Sovietof17
Prince
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2005
- Messages
- 304
I really need any and all help anyone can provide for the Persian UHV, specifically the 2nd milestone. Please note I only play on regent as I find all of these uhvs hard enough. Note that vassalization does nothing for you at all in any of these UHVs, so never vassalize unless you want to lose.
Please note UHV #1 requires cultural control of every tile of your road if you try this UHV.
Zeroth, Ill talk about my civics and justify them
Monarchy, Slavery, Deification, Merchant Trade, Hegemony
Monarchy: There's really no other viable option here, I believe.
Slavery: Pick up an army of workers as you conquer. In my opinion, far more awesome than manorialism.
Deification: Debatable I think, but you need 10 wonders, unsure if clergy applies to wonder building or not. Cheaper economically
Merchant trade: I switch when I have hegemony and this. Doubles your trade routes. Awesome.
Hegemony: More money for conquering cities? Sure
First, I'll talk about my tech order and explain it
Mathematics, Cement, Engineering, Contract, Generalship, Currency, Aesthetics, Architecture ....
Mathematics: Bridges so my armies can move faster
Cement: Build the qanat, mausoleum wonder.
Engineering: +1 road movement, in my opinion, an absolute must for conquering the world.
Contract: Prereq for Generalship
Generalship: Gives access to Saravans, War Elephants. Hegemony
Currency: Silk Road
Aesthetics: Pre req to Architecture
Architecture: UHV 3
Second, I'll talk about my game plan and why I do it:
0. Spread Zorastriasm throught my Empire
0. Build all the wonders in Parsa [apadana, mauso, gondashepur but I ran out of time]
1. Conquer Babylon
2. Conquer Assyria
3. Conquer Hittites
4. Complete the road to Anatolia
5. Conquer the Greeks
6. Conquer the Phoenicians
7. Conquer the Egyptians
...
Rationales
Spreading Zoroanistriasm is necessary as you're going to need 8 cities with 8 temples to make 4 cathedrals. Also aligns with the goal to have 8 cities with a 1000 culture.
Wonders in Parsa: It's far away, has decent production, and seems to be the only city in your empire benefitting from the Qanat, which makes it the best choice I think
Conquer Babylon: It melts instantly to your massive army of Immortlas which hard counter its few archer defenders. A huge economic center and population center for UHV2.
Conquer Assyria: They also fall over to your large army and they are in the way of your road.
Conquer Hittites: Pretty much the same as Assyria. One time I was unlucky and they had like 8(!) archers
Conquer Greece: You need to do this as soon as possible. If you don't Greece will lauch an invasion into your heartland, which in my opinion, is simply game over, as their units are all diamond hard counters to yours. You need CATAPULTS to touch Athens, at least 2, because the Hoplites will easily shred your Immortals without them. You need SWORDSMEN as the primary city attacker here. When I had conquered Greece the last attempt, I was lucky as they built Byzantium and the Colossus for me. Nice.
Conquer Egypt: Immortals will work great here. Note that Egypt's population (the 2 main cities, not the coastal city) should put you over 35% easily. They will have WAR CHARIOTS so watch out for these. And watch out as conquering egypt cuts you off for a long time from egypt as the culture needs to cover uncrossable tiles. Your army is stuck there.
Where I'm failing:
I'm not able to achieve the 10 wonders. My best is 7. So let's review my last game and what existed in the world. In the whole world, there were 9 wonders. I had 2 under construction.
Thoughts: Saravans could be a game loss trap? Tech to something else to get a wonder for UHV 2? Is there really time to build it?
My built wonders:
* Great mausoleum
* Apadana Palace
My under construction wonders:
* Gondashepur: 4 turns left, at 300bc, probablly doable for sure if I played better.
* Al Khazneh: 64 turns left, at 300 bc, impossible I would say. Requires Judaism and an oasis. Good luck, lol
My conquered wonders:
Oracle: athens
Colossus: Byz
Sphinx+Pyramids: inebu-hedj
Ishtar Gate- Taouion
Other wonders in the world:
Hanging Gardens: Always built in Nubia every game I play. Conquerable, maybe, but Greece has to fall first.
