PHAW 1.5: Rise of the Queen Mother Reprise (WL)

Well we've got a couple of options that I see.

Send 4-5 archers to Shaka for some howdy-doody and glee.

Get settler/archer to bronze site, hook it up and send 4-5 axes his way.

We should swap to slavery now and whip settler, letting overflow go to archer, finish barracks and spit out some archers hooray.

OOC: Have you pmed frank to let him know about this one pholk? :lol:

EDIT: xpost with pholk
 


If were gonna go that far to settle, we might as well go 1 tile further. It puts us on a hill, loses mountains and desert tiles, and still puts copper in first ring. It also has 3 other hills, so by farming tiles and it can work all the production tiles.
 
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i'd suggest settling 1SW on the hill. You get the river-tiles as well as additional hill defense and fresh water.
 
fox, i thought slowcar WAS suggesting dawg's spot ~ yeah, I didn't even think of going there, but it IS much more superior for the defense b/c we WILL get hammered quickly by north and south. If worse comes to worst, we can always settle to the east a couple tiles and, with creative, grab the copper in the 2nd ring.
 
I have serious doubts about taking out Shaka first. Sure we can build enough axes to take him out, but at what cost? That cost is letting the other civs develop rather peacefully. My suggestion is to send an axe to shaka first, let him pillage and generally stiffle him. Then send axes to the other civs and do the same. Im hoping we can find horses and send some Chariots/Axe teams to pillage. Only once thats done can we build an army and take out cities. Also, lets not build barracks right away, Id rather have the units. We can wait to build a barracks when it can be whipped for 2 pop. With the army we are gonna need, pillage money is gonna be crucial.
 
i agree on the barracks ~ perhaps sticking the whip overflow in the barracks adn working on it for a turn to keep the production for diminishing, but another archer or two might be better than the extra xp.

the pillage technique has merit, but once the other civs know we're hear, they'll stop developing peacefully and start moving for war...perhaps that means its all the better to start the choke early . . . i don't know . . . maybe we could choke w/some archers for now, as Ozzie has somewhat suggested??
 
I'm here and I'll play tonight.

First order of business will be to revolt to Slavery. Second, I assume is found the copper city. Did the settler finish in Moscow? What kind of garrison do we want to send along with him? Would two archers be enough? There isn't a lot of food at the copper site. I'm wondering how we're going to train a worker there to hook up the copper, assuming the capital will be building nothing but archers for the next few turnsets. Unless we send a worker from Moscow with a 2nd pair (or trio) of archers?

After Animal Husbandry, go for Horseback Riding if we have horses at either city site? And if not?

What kinds of promotions are good for archers? I've been playing around with a combination of city garrison-only and first-strike-only promotions with some success. CG3 archers and FirstStrike3 archers are pretty powerful in defensive and offensive modes, respectively while combining CG and 1stStrike on one unit doesn't seem to work as well. I see the AI using Combat promotions, too. I'd like to hear your preferences.

Oh, and it's good to have you back, pholkhero.
 
Since this is allways war, and we are gonna have to defend some key tiles, then the mold is set. Ie....we need offensive units. If an enemy archer sets foot on our copper in the open, I would rather have a Combat promoted archer rather than a City Garrison archer.
 
::glyph of frankcor smacking forehead::

Why didn't I think of that! The first couple of drill promotions aren't extremely useful. It's the 3rd and 4th ones that kick butt if the unit can survive long enough to get that well promoted. (a Drill IV Longbowman on attack can take out a Maceman) I'll go with Combat 1 and then maybe Drill after that.
 
the more i think about it, the more concerned i get ~ perhaps that city IS too much of a stretch.

They will, for all intents and purposes, need to be TWO separate centers of the empire since we won't be able to readily reinforce either one in case of danger.

Perhaps we forego copper (as I seem to be doing in w/Blake's AI since it's never around my start), use archers and chariots for now, and head for IW sooner rather than later (there alway seems to be plenty of Iron around ~)

maybe AH > Wheel if there's horsies > Agr > IW? I'm sure i'm forgetting some key techs, but just more thoughts to further muddy the waters.
 
