plow tech question

[davbenbak]

I was thinking about adding a tech relating to the developement of the plow. I realize that man has been tilling the soil for quite some time but at what point did the metal plow get developed? Was it a real jump in technology?

 

[Plexus]

Well, plowing fields developed almost simultaneously with civilization, I guess it could be dated back to Mesopotamia or the Indus Valley.

 

[Mithadan]

By the sounds of it, the Chinese invented the iron plow around 500 B.C. -- which, I assume, would have drastically increased the agricultural production there, and thus the population too. I heard once that the iron plow was instrumental in the flowering of Greek philosophy, because it freed up a leisure class of rich guys who didn't have to do farming -- and who had plenty of time, therefore, to philosophise. But judging by the dates (iron plow in China by 500 B.C., Plato born 150 years later in Greece), I don't know if that's really such a hot theory.

For questions like these, you could try a Google search on "iron plow" and see what pops up. I did, anyway. Alternately, you can check for helpful links in ozzie's )) helpful URL library.

 

[Kyborgi]

The discovery of iron plow was essential for farming in europe. Before that there was farming only in areas with soft soil.

 

[Bjorn Bjornson]

Maybe replace pottery with "The Plow" and make the Irrigation job availible then.

Personally, I've thought Pottery as a specific tech is absurd. Same with Ceremonial Burial. I mean, the Neanderthals had Ceremonial Burial, and most stone age peoples made clay figures and other items.

 

[Optimizer]

You could have two Worker units, one which costs 20 shields and is available from the start - and one which comes with a tech after Iron Working, costs just 10 shields, require Iron, and has an increased movement rate.

 

[Ozymandias]

The real jump in technology wasn't the plow per se but the horse / ox collar which allowed a beast of burden to pull a plow without strangling itself. Late 1st Millenium CE, at least for Europe.

-Oz

 

[mrtn]

Originally posted by ozymandias
The real jump in technology wasn't the plow per se but the horse / ox collar which allowed a beast of burden to pull a plow without strangling itself. Late 1st Millenium CE, at least for Europe.

-Oz

This is why I put the "irrigate without water" at Invention, and not Electricity. You also have the horse harness, the mill, the Wheeled plow and the three-shift (I think this is the right word, the rotation of crops. My "History of Technology"-book is in Swedish ) that contributed.

 

[Ozymandias]

Originally posted by mrtn
This is why I put the "irrigate without water" at Invention, and not Electricity. You also have the horse harness, the mill, the Wheeled plow and the three-shift (I think this is the right word, the rotation of crops. My "History of Technology"-book is in Swedish ) that contributed.

Usually "three field crop rotation" in English BTW, the Chinese implemented a similar three-field system ca. 1000 CE with the importing of Vietnamese strains of rice, so it's not just another "Eurocentric" tech".

Best,

Oz

 

[mrtn]

Originally posted by ozymandias


Usually "three field crop rotation" in English BTW, the Chinese implemented a similar three-field system ca. 1000 CE with the importing of Vietnamese strains of rice, so it's not just another "Eurocentric" tech".

Best,

Oz

Oh, "three shift" is what you do in factories, right? Both are called skift ( = shift) in Swedish.

But did the Chinese grow any nitrogen fixating crops? Just a new kind of rice shouldn't be enough to refertilize the earth.

 

[Ozymandias]

Originally posted by mrtn
Oh, "three shift" is what you do in factories, right? Both are called skift ( = shift) in Swedish.

But did the Chinese grow any nitrogen fixating crops? Just a new kind of rice shouldn't be enough to refertilize the earth.

I don't know enough about rice cultivation -- yet . When I do I'll post ...

 

[davbenbak]

WOW!! I'm glad to see this thread resurrected. My intial thought was to add this to my ancient times scenario with prerequesites of tool making, agriculture, domestication and iron working that enabled irigation. From what is posted here though, it sounds more like a medievil era tech that should enable irigation without water.

Crop rotation, however, also sounds like a vital tech for the same era that might give the same thing or atleast enable larger cities. Anyways I think there should be some middle ages tech to represent the rapid poulation growth that occurred after the black death and the renaissance.

 

[Ozymandias]

Originally posted by ozymandias


I don't know enough about rice cultivation -- yet . When I do I'll post ...

"[The] Qimin Yaoshu covers crop rotation without noting ties between it and pest prevention. To prevent pest continuity, Nongzheng Quanshu considers alternating cotton two years and rice one year, with pests proliferating after 3 years without crop change. The Shen Shi farm book considers planting taro every year, reflecting deep attention to crop rotation, as seen in the proverb 'Crop rotation kills pests'."

("[The] 'Qimin Yaoshu' (535-550 A.D.), the world's oldest encyclopedia of agriculture, was written by Jia Shixie in the Northern and Southern Dynasties (6th century).")

... Plus there WAS something about the introduction of a Vietnamese rice strain late 1st Millenium CE that I've yet to find ...

On The Case,

Oz

 

[mrtn]

@davbenbak: It's both. In my fantasy mod (still unpublished ) I have prerequisite techs for mining, irrigation and road building, it's definitely doable. You should consider to give at least one of the techs to the AI from the start, otherwise they will probably think that their worker is of no use, and disband it.

For the middle ages you could always call the tech Agricultural Innovation, or something like that, and let it include all these innovations.

@Oz. That's mostly Chinese for me.
But, as you're on the case: "He wears a slouch hat, and ran that way!"