[NFP] Portugal Reveal Video Discussion

[Disgustipated]

Current game as Portugal I have Egypt nearby. Those trade routes are sweet. What other civs give bonuses to the sender? I can't seem to remember. Cree? Netherlands?

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Current game as Portugal I have Egypt nearby. Those trade routes are sweet. What other civs give bonuses to the sender? I can't seem to remember. Cree? Netherlands?

The Netherlands doesn't give benefits to other Civilizations.

https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/Wilhelmina_(Civ6)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Current game as Portugal I have Egypt nearby. Those trade routes are sweet. What other civs give bonuses to the sender? I can't seem to remember. Cree? Netherlands?

We were actually talking about on the rebalance thread of the possibility of making "Radio Oranje" better by giving bonuses to the sender. It would at least give other civilizations an incentive to trade with the Netherlands other than a threat of whacking you with a parasol.

 

[Zaarin]

It would at least give other civilizations an incentive to trade with the Netherlands other than a threat of whacking you with a parasol.

I mean, that's a threat to be taken seriously.

 

[King William I]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the modern term 'factory' orginate from 'manufactory' which would make that and feitoria two homophones?

 

[nunor]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the modern term 'factory' orginate from 'manufactory' which would make that and feitoria two homophones?

Homophones are words that sound the same. Was that what you meant?

 

[Abaxial]

Two things I notice on a first game with Portugal:

You can't actually send a trade route to a feitoria, if the city controlling the resource is inland. This doesn't seem right.

Sailing a nau in to establish a feitoria can trigger the awful "move your troops away" message. I do wish they would kill this.

This is objectively incorrect, purely looking at data. You can search databases of academic publications in English on colonial trading posts - as I just did - and find that the term "factory" is almost exclusively used for industrial-era factories in the present English sense. This has evidently been the case for more than 40 years, across the literature. "Trading post" or similar terms are used instead, regardless of context, excepting when non-English words are used as historical signifiers, such as feitoria.

Trading posts are different things, and much more common, since they are much humbler affairs, and can be just a small clutch of buildings. Factories were often fortified naval bases (think Calcutta and Madras).

 

[King William I]

Homophones are words that sound the same. Was that what you meant?

No, but I was running in very little sleep. My question if the modern term 'factory' had nothing to do with colonial factories

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

UWU the Third.

Wait, I have something better. Jew III.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

Wait, I have something better. Jew III.

That would be quite inapproriate, considering the Portuguese inquisition started under the rule of Joao III.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

That would be quite inapproriate, considering the Portuguese inquisition started under the rule of Joao III.

That's why the shifty emote is there. I know it's inappropriate, which is exactly why I suggested it.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

That's why the shifty emote is there. I know it's inappropriate, which is exactly why I suggested it.

I was expecting it, but still wasn't sure...

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Trading posts are different things, and much more common, since they are much humbler affairs, and can be just a small clutch of buildings. Factories were often fortified naval bases (think Calcutta and Madras).

Feitorias were fortified "trading posts", which is what pre-Industrial factories were. Of course that doesn't mean they didn't have functions of a naval base either.
That's the whole reason why they add yield to trade routes when you send them to a city with one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factory_(trading_post)

That would be quite inapproriate, considering the Portuguese inquisition started under the rule of Joao III.

Yet I founded Judaism with Portugal in my game.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

Yet I founded Judaism with Portugal in my game.

Just to mind you: the Portuguese inquisition works different now...

 

[Menocchio]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the modern term 'factory' orginate from 'manufactory' which would make that and feitoria two homophones?

Yes and no. They both have the same Latin root in facere, but different etymological trees, making them doublets: "factory" as a place where people work and things are built comes from manufactory (as in, manus+facere, literally "hand-made"), while "factory" as in the trading post comes from their being overseen by a person called a "factor" with the -y denoting that it's a place for them. Manufactory arose around the 17th century, became common in the 18th, and by the 19th century transformed into simply "factory" and the older connotation of a trading post became secondary.

 

[nunor]

Yes and no. They both have the same Latin root in facere, but different etymological trees, making them doublets: "factory" as a place where people work and things are built comes from manufactory (as in, manus+facere, literally "hand-made"), while "factory" as in the trading post comes from their being overseen by a person called a "factor" with the -y denoting that it's a place for them. Manufactory arose around the 17th century, became common in the 18th, and by the 19th century transformed into simply "factory" and the older connotation of a trading post became secondary.

Do you have any source to back that up? Asking genuinely, since the online etymology dictionary doesn't say any of that.

 

[Menocchio]

Here are links for trading post "factory" from Latin "factor" per OED: https://www.lexico.com/definition/factory ; https://www.lexico.com/definition/factor
The Online Etymology Dictionary has this: https://www.etymonline.com/word/factory but I always consider that site with a few grains of salt because it's essentially the brainchild of an English-language nerd, not an actual work of linguistics by linguists.

For "manufactory," you can see it being used in the 19th century in documents like this one, which obviously describes what we'd now call just a factory: https://www.historyofroyalwomen.com.../queen-victoria-in-her-journal-2-august-1832/

We have just changed horses at Birmingham where I was two years ago and we visited the manufactories which are very curious. It rains very hard. We just passed through a town where all coal mines are and you see the fire glimmer at a distance in the engines in many places. The men, women, children, country and houses are all black. But I can not by any description give an idea of its strange and extraordinary appearance. The country is very desolate everywhere; there are coals about, and the grass is quite blasted and black. I just now see an extraordinary building flaming with fire. The country continues black, engines flaming, coals, in abundance, everywhere, smoking and burning coal heaps, intermingled with wretched huts and carts and little ragged children.

I was a bit hasty in saying it'd wholly become "factory" by the 19th century, but then again this is the young Queen-to-be Victoria so her language usage would be different obviously from common people. Compare Charles Dickens' Hard Times from 1854, in which we can see a definite use of "factory" having evolved from "manufactory" and describing the same kind of thing (an industrial workplace); note especially the reference to hands, capitalised - intentional reference to the etymological root of manus, perhaps? https://www.gutenberg.org/files/786/786-h/786-h.htm#page69

She gave him an affectionate good-night, and went out with him to the door, whence the fires of Coketown could be seen, making the distance lurid. She stood there, looking steadfastly towards them, and listening to his departing steps. They retreated quickly, as glad to get away from Stone Lodge; and she stood there yet, when he was gone and all was quiet. It seemed as if, first in her own fire within the house, and then in the fiery haze without, she tried to discover what kind of woof Old Time, that greatest and longest-established Spinner of all, would weave from the threads he had already spun into a woman. But his factory is a secret place, his work is noiseless, and his Hands are mutes.

 

[Zaarin]

Yet I founded Judaism with Portugal in my game.

Me, too.