playing with germany ..early rush

[giraffman]

saw a post about how to win an early rush game clearing your continent... but cant find it now... luckily i made notes it says first build 2 warriors then a settler and try to get free wall , build up 10 armies but have your science no more than 30% , probably only 3 or 4 cities ,,,, can anyone make this a bit clearer before start a new game? ta muchly ps downloaded stacks of doom

 

[Shafi-is-back]

what level are you playing on? It all depends on that. I dont know about clearing your whole continent, usually i would settle for 1 or 2 close neighbours, thats good enough to win you the game.

Whole continent i have probably done a few times with Pret's, that too at Monarch level, never at emperor.

 

[giraffman]

only playing chieftan level , tried taking on russian city with i think 3 defenders inside with 3 archers 2 swordsman 2 spearmen and 2 warriors and still didnt take it , think i need catapults collateral damage.....thanks

 

[shulgi]

Spearmen can be good support for stacks but 4 strength is actually a lot less than axes or swords base strength due to how combat works - look up the mechanics of battle and damage. Archers really aren't attack units (except Sitting Bull, sorta). Without siege support, you probably need 2.5 attackers (swords or axes) per defender, probably 3 if the city's on a hill. Bring more units than you think you need is good advice, RNG is wonky.

Germany's pretty good since they start with mining and you can get bronze working very quickly.

 

[Shafi-is-back]

ok, so a rush on chieftain should be easy. you need either horses or copper to rush your neighbor.

tech AH and / or BW early hook up horses or copper and build a stack of around 8 axemen or chariots and then go knocking on your neighbors door. it'll be a walk over.

you can do this with one city, maybe you'll need two cities if you dont get copper or horses in your capital. (you'll need the 2nd city to hook up the resource)

try using Persia or Egypt, they have awsome chariot based UU's.

Dont forget you need to be chopping and whipping your army, dont waste your time on anything else, once you have horses / copper hooked just keep building chariots or axemen (whichever you will be using) until you have enough.

 

[giraffman]

thanks catherine got catapults before me and made it much more difficult

 

[Chase_2_Rabbits]

I don't think the AI starts with archery on chieftan, so if you have a 3 tile in your capital's BFC then you can just spam 6 warriors in ~24 turns from the off and go and take a nearby AI capital while it's still defended by a couple of warriors.

 

[Shafi-is-back]

^ above is true.

However for whatever reason, i was never successful at warrior rushes when i was playing at chieftain / warlord level , probably i did not micro manage which tiles i worked.

try the warrior rush, if it does'nt work for you, use axes or chariots, should work up to Emperor level, i cant comment beyond that.

 

[shulgi]

^ ^ This and it's a much better learning experience to actually build up your empire than just crank out warriors or whatever. I'd advocate rapid early expansion, worker techs, writing and move from there.

 

[capnvonbaron]

Honestly if you have copper in your BFC on chieftan, your first two neighbors should be dead in no time. It'll take them too long to get archers built, and all you'll need is one or two axemen (whipped or chopped out) for the first neighbor, and maybe a couple more for the next neighbor. You won't even need barracks first.

 

[giraffman]

yes ive killed my neighbours before on chieftan , just rushing warriors, but i was following instructions from a post on this site, which was titled playing with germany which i presume was playing to german strengths.... maybe im overcomplicating things, thanks for all your help

 

[shulgi]

IMHO it's best to learn how the game works on the lower levels as these are the strategies you'll need later on. Here's some things to think about: http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/strategy/sisiutil.php. Beginners should be encouraged to ask questions, so please do so.

 

[JSS]

I just tried just for fun rushing my neighbors with warriors on Noble. settled on a gold mine and worked a forested plains tile, pumped some warriors and took 2 neighbors with ease.

It seems to be a strategy that works on the lower difficulties, but I advise you learn to play the game the proper way. Don't rely on cheesy dead end strategies that only work on Noble, because you'll have to learn how to play the game eventually if you're planning on being able to beat the game on Immortal or Deity at some point.

 

[giraffman]

yes just read the strategy guide, it seems on lower levels the game is a little more forgiving, which is why i usually manage a warren g hardy time victory may eventually have to use the dot mapping technique so im producing more efficiently, want to go for each type of win on lower levels first

 

[giraffman]

didnt use any tricks , just going for resources, should i go for victoria next , or wait for panzer, though power map shows me quite high already

 

[vandermerwe]

Hard to say without more info or ideally a save... If the 4 cities we can see the only ones Vicky has then it certainly looks tempting. Only note of caution would be if Vicky had redcoats, which will give your cavalry (and I'm presumung that's what you'd use) a really hard time. If she's got a lot, you may need cannons, which will slow your cavalry down, although that wouldn't matter much over such a small area.

Also, just guessing from a zoomed-out map, but...
- some of your build orders in cities look odd. This is very late to be building granaries, libraries and forges in well-established cities. Everywhere should get a granary asap; libraries/unis/observatories and forges likewise in cities that are going to be good for research or production respectively. But only in those places. Don't build everything everywhere: it's a waste of hammers. And I've no idea why you want to move your capital a few squares to Frankfurt. Sisiutil's strategy guide has a good section on city specialisation, which is what you're probably not doing here.
- seems like you may be building too many roads and not enough tile improvements (and not enough farms in particular). Some of your cities are very small for this late in the game.
- you've got a lot of gold in the bank and are still accumulating a decent amount per turn. Either spend it on upgrading units to attack Vicky and/or run your research slider a bit higher.

 

[giraffman]

if you build a farm do you need a road through it, any improvement for that matter to get it to your city? if not i have been building to many roads.....thanks

 

[rah]

No just resources. (and that just for the happy/health/trading needs)
I'll wait to build all the extra roads that I'll want for the military aspects until the workers are less busy. If workers are idle, I'll always overbuild roads so I have redundant routes for my army.

 

[rfcfanatic]

Only note of caution would be if Vicky had redcoats, which will give your cavalry (and I'm presumung that's what you'd use) a really hard time. If she's got a lot, you may need cannons, which will slow your cavalry down, although that wouldn't matter much over such a small area.

I'm not sure if I'm doing anything wrong, but I'm forced to slow down my cavalry by attaching trebuchets or cannons to my stacks even when attacking City Garrison III longbowmen.

 

[MilesBeyond]

Out of curiosity, which leader are you? Frederick or Bismarck?

Germany is my favourite civ (and, IMHO, one of the better civs - terrible Unique Unit and Building, but excellent leaders), but, I'm gonna be real with you, they're not the best for early game rushes. Frederick is one of the best "builder" leaders in the game and if you want to maximize him, peaceful development is the key. Bismarck is a bit more flexible, but he, too, leans slightly more towards empire-building than aggressive expansion. You can certainly pull it off with either of them (preferably Bismarck, though) if you're dead-set on doing an early rush with Germany, but their strength lies elsewhere.

I'd recommend a different civ for early rushes. Conventional wisdom says Rome but I'm going to suggest against that - Praetorians are great units, but you don't want to become dependant on them. It's easy to clean up with Praets at low levels and then discover that you can't really play as anyone else. Hatshepsut of the Egyptians might be a good choice. Solid traits for going to war, a great UU, UB is niche but whatever.

Another possibility is Boudica of the Celts. Their UU and UB are both pretty... underwhelming. But she's got great traits for warfare and dealing with a crappy UU will teach you to not become dependent on them.

(Note: Crappy is relative. The Gallic Warrior, for example, is still an improvement over the Swordsman, it's just not quite as big of an improvement as, say, the Praetorian is)