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[NFP] Portugal is the last NFP Civilization confirmed. Also... Zombies??!!

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Duke William of Normandy, Mar 9, 2021.

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  1. Duke William of Normandy

    Duke William of Normandy King of England & Unofficial Welcoming Committee

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    Maybe the slaves he is referencing are Helots, considering Monty was known as the Spartan General.
     
  2. aieeegrunt

    aieeegrunt Prince

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    I bet he wasn’t sorry to miss the British debacle in Greece though
     
  3. Ticio

    Ticio Prince

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    I think it was one of Victoria's previous bonuses, but they changed it as it was too strong (imagine this bonus + owls!!). The idea of them receiveing extra yields per routes could be a more moderate bonus, and depending of how they do it, a entertaining one!
     
  4. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    Unfortunately, Diplomatic Victory is GS content. If Portugal were to have a Diplomatic focus, it would have to be through means which are relevant to Vanilla Civ. That probably means City-States. Is there design space for that?

    There's no Civ with a heavy focus on Gold other than Mali, is there? With over 50 Civs in the game, there's space for a second one. Who knows, they might even make John III chubby and give him Mansa Musa's laugh.

    Spoiler :
     
  5. Linklite

    Linklite Emperor

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    I guess it depends. Therr are a few that have trade routes (and therefore gold) as a secondary focus. If they wanted another hard gold focused civ, they'd have to have a significant malus, almost certainly to production, to prevent them getting to massively OP proportions - making them either a second Mansa or a pale imitation of him. Normally, that's fine, but this is the capstone of NFP, possibly if Civ VI in general, which makes me think that they're going to want to make them unique.

    If you really think that gold will be their focus, then outside of the box is in order. Perhaps the ability (on top of crazy gold generation) is that you can use gold to buy science or culture (or techs/civics), but with the malus that your generation of whichever is significantly reduced or even blocked.

    However, I don't think a simple "gold generator" civ, even with a malus like Mali, is going to be likely. Could be wrong, though.
     
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  6. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    I thought of something that would be interesting for a possible civ UA on exploration.
    Age of Discovery- Naval units gain experience through exploration like recon units and all have +1 sight range. Gain a random eureka or inspiration every time you discover a natural wonder or another continent. Gain two if you are the first civilization to discover it.

    If feitorias are built in city-states that you are the suzerain of that's one way.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2021
  7. Zaarin

    Zaarin Diplomatic Attaché to Londo Mollari

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    Maya.

    Nuke it from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. :shifty:
     
  8. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    The Maya only have one component related to gold generation, similar to Nubia.
    I think Mali is on a different level considering every ability, even the UU getting gold from kills, deals with generating gold of some sort.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2021
  9. Zaarin

    Zaarin Diplomatic Attaché to Londo Mollari

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    Eh, I was as swimming in Gold in my Maya game as I am in an average Mali game. My experience with the Maya is that they're a Gold civ with a Science bonus, not the other way around.
     
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  10. ManoftheHour333

    ManoftheHour333 Warlord

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    The Maya? I mean a little bit but they're more of a population/tall/science civ rather than an economic one.

    And yeah besides Mali** there really aren't many gold/econmomic civs in VI. We never got Morocco, the Swahili, Venice, or other big trade empires...they could have made Arabia more trade focused but they went a more fittingly faith direction (Which was fine). The lack of economic civs is something I kept complaining about it on the civ reddit page lmao.

    **Mali uses gold in a different way to make up for their production woes. It's like they just play the game differently opposed to actually gaining substantial economic bonuses. So while they're go focussed for sure, they're not exactly an economic civ in entirety.


    My idea for a Portuguese civ UA is to basically make them a foreign-continent Phoenicia. Give them +8 loyalty and +1 pop for coastal cities founded on other continents and then -8 loyalty for non-coastal cities founded on foreign continents. Since they'd be settling mostly coastal, give them +1 prod for each coast tile for some MoH/Auckland fun. This would give them a damn well unique playstyle (Really interesting if you start at a continental divide!) and would complement their coastally-centric, trade empire history.

    If they go with a UI (And not a unique commercial hub I'm dreaming of : ( ), the Feitoria should be able to be built in city states and gives the player +1 trade route capacity, and a couple envoys (Which helps with the diplo victory...giving them a lil more focus). So theoretically, if you can get a builder to every non-conquered city state, you can get [n=number of city states] in the game. It's also been thought by others that the caravel UU could build these UIs and while probably harder for the devs to implement, would be way cool (And definitely better!) too.

