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Peaceful Deity Science Victory in 150T PERICLES & 157T Lucky ROME (VIDEO) - Strategy and Discussion

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by civtrader6, Jan 19, 2018.

  1. Boyan_Sun

    Boyan_Sun Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2017
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    There is no change to the chop value. The overflow exploit is still powerful (and it can be doubled by Magnus, which makes it ultimate powerful)
     
  2. Athmos

    Athmos Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
    Messages:
    236
    I don't think overflow management is a bug or an exploit.

    Overflow (for everything, i.e. science and culture as well as production) was introduced in civ 4, as optimal civ 3 gameplay required a ton of micromanagement not to waste extra production when completing a build or extra science when completing a research, etc...
    The mechanism was patched a few times after launch to correctly apply the relevant bonuses. The way it worked was the following (values invented for demonstration purpose) :
    - Let's say we have a 50/60 completed builder, a 100% bonus on prod to builder, when we chop a forest for 40 prod.
    - 5 of these 40 would be applied to complete the worker (5+% = 10)
    - the remaining overflow (here, 35 prod) is applied to the next build.
    - if the next build has a applicable bonus (or penalty), it is applied to this production as well.

    I think this system made great sense and was much less exploitable (there were other issues with slavery production). I don't know if the way it works in 6 is simply an oversight of the devs that stayed in, or actually a conscious decision to use a simpler mechanism that is more easily understandable by players - just apply the bonus applicable at the time of chopping, and put the production in the production buffer of the city.
    I suspect it is quite possibly the later. Game design usually doesn't work like dedicated players think it should.

    Additional rant :
    For example, the poor UI of civ 6 is hiding a lot of very important info in various hidden screens, to the point were playing without UI mods become very tedious if you want to play the game optimally/competitively. I'm reasonably certain that these were conscious decisions to remove as much data and specially numbers from the UI, as a large part of the consumer base is supposed to be afraid of complexity. From a UX designer point of view, everything is clutter. I work with some of these guys in my job, they want everything to look like an Iphone wallpaper and don't understand that information can actually be useful to users, even in business applications.

    Apparently no one at Firaxis thought a complete UI was enough of an asset for their game to have it in. I mean, an "advanced UI" toggle in option would be fine to make UX designers and "casual" players happy with the default one (If these casual players are actually what Firaxis think they are, and they are not just defaulting to treating the public like it's stupid).
     
    TheMeInTeam likes this.
  3. SharTeel

    SharTeel Chieftain

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    Overflow into a related build (settler into settler with the card for example, or space projects) is not an exploit for sure, but abusing cards to build otger things, like a district in 1 turn, is an exploit for sure :p
     
  4. Athmos

    Athmos Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
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    Well, that's just the way it works, it's a game mechanic and so it's one more tool at our disposal. Using game mechanics to their fullest extent is not an exploit "by definition", you'll need to argue to convince me.

    If for example the AI valued something as more expansive when they buy it from you than when you buy it from them, that would be a clear bug and using it to generate infinite gold would be an exploit. If you could use a bug to clip your archer in an impassable tile and make it impossible to attack while still able to attack, that would be an exploit. The overflow system and the way it is computed is just a game mechanic, which you can understand or not, and use or not, but it's just one rule of the game.

    I know the civ 4 crowd from RB was appalled at the way overflow was implemented from day1 of civ6 release (I was among them), but well, in the end we can only play the game by its rules, and stupid overflow management is in. It's not an exploit simply because you think it's too powerful compared relatively to your own private metric.
     
    TheMeInTeam likes this.
  5. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,430
    Me, the chop in GOTM32 is smaller by 33%, this was before R&F was applied.
     

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