Terracota Army: LOL
So that is the game state. Even if I played the best and finished Gondashepur and conquered Nubia's gardens, that leaves me 1 wonder short. So what are the possible candidates?
And before I discuss, let's discuss the near impossible requirements for an empire with a pre-chosen religion to build pagan wonders!
1. You have to shift your ____state___ religion to pagan. That's 1 precious turn for Persia flushed.
2. The city you are building in needs to be pagan, so luck could screw you if Zoro spreads there. It also means you're not getting any pagan wonders out early in your initial cities. Conquered cities only!
3. Ok, so you met requirements #1 and #2? Cool, let's talk about the CULTURAL requirements, something you are almost certainly unlikely to meet, because you are racing like mad against an insane clock at 300 BC! Athens had an Oracle? Byzantium had a Colussus? Lucky you, now you have to get those cities to _fledgling_ status just to start construction on the pagan wonders.
4. All of this means you're almost certainly not getting Gondashepur out. Definitely not.
Great Library: Requires Mazdaism religion, Philisophy, and Literature. None of these technoligies and that religion are in the path to your UHV victory. So it means you probably aren't getting any Saravans.
Gondashepur: 340 hammers. I wish you luck. Requires Zoro
Great Lighthouse: Requires Shipbuilding, Navigation, Mazdaism religion, 255 hammers, and a coastal city, so I guess that means Byzantium or Athens. You're not getting Saravans. Also fully useless for a mostly landlocked empire like Persia.
Hanging Gardens: You're not building it. Nubia is going to get it. Babylon will never build it. [Makes no sense. Frustrating]
Iron Pillar: If you reach into India, I guess this is possible. Requires Hinduism, Steel, Generalship, 425 hammers, so a productive Indian city. Likely a loss trap
Parthenon: Requires Math and Mazdaism state religion. Greeks arent building it.
Note: Great Mausoleum and Apadana Palace, and Gondashepur require Zoro as state religion, meaning that you can't be building, or need to build them, if you need pagan wonder and you are counting them as well.
Conclusion:
Unless you are lucky incarnate, the pagan wonders won't be ready made, easily reachable, or being built and ready for you to conquer. The UHV #2 goal is impossible without insane luck and multiple AIs constructing things you'll never be able to build yourself.
Please note UHV #1 requires cultural control of every tile of your road if you try this UHV.
Zeroth, Ill talk about my civics and justify them
Monarchy, Slavery, Deification, Merchant Trade, Hegemony
Monarchy: There's really no other viable option here, I believe.
Slavery: Pick up an army of workers as you conquer. In my opinion, far more awesome than manorialism.
Deification: Debatable I think, but you need 10 wonders, unsure if clergy applies to wonder building or not. Cheaper economically
Merchant trade: I switch when I have hegemony and this. Doubles your trade routes. Awesome.
Hegemony: More money for conquering cities? Sure
First, I'll talk about my tech order and explain it
Mathematics, Cement, Engineering, Contract, Generalship, Currency, Aesthetics, Architecture ....
Mathematics: Bridges so my armies can move faster
Cement: Build the qanat, mausoleum wonder.
Engineering: +1 road movement, in my opinion, an absolute must for conquering the world.
Contract: Prereq for Generalship
Generalship: Gives access to Saravans, War Elephants. Hegemony
Currency: Silk Road
Aesthetics: Pre req to Architecture
Architecture: UHV 3
Second, I'll talk about my game plan and why I do it:
0. Spread Zorastriasm throught my Empire
0. Build all the wonders in Parsa [apadana, mauso, gondashepur but I ran out of time]
1. Conquer Babylon
2. Conquer Assyria
3. Conquer Hittites
4. Complete the road to Anatolia
5. Conquer the Greeks
6. Conquer the Phoenicians
7. Conquer the Egyptians
...
Rationales
Spreading Zoroanistriasm is necessary as you're going to need 8 cities with 8 temples to make 4 cathedrals. Also aligns with the goal to have 8 cities with a 1000 culture.
Wonders in Parsa: It's far away, has decent production, and seems to be the only city in your empire benefitting from the Qanat, which makes it the best choice I think
Conquer Babylon: It melts instantly to your massive army of Immortlas which hard counter its few archer defenders. A huge economic center and population center for UHV2.
