[NFP] Portugal Developer Livestream Discussion

[Pietato]

Wait...forts and the pa function as TRAPS? As in, the zombies have to occupy it??

 

[SammyKhalifa]

Finally a use for planes.

For some reason the thought of using Heathen Conversion makes me laugh

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Wait...forts and the pa function as TRAPS? As in, the zombies have to occupy it??

Strategic fallback, I guess. Damage the Zombies, and then fall back and let them kill themselves occupying your Fortifications.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The Portugal civilization would make better sense with the Pirates: the Golden Age of Piracy scenario, instead of the Zombie Defense game mode. Well "better sense": Portugal is not part of the 4 colonial powers since they didn't really set in the caribbean. I guess it is "better sense" in a sense it is a less "worse sense"?

Zombie came from the West African Vodun, a distrinct fom of the traditional African religion mostly in Benin, Togo (and part of Ghana and Nigeria). Due to the African diaspora in America, other countries like Cuba (Vodú), Dominica (Vudú) but mostly Haiti (Vodou) are praticing to some degree the same religion. And to some extinct: in Brazil (Vodum) and the USA (Voodoo).

It is quite a missed opportunity for the inclusion of Benin or Haiti. Before being exposed to some US-american pop-culture media, for me a Zombie was mostly an Undead servant (like a Civilization V's worker!) than a slow-moving never-ending horde of brain eating diseased people.

A better approach could have been putting Monopolies and Corporations with Portugal.
Then the Vietnam and Kublai Pack could have come with a Pandemic game mode, considering the Black Death apparently started in Mongolia and traveled to Europe on the Silk Road.

Also now that Mogadishu is confirmed to be the replacement of Lisbon what are the chances that cities like Macau or Goa might appear on Portugal's city list? They have in the past and Spain and the Netherlands have colonial cities in their list.

 

[ManoftheHour333]

A better approach could have been putting Monopolies and Corporations with Portugal.

Yeah we should have gotten C&M with Portugal and Byzantium considering they were both some of the biggest traders in the world. Missed opportunity for what we got...plus it also gave us Gaul which I was hugely disappointed by.

Also now that Mogadishu is confirmed to be the replacement of Lisbon what are the chances that cities like Macau or Goa might appear on Portugal's city list? They have in the past and Spain and the Netherlands have colonial cities in their list.[/QUOTE]

As Portugal was my main in Civ V I can tell you that Goa and various cities in Africa (I.e. Bisseau) were in fact Portuguese cities. So they probably will have colonial cities. They just might not give Macau as one because China is a thing...and China is very protective of it's new possessions.

 

[Zyxpsilon]

This actually seems true if you take a little glance at the packs, but Vietnam comes with Corporations and Ethiopia comes with Secret Societies. What do those have to do with each other?

1) Silly me but... i suspect their implicit concept reasoning threw a cool wrench into History itself. In terms of post-war realities -- firstly, it could be related to French Occupation tactics (after WWII up to the 60's) and, secondly to Americans struggle of the 70+'s that shifted "re-build" efforts heavily enhanced by USA-Capitalism structures/assets (even Nixon had quick inclinations towards steady "Investing" steps.. politically) through foreign support of many ca$h-pipelines.

2) I'll jump off the train wreck right now with another weird connection if you don't mind; James Bond/007 film "Live & Let Die" and its Haiti Voodoo elements. Then.. it's very easy to (also) connect Ethiopia in such a pattern of secrecy.

... can we get a definitive time please

MidNight Oil .. No less! (EST)

 

[Andrew Johnson [FXS]]

A better approach could have been putting Monopolies and Corporations with Portugal.
Also now that Mogadishu is confirmed to be the replacement of Lisbon what are the chances that cities like Macau or Goa might appear on Portugal's city list?

Macau - nope. For obvious reasons!

 

[8housesofelixir]

Macau - nope. For obvious reasons!

Is that also the reason why the Portuguese trading post achievement doesn't involve having a trade post in China? It just requires having trading posts in Brazil, India, and Japan.

 

[Andrew Johnson [FXS]]

Is that also the reason why the Portuguese trading post achievement doesn't involve having a trade post in China? It just requires having trading posts in Brazil, India, and Japan.