    Lastly, I'd give Joao some bonuses to earning extra gold on trade routes based on the amount/diversity of luxuries he controls. Think Monty but with gold on all trade routes and it'd be a "decent" passive trade bonus (But that better not be it...I still think increasing trade route capacity for part of their ability is more crucial). I could also see some awesome synergy if they give him a way to make civilian units cheaper to purchase as well for settler/trader buying.

    The only thing I think this model lacks is good "exploration" bonuses...but to be fair, exploration is kind of a weak mechanic as it isn't always necessary and forcing your bonuses to be tied to doing something that doesn't also help you can be tedious. Like, I don't want to be hampered/lose one of my abilities if I couldn't explore in my mid-game due to some unforeseen war/dark age...and exploration is rather obtuse at comes at a rather fixed particular time. I think the caravel UU coming earlier (Naval tradition?) and being able to cross oceans would suffice to represent that part of Portuguese history.
     
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  11. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    I think you may have misunderstood how Phoenicia plays. Phoenicia's coastal cities suffer no loyalty penalty if they are in the same continent as the capital, and Dido can move its capital.

    So once your coastal cities in your original continent have enough population and loyalty pressure, you move your capital to a different continent, so that your new coastal cities there suffer no pressure.

    Phoenicia already is the foreign-continent Phoenicia. What you've described is Phoenicia plus Indonesia's Kampung production bonus.
     
  12. ManoftheHour333

    ManoftheHour333 Warlord

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    True-that's one way to play Phoenicia...but that's just one scenario (The "Phoenician Cheese") that's not often feasible. In my experience, with Phoenicia you still really have to be careful where you settle on foreign continents as you don't get any loyalty bonuses and while you *can* move your cap there to help, the cothon and project cost so much production that it takes forever. As a result, it's often best to just settle coastally on your home continent and play loyalty games there. I'm not saying such a Phoenician strat won't work as it totally does-it's just one way (And a good way!) to play them. But in my opinion, Phoenicia is a home-continent focused civ that uses that 100% loyalty bonus to really forward-settle and affect the loyalty of other civs' cities on their home continent with a billion coastal cities. There are applications for foreign continent play for sure (With the move capital project and all), but those don't come into play in every game and are rally niche imo.

    What I described for the UA is a *little* similar to Phoenicia, but a bit inverted. The whole idea is for it make settling foreign continents and holding onto these cities a actual possibility in the post-R&F game. And given that there are penalties for settling inland on foreign continents, I think it would really force you to think about where you settle i.e. change how you typically play the game. And the +1 production is nothing like the Kampung...that UI requires a sea resource and only applies to the tile itself...this would be a +1 prod to ALL coast tiles a'la Russia's UA.
     
  13. LMT

    LMT Warlord

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    We’re getting one new map, correct? Maybe we’ll get a spheroid map.

    Would love to see one, but I don’t know how difficult that would be to develop.
     
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  14. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

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    What if the freitoria is a unique trading post? Posts are a woefully underutilized mechanic.
     
  15. ManoftheHour333

    ManoftheHour333 Warlord

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    How did you know we're getting a new map?

    In fact, does anyone know what exactly they are adding in this last pack? IIRC it just says "more new content" and a new game mode but I'm moreso interested if they're adding any new wonders (natural or historical), resources, or maps.
     
  16. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    https://civilization.com/new-frontier-pass/
    It's been known for a while that we're getting a new map and world wonders.
     
  17. ManoftheHour333

    ManoftheHour333 Warlord

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    They are underutilized fo sure but that's largely because they're not that significant. Don't get me wrong-some cool way to use TPs would be cool, but if we're looking for strong, game-changing abilities, they're have to be really creative with that one. I still think it is best suited as a unique improvement to be built in city states, or even better, a unique commercial hub.

    Oh hot damn! New Wonders are great! Hmm...what do you all think they'll be?

    My money's on another unique bridge considering we didn't get a new bridge district. I could also see Notre Dame coming back (Given the fire and all).
     
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  18. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    Notre Dame is the most often mentioned, since it's kind of obvious. I think there's a very strong chance we'll see it. I've commented on it recently. I think the focus will be on Medieval and Renaissance eras. I could see a modern wonder, but not an atomic era one.

    We use this thread for that stuff:
    https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...iscussion-thread.658144/page-81#post-16044919
     
  19. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    Notre Dame is a good pick. I feel like we are also missing a Dam Wonder. I think it's obvious what it's bonuses would be if you have GS but not sure what they could do with it for people that only have the base game or R&F.
     
  20. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

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    I think just for that reason (they're so boring)there are a lot of interesting things they could do to make people look at them again.

    I don't know . . free envoys after completing one, +str for units within x tiles for you, remove fog of war and open borders around them, maybe you can launch trade routes from one even if they're in someone else's city, probably better things but that's just off the top of my head
     
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