[LP] Poll: Buff Zombies?

[blackbutterfly]

With the Leader Pass (notably the Rulers of China DLC) zombies were hit with the nerf stick.

Previously, zombie Mutation Strength would increase by 1 for every zombie killed. So kill 10 zombies and they get +10 Mutation Strength.
(I think you can see this is how they very rapidly gained strength).

This is has been scaled back.
By how much IDK as it doesn't seem to be in the XML. It's a hard coded change.

Yes, they were virtually unplayable before. So strong that zombies would usually decimate the AI (and noobs in MP. Oh, that was fun!)
But now they're pussycats. Cannon fodder...totally breaking the Tower Defence mode that it was supposed to be.

 

[pokiehl]

I don’t think one leader with an exploit counts as a systemic nerf…

I also don’t think most people play this mode enough to care too much. I tried it once and lost interest. Fun in concept though.

 

[queenpea]

I thought this poll was going to be about the muscular undead.

 

[blackbutterfly]

I also don’t think most people play this mode enough to care too much. I tried it once and lost interest. Fun in concept though.

Oh man, a missed opportunity. (B'cos now i'd say Zombie Defence is broken post-nerf).
It's the one advantage of having Civ VI on consoles. On my Nintendo Swich I can still play the original Zombie Defence thanks in part to Aspyr unable to port Leader Pass to consoles. Silver linings?

 

[Daniel Boone]

I'm confused. How were zombies nerfed in the Leaders of China pack release?

 

[Planktonic]

They were so much better when they were an actual threat. In the Krampus GOTM for me they got to be stronger than GDRs.

Bring back the Death ZOMBIES!!!!!

 

[blackbutterfly]

They were so much better when they were an actual threat. In the Krampus GOTM for me they got to be stronger than GDRs.

Bring back the Death ZOMBIES!!!!!

 

[kryat]

I'm confused. How were zombies nerfed in the Leaders of China pack release?

Without knowing anything about this myself, I’m going to guess that it’s Qin’s alternate persona that can convert barbs. It doesn’t really nerf zombies. It’s just one leader ability is not really threatened by them.

 

[blackbutterfly]

I'm confused. How were zombies nerfed in the Leaders of China pack release?

When they added Qin, whose warrior (melee) class units are able to convert barbs, including zombies. Qin would have been super powered, not just OP, if they hadn't nerfed zombies.
But they went a step too far...

Without knowing anything about this myself, I’m going to guess that it’s Qin’s alternate persona that can convert barbs. It doesn’t really nerf zombies. It’s just one leader ability is not really threatened by them.

See above.

 

[blackbutterfly]

I thought this poll was going to be about the muscular undead.

I only just got this joke

Soz. I was distracted by the downloading DLC!

FYI SpiffingBrit has also done a No Settler Challenge (with Qin):

 

[Linklite]

So, what did they do to nerf zombies?

 

[Oberinspektor Derrick]

I dont really play any of these modes, so its whatever for me.
Cba playing with all these broken and exploitable modes, because the base game is easy enough as it is.

 

[AntSou]

When they added Qin, whose warrior (melee) class units are able to convert barbs, including zombies. Qin would have been super powered, not just OP, if they hadn't nerfed zombies.
But they went a step too far...

See above.

There's no nerf. Block Qin when playing Zombies and problem solved.

You've been on an unrelenting crusade over nothing since the release of the Leaders of China. The arguments are always the same and the replies you get are always the same.

 

[Planktonic]

You've been on an unrelenting crusade over nothing since the release of the Leaders of China. The arguments are always the same and the replies you get are always the same.

No, he's on to something here. I've played zombies before multiple times before- they wreaked havoc even for very experienced players (see GOTM 111 for example).

I did recently try a game with them and they are not the same. Their mutation strength is not advancing at the same rate as it did previously afaict. Now they seem more like an irrelevant nuisance when before they were legitimately a dire threat. I think something is different, and not for the better.

 

[AntSou]

I did recently try a game with them and they are not the same. Their mutation strength is not advancing at the same rate as it did previously afaict. Now they seem more like an irrelevant nuisance when before they were legitimately a dire threat. I think something is different, and not for the better.

Hmm, that's interesting if it's correct.

However, that's not actually his argument, as he already admitted in this thread when quoting kryat. He has made this same argument multiple times before, and it's always about Qin's ability.

 

[pokiehl]

No, he's on to something here. I've played zombies before multiple times before- they wreaked havoc even for very experienced players (see GOTM 111 for example).

I did recently try a game with them and they are not the same. Their mutation strength is not advancing at the same rate as it did previously afaict. Now they seem more like an irrelevant nuisance when before they were legitimately a dire threat. I think something is different, and not for the better.

Absolutely nothing has changed though. Nothing in the Portugal pack has been updated for quite a while.

Firaxis has never stealth-dropped balance changes for this game.

 

[Planktonic]

Absolutely nothing has changed though. Nothing in the Portugal pack has been updated for quite a while.

Firaxis has never stealth-dropped balance changes for this game.

Maybe you're right. I don't know for sure. But until recently every zombie game I've played (incl the recent Krampus GOTM) had them mutating at a much faster rate than what I saw in my last game with them (which was Deity, but not a Unifier Qin game). Normal barbarian units had much higher comat strength than the zombies. Could've been a fluke but somehow they played very differently, and were nowhere near as strong.

 

[MrRadar]

Could've been a fluke but somehow they played very differently, and were nowhere near as strong.

Interesting, I haven't played Zombie mode for a long time, but this got me thinking, could this be a side effect of reigning in the AI science bias? Before, for more than a year, AI was overfocused on science production, so they made less troops in general, and those limited troops may have been eaten by zombies easier, making more zombies, and AI had to replace them by another limited batch that got eaten as well and so on, making the process escalate quicker and mutation strength rise fairly quickly. Now, if AI's troop count is better, maybe they no longer lose so many units to zombies, so there are less zombies, they're weaker and outbreaks are easier to control, which also puts further speed bumps on the mutation strength rise? Just a theoretical thought.

 

[blackbutterfly]

There's no nerf. Block Qin when playing Zombies and problem solved.

There is

You've been on an unrelenting crusade over nothing since the release of the Leaders of China. The arguments are always the same and the replies you get are always the same.

OMG it's not a "crusade"

I just cannot express my disappointment at how Zombies got "fixed":

 

[pokiehl]

There is

But how? If Qin isn’t in the game?