The copper IS a stretch. Assuming our settler and worker could survive the journey to the copper site, is there enough food there to get the copper mined and whip some axemen before the city gets overrun? I don't think so.

Stretches are the kinds of game decisions that I always end up regretting as I concede a game to the AI -- this game always seems to know when I'm taking a gamble and it always makes me pay. I'd rather not be part of another PH sucession game loss ;) (there, that makes up for the butt-munching)

I'm looking at the save now. I may have some questions or suggestions. Or I might just play my 25 turns and report later. For sure, AH > wheel if there's horses > Agriculture > IW makes good sense to me.

I may wait to see if there are horses neaby before founding our second city.
 
I would much rather have that copper than let someone else get it. Even with 1 warrior/Archer garrison in the beginning, noone will be taking it down if its on that hill. It has some serious production. Found it, let it build an Archer, then let it build its own worker. Meanwhile, the capitol can send another Archer to protect the worker. IBT, the capitol can build worker for its self, chop Archer for its self, Archer for 3rd city, and chop settler for 3rd city (hopefully near horses).
 
I didn't go for the copper (sorry Cabledawg) but we do have horses.

I started off my turnset by revolting to Slavery as promised. During the anarchy, our scout introduced himself to a warrior from Carthage:


The very next turn, in an effort to reveal more of what turned out to be Rome's border, he unexpectedly got up close and personal with the warrior:


Our scout dodged the bullet and was left unmolested to explore much more. When we came out of anarchy, instead of whipping the settler:


I started an archer instead:


Our warrior was exploring to the south which left Moscow undefended. Putting some hammers into an Archer just felt kinda right to me. Besides, I was in no hurry to found a second city which would also be undefended. I whipped the Archer next turn and started another.

Our warrior paid a visit to Berlin and earned us 11 gold for pillaging their mine.


Later, he would earn another 7 pillaging a cornfield at Ulundi. Shaka has horses inside Ulundi's fat cross but they're not hooked up yet. He's mined a pig pasture on a hilltop there so he may not have AH yet.

In 2680BC we discovered Animal Husbandry and I was grateful that we'd made the decision not to go for Copper!


Putting Horse City on the hill SE of the Horses looked to me to be a no-brainer.

When the horses were revealed, I switched production from the second archer back to the settler.

While waiting for our settler to finish up, our Archers had some time to practice using their new bows, arrows and daggers:


Next turn, our Warrior greeted, then killed a Viking scout. After healing 2 turns, he then earned his Combat II promotion by killing a lion south of Zululand:


Meanwhile, our Scout, exploring the northern ice, earned his Woodsman I & II promotions by surving 4 wolf attacks in 3 turns without substaining a scratch! (thinking now, I could have given him Combat I and Medic I instead but he probably won't survive much longer anyways)

When our settler was completed, I returned to work on the 2nd Archer until Moscow grew to size 3 again at which point, I switched production to Worker.

As our settler approached his destination, I could see where the AI wanted us to plant Horse City:


I stuck with the hill decision.

In 2440BC:


Novgorod began work on an Archer.

So now, it's 2200BC and we have 60/660 turns completed. Here's our empire and its immediate neighbors:


And further west:


The worker in Moscow can be whipped next turn, the 2nd Archer will finish the turn after that. Be sure to put next turn of hammers into the barracks there or it'll start to decay. Our warrior is outside of Ulundi, adjacent to the pig mine. He has spotted a Roman Warrior, followed one-tile behind by the warrior from Carthage (can you tell I hate typing Carthaginian?) making a beeline towards Moscow. The Roman should emerge from the fog next turn so don't forget to whip the worker so the archer will finish in the following turn.

Lets get those horses hooked up and start pillaging!

Here's the save: Queen_Mother_BC-2200.CivWarlordsSave
 
OK got it. I'll wait another 24 hours before playing to get some feedback.

Whip worker, build archer and put hammers into barracks seems good.

Do we want Agriculture yet? I would go Wheel first (if we don't already have) and then the hard slog for Iron Working or Horseback Riding. An early military advantage is priceless here.
 
Sorry, Oz, I forgot to mention we researched Animal Husbandry and Wheel and started Agriculture. I think we need Iron Working next to find some metal close to home. If not, we'll need to fight our way to the copper site.
 
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