[NFP] Portugal Developer Livestream Discussion

Eagle Pursuit

Scir-Gerefa
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I started a Portugal game on my lunchbreak. The +Sight rocks. The Trade Routes for meeting civs is pretty good, but I can only run domestic right now. None of the other civs have coastal cities yet. And the coastal city-states are far enough away that it doesn't seem safe to send traders there yet.

I'm also annoyed that I get "Send us a trade route" quest from landlocked city-states.
 
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I'm also annoyed that I get "Send us a trade route" quest from landlocked city-states.

I got that too. Open boarders with city-states is also incredibly strong and probably one the stronger aspects of Portugal.
 

Eagle Pursuit

Scir-Gerefa
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I got that too. Open boarders with city-states is also incredibly strong and probably one the stronger aspects of Portugal.

Ha! I forgot about that. I thought I just got lucky. But yeah, it's nice not having to skirt around them all the time.
 

Menocchio

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The +1 sight range really blew me away when I started my first game. As soon as I loaded in: "Natural Wonder discovered! New continent discovered! First to meet Jerusalem!" Even if you struggle to make much use of Portugal's trading superpowers in the early turns, you definitely feel the utility of +1 sight.
 

nunor

King
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Just out of curiosity, how is Joao supposed to be pronounced? I haven't the foggiest idea how to speak/pronounce Portuguese, so my instinct is to say "jow," but I'm sure I'm butchering it.
I think the closest approximation in English would be something like zhoo-ang-oong (the "ng" like in "sing").

Is this accurate Portuguese? And what do you all think of his animations?
With regard to pronunciation, it's standard modern European Portuguese (no attempts at historical phonetics there).

On the other hand, the grammar and vocabulary are very noticeably archaic-sounding, so that's a cool detail.

Edit: There's at least one mistake. At some point during João's declaration of war, the voice actor says "posto que nós pese fazer isto" when it should be "posto que nos pese fazer isto" (basically, he's saying "it pains we to do this" instead of "it pains us to do this"). I'm not sure if it's the line that was wrong or the VA who was incompetent...
 
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Portugal is really Sea Mali, because like him he suffers from a difficult beginning. You're lack behind in gold since for some time you won't be able to send international trades routes.

But otherwise it's incredible. With Diplomatic League, being the first to discover a city-States guarantee you an automatic suzerainty. The +1 Sight is gorgeous. And when you can trade, the cash will flow like Mansa Mussa! And the distance! Ah, I was so surprise to be able to send trade routes so far!

I discovered something that seems wrong: in the video I recall them saying "you can send international trade routes only to cities on the coast or with a harbor", but clearly it's wrong, you can only send trade routes to coastal cities. Netherlands had a lot of inland cities with a harbor, and I couldn't send them trade routes. Kind of a bummer, then, since very few cities are actually coastal.
 

Noble Zarkon

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But otherwise it's incredible. With Diplomatic League, being the first to discover a city-States guarantee you an automatic suzerainty. The +1 Sight is gorgeous. And when you can trade, the cash will flow like Mansa Mussa!
Indeed - I just bought 10 Shipyards over a 22 turn spell!!
 

Zaarin

Diplomatic Attaché to Londo Mollari
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Portugal is really Sea Mali, because like him he suffers from a difficult beginning. You're lack behind in gold since for some time you won't be able to send international trades routes.

But otherwise it's incredible.
I found this as well, which has made Portugal my favorite civ in the pass.

I discovered something that seems wrong: in the video I recall them saying "you can send international trade routes only to cities on the coast or with a harbor", but clearly it's wrong, you can only send trade routes to coastal cities. Netherlands had a lot of inland cities with a harbor, and I couldn't send them trade routes. Kind of a bummer, then, since very few cities are actually coastal.
Odd. I've been able to send trade routes to inland cities with a Harbor. In fact, I essentially had to wait for other civs to get their Harbors online before I could do much trading at all.
 
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Odd. I've been able to send trade routes to inland cities with a Harbor. In fact, I essentially had to wait for other civs to get their Harbors online before I could do much trading at all.

Double odd then. I'd share a screenshot but I'm at work. But I had a city near Asmterdam (like, 6 tiles away), but Amsterdam (with a harbor) wasn't shown in the possible destinations.
I'll maybe show it as a bug. Thanks for your input, it helped me see a little clearer (as well as confusing me as much, but in a different direction).
 

8housesofelixir

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Odd. I've been able to send trade routes to inland cities with a Harbor. In fact, I essentially had to wait for other civs to get their Harbors online before I could do much trading at all.

Double odd then. I'd share a screenshot but I'm at work. But I had a city near Asmterdam (like, 6 tiles away), but Amsterdam (with a harbor) wasn't shown in the possible destinations.
I'll maybe show it as a bug. Thanks for your input, it helped me see a little clearer (as well as confusing me as much, but in a different direction).

Someone on Reddit pointed out that, if a Harbor of an inland city is in the 3rd ring of the City Center, Portugal traders cannot get in. But if the Harbor is in the 2nd ring, then they can trade with the city with no issue. Very likely a bug.
 
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The more I look into this the more questions I have.

The reason the description doesn't say you cannot send international land trade routes at all is because technically, you can, just not directly. You need some buffer cities of your own to do this. However, the moment the Trader leaves your last buffer city to go to the first international city (could be the destination, or could be another buffer city), it has to enter a water tile or a Canal. Also, However, trade routes sent this way still count as land trade routes, thus only have a range of 15 and will not be affected by the extra range. Proof for this:
Go to 47:39
February 2021 Game Update Developer Livestream - YouTube
You can see here London and Bradford are farther away from Portugal than Newcastle, however, the route to Newcastle grants more Gold than routes to London or Bradford. Newcastle is 14 tiles away from Leiria (the origin) while London is 19 tiles away (probably the only time this faulty stat of trade routes is helpful). However, you can see the routes to London and Bradford do not go through Newcastle, even though Newcastle has a trading post and trade routes always prefer the route that gives the most gold. A normal civ can send trade routes to London through Newcastle, because that is the route with the most Gold, but Portugal cannot, so I assume that is because they cannot connect two foreign cities on land. However, why can't the trader just go sea to land at Newcastle and then embark again to go to London? What prevents it?

I can confirm you can trade with cities one tile inland with a Harbor, you just cannot use that city with a Trading post to extend the range.
 

tedhebert

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I got VERY lucky in my first Portugal game. Discovered Sinbad as first hero, went and immediately produced him in my capital in like 3 turns (the first hero is very easy to produce) and looted the 8 times I could + explored over ocean tiles close to half the map (huge small continents) before he expired, and allowed me to meet 6 civs also. wound up with over 2500G at about turn 35-40, felt a little like cheating. But hey, Fun still... bought settlers and builders with that money ;-)

EDIT: I got the turn 0 save if anyone really wants it. Altough the surroundig map from starting point isn't really fantastic, and I got unlucky on the tech tree also, most maritime techs are in the back end...
 

Nerevatar

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Mar 17, 2019
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I just saw a Zombie flee from me? Attacked it with a City Center and a Ranger, and moved another ranger adjacent as well. It had about 10% life left. I expected it to attack one of the two units adjacent to it, but it fled instead. That's not supposed to happen? Anyone else seen Zombies flee?
 
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