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Pachacuti? NO - should be Pachacutec.

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by HiRezAudio, Jan 21, 2021.

  1. HiRezAudio

    HiRezAudio Prince

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    The 'leader name' of the Inca - in game as 'Pachacuti' is in reality incorrect, as Pachacuti is a term used for a period of 500 years of time, and not a name of a person as it means 'When the World turns over', whereas 'Pachacutec' (who was an actual Inca ruler, and a very famous one who massively expanded the Inca empire) means 'Earth Shaker' or 'One Who Turns The World Over'.
    The root word Pacha is a Quechua term that means 'Earth' or 'World', and the way the Inca used to look at time was in periods of 500 years with a time of Dark followed by a time of Light, each period being 500 years. The last Pachacuti was in 1992, when we entered the period of Light. The previous one was in 1492.........and we all know what happened then.

    It's a subtle difference, but really should be changed IMO.
     
    Guandao and conorbebe like this.
  2. Republic of San Montuoso

    Republic of San Montuoso King

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    HAHA ! Jokes on you: in French, it's already Pachacutec!
    Once again we show the inherent superiority of French language over English!
    (Don't mind the silent letters, the superfluous vowels, the surnumerous diacritics, our silly grammatical rules, our nonsensical colloquialisms and 97; the rest is utterly perfect)
     
  3. HiRezAudio

    HiRezAudio Prince

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    Pardon? I thought you were talking about the French language - the silent letters, superfluous vowels, silly grammatical rules, nonsensical colloquialisms etc are all English language 'gotchas' :crazyeye:
    Still - just to be serious for a minute, it's good to know you have it right en francais - c'est tres bien!
     
    Hellenism Salesman likes this.
  4. Uberfrog

    Uberfrog Deity

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    Yes, and “Montezuma” should be Motēuczōma and “Genghis Khan” should be Chinggis Khaan.

    Firaxis just use the common modern English versions, which are often quite different from any name the real person would have recognised.
     
    LMT, Mahi, Morningcalm and 8 others like this.
  5. HiRezAudio

    HiRezAudio Prince

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    Sorry chap, but you are missing the point.
    Pachacuti is simply not a personal name - it is a period of time. We are not talking about a spelling variation here, but a total error on Firaxis' part.
    It's like having 'Queen Century of England' instead of Queen Victoria.
     
  6. Republic of San Montuoso

    Republic of San Montuoso King

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    For a better translation, it would be like we'd have "Victorian Era is leading England in Sid Meier's Civilization Vi!"
     
  7. Uberfrog

    Uberfrog Deity

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    I am agreeing with you...

    I know it is an error, but Pachacuti is just how he is most commonly referred to in English (see: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pachacuti). I’m not saying that is how things should be, but it doesn’t really matter what it means (or doesn’t) in Quechua.

    Montezuma is strictly gibberish in Nahuatl. It would be like saying Queen Vintaria.
     
    Mahi, oakdragon, Morningcalm and 9 others like this.
  8. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    That would be the case if Firaxis had created the mistake, but they're just adopting common usage, so Uberfrog's comparison still applies.
     
  9. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    Not going to lie, when I first saw the title of the thread I thought it was about a whole different topic.
    I only saw the letter “e” and not the letter “c.” :mischief:

    Anyway not sure if it’s a major over sight or not. General audiences now the name Ghengis Khan over Temujin, which doesn’t it translate to just “Great Leader?”

    I am sure this is no different.
     
  10. Vandlys

    Vandlys Prince

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    Like others said, it's simply common usage in English to say Pachacuti. There are many "mistakes" in language that have now become common usage, that's actually a part of the evolution of language.

    If, for example, I start referring to you as HiRezAuto, and 99% of the other people here start doing that too, it might become the new standard after a while. Then, after decades someone will say "Hey, that guy wasn't actually called HiRezAuto!" but it doesn't matter, because it now has become another name for you.

    Had Pachacuti been commonly known in English as a Quecha term for "Greatest leader" even if no one else called him that, you wouldn't have opened this topic, because it would just be a different name. And now, because the error made is so close to the actual truth, it's easier to say it should be corrected. But, in reality, since it's common usage, it can be viewed as "correct". Just like some grammar will change, some inflections will change, some words will change.

    There are plenty of "real" mistakes in Civ VI though, like "Some stroopwafel" when Wilhelmina sends you an envoy, meaning you get some crumbs : P
     
  11. Zaarin

    Zaarin Chief Medical Officer, DS9

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    I wouldn't mind seeing more linguistically accurate leader (and city and civ) names, but Firaxis consistently uses the standard English forms. If they weren't consistent, you'd have a point, but as is you're complaining about the naming convention of one leader and ignoring all the others.
     
  12. anonxanemone

    anonxanemone Warlord

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    This cannot be emphasized enough here. Languages evolved and is currently undergoing an evolution. Though English seems static, you can see the divergences of pronunciation in the Anglosphere (UK, US, Australia, New Zealand, etc.) in the span of decades. If interested, check out the theory abour the Great Vowel Shift.
     
  13. Zaarin

    Zaarin Chief Medical Officer, DS9

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    I mean, it's not a theory. It's a well-documented linguistic fact. You can see something similar (but less drastic) happening right now in North America with the Northern Cities Vowel Shift.
     
  14. anonxanemone

    anonxanemone Warlord

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    Last time I checked, there were still room for debate about the phenomenon but it's been a while being up to date on the scholarship. Haha
     
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  15. Pfeffersack

    Pfeffersack Deity

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    German language features it as well (and as a bonus the non-nickname for L6S):

    Pachacutec.jpg
     
  16. Linklite

    Linklite Prince

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    The problem is name recognition. If you go for the "true" names, a lot of the big draws would lose their appeal. A lot of people would say "Temujin? Who on Earth is that! Now, if they had Genghis Khan, I'd be interested. Guess I'll play as Victoria again". Similar for Al-Nasir Salah al-Din Yusuf ibn Ayyub. Saladin is just more recognisable.

    I mean, Pachacuti is somewhat less along those lines (I've never heard of him outside of Civ VI context, at least), but they're using the English convention for other names, so they're just being consistent.

    In tangential but related lines, is Pachacutec related at all to Pachakutik from MCU?
     
  17. Zaarin

    Zaarin Chief Medical Officer, DS9

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    Yes. The Quechua spelling is Pachakutiq.
     
  18. Evie

    Evie Pronounced like Eevee

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    Yeah, people aren't THAT dumb. There are benefits to using the familiar name but you're grossly exaggerating them.
     
  19. Linklite

    Linklite Prince

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    Because only dumb people wouldn't connect Temujin with Genghis Khan.
     
  20. Evie

    Evie Pronounced like Eevee

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    They might not know at first (and that's why the known name is better), but once you see someone named Temujn leading Mongolia it's really easy to figure out with even one little post on CFC or twitter or one little search on Google or wiki, or from reading the civilopedia, or from just interacting with the leader in the game.
     

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