No, that one involved looking at a map and picking three major points in the Portuguese trade network spread across the world. I chose Japan as I have always been interested in the really complicated role of the Europeans during the feudal period - the introduction of Christianity and guns, the banning of some (especially the Portuguese) during Edo, and the dramatic Black Ship incident. While saying Macau is a Portuguese city would raise red flags, I think build a feitoria in Macau would not.

But these things are never terribly clear. Nagasaki is a safer choice, regardless. The other choice would have been Kongo, but that, too, was out for obvious reasons - I detail a bit the arguments between Kongo and Portugal on the trade in enslaved people in the Civilopedia entries here.

No, that one involved looking at a map and picking three major points in the Portuguese trade network spread across the world. I chose Japan as I have always been interested in the really complicated role of the Europeans during the feudal period - the introduction of Christianity and guns, the banning of some (especially the Portuguese) during Edo, and the dramatic Black Ship incident. While saying Macau is a Portuguese city would raise red flags, I think build a feitoria in Macau would not.

But these things are never terribly clear. Nagasaki is a safer choice, regardless. The other choice would have been Kongo, but that, too, was out for obvious reasons - I detail a bit the arguments between Kongo and Portugal on the trade in enslaved people in the Civilopedia entries here.

Little tidbit, too - many of the "Portuguese" populations in Southeast Asia were not Portuguese, but were Japanese. Local populations referred to Christian converts often as "Portuguese" even if they were ethnically Asian, as this was a time before concepts of race and nation became calcified in the way that they did in the 19th C.

 

[Meluhhan]

So, still no word on Potatogate?

What has happened?

 

[Nerevatar]

I am not decided on the zombie mode yet (which I guess is an improvement from earlier) since Carl says that the AI can actually handle the zombies. It is worth noting that in the Barbarian Clans Mode stream it was also mentioned that the AI could interact with the Clans, but player testing and checking the logs shows that while the statement is technically true, it is used extremely rarely and often completely nonsensically such as bribing tribes which are not a threat. So I would have to see player reports on how the AI actually handle the mode, before I completely believe it. What we have seen so far is the AI being wiped out and the human player handling it without loses.

I would like to have this only affect the human player and be an additional challenge to us, but without it really affecting the AI, as it seems like a fun extra challenge. Maybe some modifier magic can make this a reality as a mod.

 

[fy00sh]

What has happened?

We've been speculating how poorly (or well) Sean Bean, the narrator, is going to pronounce "João". My guess was that he'd rhyme it with "potato".

 

[Pfeffersack]

Was there any comment on how Zombies interact with CSs? We all know that CSs can be razed, Zombies play in the "barb team" and barbarians can attack CSs. What stops Zombies from razing CSs then? Do they consider them as capitals and don't capture/raze them, even if it would technically possible? If no such restriction/special behaviour is in place, it could be also a mode which is killing CSs off.

 

[Ceydezed]

Was there any comment on how Zombies interact with CSs? We all know that CSs can be razed, Zombies play in the "barb team" and barbarians can attack CSs. What stops Zombies from razing CSs then? Do they consider them as capitals and don't capture/raze them, even if it would technically possible? If no such restriction/special behaviour is in place, it could be also a mode which killing CSs off.

Pretty sure they razed at least one city state in yesterday´s stream.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

Pretty sure they razed at least one city state in yesterday´s stream.

They did indeed :-(

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

Pretty sure they razed at least one city state in yesterday´s stream.

So the zombie mode is introduced to tone down the Portugese ...?

 

[Pietato]

I guess zombies are the counter to the barb tribes mode.

What time is this patch releasing, again?

 

[Laurana Kanan]

What time is this patch releasing, again?

In a little less than 4 hrs from now.

 

[Pietato]

Cheers. 5 am eh. Time to sleep, then.

 

[Meluhhan]

We've been speculating how poorly (or well) Sean Bean, the narrator, is going to pronounce "João". My guess was that he'd rhyme it with "potato".

Ohh.. I thought it had got something to do with Potato McWhisky, the streamer. Well, you might be very right given that there is ample precedence of butchered pronunciation on Sean Bean's part.