to be forced to nature Mana for Terraforming.),
Can't adopt a religion (which is allright. Thats their flavor and fits them well like ever.),
have suffered badly from changing bulbing and merging of sorc / summoning (the combination of the two is what really is painful albeit the change understandable in light of simplicity and Meteor-Shower.
).
and most importantly seem to have accidently been denied access to Over- and Undercouncil
(since the changes to under- and overcouncil seem to indicate they are aimed at removing problems with the agnostics founding Esus / Empyrean and this change of Honor and Deception hasn't appeared anywhere in the Changelog so i guess its a bug / unintentional or at least unthought about change)
, defensive pacts, Trojan Horse and Heroic Epic (that one is especially odd for a civ that values highly exeptional human/mortal achievements) /as well as Shadows lategame (and HN-Assassins/Rangers midgame).
All those things not only hurt diversity and strength but also are utterly out of flavor for the Grigori
(the councils are places for mortals to handle the affairs of Erebus instead of gods after all. Even beyond the boundaries of Grigori soil. Thats a place where you whould expect Cassiel or the Grigori emmisaries presence and endorsement first and foremost. Not shy away from them like they where plagued by a deadly disease.)
Add to that the improved Deis Dei and Nox Nocturnis they will be barred from if they stay the way they are.
Taken together its just to much to make them interesting in any major way.
Perhaps its time to get them back acess to Honor and Deception?
The changes to council-voting lately (start not by shrine but by 2 members) as well as to spreading Esus in 0.32 should make Illians / Grigori reaching those Techs first not such a big deal anymore (and their weight could be reduced a bit as well to make that a bit less likely).
Even reintroduction of Driuds whould seem ok should Grigori Medics be nerfed (which might be in line of Flavor. As of now they take the Part of Druids + High Priests of the other Civs in casting Religios Tier 3 Spells.
Could be ok to let it that way though to mitigate at least some of the dire restraints they face now. Even though its counter-intuitive and spread of religions in Grigori lands is utterly random depending on Game.)
Also since Nox Nocturnis can be build by a greath Merchant, even agnostic AIs founding Esus may not take that religion out of the game. (Honor should offer an Ecclastic anyways if i remember correctly.) Unlike it has been before where Esus where out most of the time when anyone founded them save a player.
They may still be playable / or even powerful? measured by sheer strength but suffered alot fun-wise by barring them from elemental features of the game / shadow phase. (Now they are simple-minded rushers like doviello or Clan (even worse in terms of diversity
). Doesn't really fit them in any way.And most asuredly not their flavor at all.
They are said / aimed to exell in any field save the divine path since they value individual empowerment of mortals. So you whould expect that the Grigori bring fourth the most powerful individuals save rare Exeptions (Heroes and World Units) Currently they can only do Melee in any useful way which overshadows the others. And dwarves rival them in that field with their awesome production-capacity + soon their ability to build battering rams.)
So please for the sake of the players who really like the Grigori: Put some attention to them (im not such a big grigori-player/fan now compared to other civs even though i liked them alot in 0.16. I shelved the one test-game i did in 0.31. fastly for lack of anything fun to do. For melee/mounted-Rushing Clan with Warrens/ Wolfriders seems much more impressive and i don't even like that very much with them.)
Whould surely be very fortunate for them if such a change might make it to 0.32.
They have been barred from Druids (which have massively improved in 0.31 / thanks to what happend to divines in the meantime. Something the Grigori couldn't even leverage to the full anywas even if they had Druids since they are barred from Priests.
So Agnostic whould hamper them here one way or the other.) by the Lunator-Change to Druid-UU (can understand flavorwise but its a bit painful to be forced to nature Mana for Terraforming.),
Can't adopt a religion (which is allright. Thats their flavor and fits them well like ever.),
have suffered badly from changing bulbing and merging of sorc / summoning (the combination of the two is what really is painful albeit the change understandable in light of simplicity and Meteor-Shower.
).and most importantly seem to have accidently been denied access to Over- and Undercouncil
(since the changes to under- and overcouncil seem to indicate they are aimed at removing problems with the agnostics founding Esus / Empyrean and this change of Honor and Deception hasn't appeared anywhere in the Changelog so i guess its a bug / unintentional or at least unthought about change)
, defensive pacts, Trojan Horse and Heroic Epic (that one is especially odd for a civ that values highly exeptional human/mortal achievements) /as well as Shadows lategame (and HN-Assassins/Rangers midgame).
All those things not only hurt diversity and strength but also are utterly out of flavor for the Grigori
(the councils are places for mortals to handle the affairs of Erebus instead of gods after all. Even beyond the boundaries of Grigori soil. Thats a place where you whould expect Cassiel or the Grigori emmisaries presence and endorsement first and foremost. Not shy away from them like they where plagued by a deadly disease.)
Add to that the improved Deis Dei and Nox Nocturnis they will be barred from if they stay the way they are.
Taken together its just to much to make them interesting in any major way.
Perhaps its time to get them back acess to Honor and Deception?
The changes to council-voting lately (start not by shrine but by 2 members) as well as to spreading Esus in 0.32 should make Illians / Grigori reaching those Techs first not such a big deal anymore (and their weight could be reduced a bit as well to make that a bit less likely).
Even reintroduction of Driuds whould seem ok should Grigori Medics be nerfed (which might be in line of Flavor. As of now they take the Part of Druids + High Priests of the other Civs in casting Religios Tier 3 Spells.
Could be ok to let it that way though to mitigate at least some of the dire restraints they face now. Even though its counter-intuitive and spread of religions in Grigori lands is utterly random depending on Game.)
Also since Nox Nocturnis can be build by a greath Merchant, even agnostic AIs founding Esus may not take that religion out of the game. (Honor should offer an Ecclastic anyways if i remember correctly.) Unlike it has been before where Esus where out most of the time when anyone founded them save a player.
They may still be playable / or even powerful? measured by sheer strength but suffered alot fun-wise by barring them from elemental features of the game / shadow phase. (Now they are simple-minded rushers like doviello or Clan (even worse in terms of diversity
). Doesn't really fit them in any way.And most asuredly not their flavor at all. They are said / aimed to exell in any field save the divine path since they value individual empowerment of mortals. So you whould expect that the Grigori bring fourth the most powerful individuals save rare Exeptions (Heroes and World Units) Currently they can only do Melee in any useful way which overshadows the others. And dwarves rival them in that field with their awesome production-capacity + soon their ability to build battering rams.)
So please for the sake of the players who really like the Grigori: Put some attention to them (im not such a big grigori-player/fan now compared to other civs even though i liked them alot in 0.16. I shelved the one test-game i did in 0.31. fastly for lack of anything fun to do. For melee/mounted-Rushing Clan with Warrens/ Wolfriders seems much more impressive and i don't even like that very much with them.)
Whould surely be very fortunate for them if such a change might make it to 0.32.