Conquer Assyria: They also fall over to your large army and they are in the way of your road.
Conquer Hittites: Pretty much the same as Assyria. One time I was unlucky and they had like 8(!) archers
Conquer Greece: You need to do this as soon as possible. If you don't Greece will lauch an invasion into your heartland, which in my opinion, is simply game over, as their units are all diamond hard counters to yours. You need CATAPULTS to touch Athens, at least 2, because the Hoplites will easily shred your Immortals without them. You need SWORDSMEN as the primary city attacker here. When I had conquered Greece the last attempt, I was lucky as they built Byzantium and the Colossus for me. Nice.
Conquer Egypt: Immortals will work great here. Note that Egypt's population (the 2 main cities, not the coastal city) should put you over 35% easily. They will have WAR CHARIOTS so watch out for these. And watch out as conquering egypt cuts you off for a long time from egypt as the culture needs to cover uncrossable tiles. Your army is stuck there.
Where I'm failing:
I'm not able to achieve the 10 wonders. My best is 7. So let's review my last game and what existed in the world. In the whole world, there were 9 wonders. I had 2 under construction.
Thoughts: Saravans could be a game loss trap? Tech to something else to get a wonder for UHV 2? Is there really time to build it?
My built wonders:
* Great mausoleum
* Apadana Palace
My under construction wonders:
* Gondashepur: 4 turns left, at 300bc, probablly doable for sure if I played better.
* Al Khazneh: 64 turns left, at 300 bc, impossible I would say. Requires Judaism and an oasis. Good luck, lol
My conquered wonders:
Oracle: athens
Colossus: Byz
Sphinx+Pyramids: inebu-hedj
Ishtar Gate- Taouion
Other wonders in the world:
Hanging Gardens: Always built in Nubia every game I play. Conquerable, maybe, but Greece has to fall first.
Terracota Army: LOL
So that is the game state. Even if I played the best and finished Gondashepur and conquered Nubia's gardens, that leaves me 1 wonder short. So what are the possible candidates?
And before I discuss, let's discuss the near impossible requirements for an empire with a pre-chosen religion to build pagan wonders!
1. You have to shift your ____state___ religion to pagan. That's 1 precious turn for Persia flushed.
2. The city you are building in needs to be pagan, so luck could screw you if Zoro spreads there. It also means you're not getting any pagan wonders out early in your initial cities. Conquered cities only!
3. Ok, so you met requirements #1 and #2? Cool, let's talk about the CULTURAL requirements, something you are almost certainly unlikely to meet, because you are racing like mad against an insane clock at 300 BC! Athens had an Oracle? Byzantium had a Colussus? Lucky you, now you have to get those cities to _fledgling_ status just to start construction on the pagan wonders.
4. All of this means you're almost certainly not getting Gondashepur out. Definitely not.
Great Library: Requires Mazdaism religion, Philisophy, and Literature. None of these technoligies and that religion are in the path to your UHV victory. So it means you probably aren't getting any Saravans.
Gondashepur: 340 hammers. I wish you luck. Requires Zoro
Great Lighthouse: Requires Shipbuilding, Navigation, Mazdaism religion, 255 hammers, and a coastal city, so I guess that means Byzantium or Athens. You're not getting Saravans. Also fully useless for a mostly landlocked empire like Persia.
Hanging Gardens: You're not building it. Nubia is going to get it. Babylon will never build it. [Makes no sense. Frustrating]
Iron Pillar: If you reach into India, I guess this is possible. Requires Hinduism, Steel, Generalship, 425 hammers, so a productive Indian city. Likely a loss trap
Parthenon: Requires Math and Mazdaism state religion. Greeks arent building it.
Note: Great Mausoleum and Apadana Palace, and Gondashepur require Zoro as state religion, meaning that you can't be building, or need to build them, if you need pagan wonder and you are counting them as well.
Conclusion:
Unless you are lucky incarnate, the pagan wonders won't be ready made, easily reachable, or being built and ready for you to conquer. The UHV #2 goal is impossible without insane luck and multiple AIs constructing things you'll never be able to build yourself.