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Post -Apocalypse Alt History Brainstorming Thread

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Caveman 2 Cosmos' started by Hydromancerx, Feb 27, 2012.

  1. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    We did not have a thread for this yet so I made one.

     
  2. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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  3. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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  4. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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  5. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    So the way I see this working is this ...

    1. You have a major disaster event such as a bunch of your cities are nuked, a biological plague outbreak event, or alien invasion.

    2. Once triggered you will get Post-Apocalyptic Nomads which would work like the early game nomads.

    3. These nomads can make refuge camps and produce Post-Apocalyptic Units.

    4. If you survive the apocalypse the units would just upgrade normally to more advanced units. Thus each unit are not as good as to more proper units of your time.

    5. Post-Apocalyptic Nomads and the event can only be triggered during the Modern Era.

    What do you think?
     
  6. rightfuture

    rightfuture Emperor

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    Thanks :)
     
  7. Micael

    Micael Chieftain

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    Just wanted to say, this sounds like a really interesting idea.

    There should be researchable options though to fix things before the world goes all apocalyptic- like super ecology scrubbing in lots of places if Civs work together or something, else your 200 hour game could suddenly, and without warning, collapse into ruin, just before you make it to the Galactic Era or something.
     
  8. johny smith

    johny smith Deity

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    I just was pondering this. How does this work? Is it just a separate tech tree branch? Is there a way to bomb the world till stupid again? I was thinking a primary item of importance would be old technology that needs to be found again. So archaeological sites or ruins would give you some technology from you scavenging them. Just tossing it out. I don't know it is all doable with losing techs or either giving techs that make most things obsolete.
     
  9. rightfuture

    rightfuture Emperor

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    Here is a repost I made earlier in the ideas/discussions thread. Hope it inspires someone to explore the ideas and speak up about them.

    Moderator Action:

    Please tell me what you think.

    Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
     
  10. johny smith

    johny smith Deity

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    I am interested, but it seems to me there is a large gap here. The event that triggers Apocalyptic setting would determine a lot. A full scale nuclear war for example would matter on the terrain.

    So I mean Dune Wars terrain might be useful for post-nuclear. I just visualize different scenarios. Biological may just kill humans, and you could have the opposite. Biological human virus could be everything is retaken by nature.

    What I do not understand is how terrain would be, and the technology. Would you reach an end of the the post apocalypse time? And then when you do where do you sit on a tech tree? Do you instantly snap back into some normal timescale?
     
  11. Stemer

    Stemer Chieftain

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    I have a suggestion for how this might play out.

    1. The disaster happens (obviously).

    2. The world/continent is covered in something akin to fallout (or in the case of a nuclear war getting out of hand, regular fallout). All tile improvements aside from a few roads are destroyed, so the player and AIs have no resources. A lot of grassland and such would be turned into desert or barren, etc.

    3. All cities immediately take a population cut (also a culture cut). Smaller cities would be completely wiped out. Most (but not all) of the buildings in larger cities would be destroyed along with most (again not all) of the units in play. (Maybe bunkers could guarantee a limited number of units safety).

    4. The fallout like effect would also increase rebelliousness dramatically, making most civs dissolve into a few warring city states.

    5. Post apocalyptic versions of regular units would be discovered at the same time as their normal counterparts, but would only be enabled after the event happened. They would be much cheaper to build, but would be severely outclassed by their normal counterparts.

    6. The fallout like effect could be removed by workers or fade with time.

    (the effects could be increased or decreased depending on what kind of disaster happened)

    This approach removes any need for techs to be forgotten and allows for a much slower and more natural transition back to normal gameplay. Rather than just have a point at which the apocalypse 'ends' it would completely change the game, even once the immediate effects were gone.
     
  12. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    Sounds like a very good suggestion. Works just as well for an nuclear war, alien invasion e.g. H.G. Wells "War of the Worlds", home grown or alien virus e.g. "Andromeda Strain", or nano-plague. ;)

    2 & 3 almost guarantee 4 especially if the trade network is destroyed ;)
     
  13. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    I agree those are some smart ideas. The question is how can you trigger the Post Apocalyptic units and/or buildings? What keeps us from building the Post Apocalyptic units when there is no apocalypse?
     
  14. robomani

    robomani Chieftain

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    Maybe the event that start the apocalypse could give a free building in all cities that is required for apocalypses units.
     
  15. Il Principe

    Il Principe Prince

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    This idea would let you have a few cities left. So it might be an idea to look at

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=199196

    It´s for Civ 3 so hardly a resource. But it could give some inspiration for units and gameplay.

    What should btw also go up sky high with the apocalypse is crime.
     
  16. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    The "normal" ones are better and the post apocalyptic ones upgrade to the normal ones.

    So as I see:-
    1. Apocalypse happens removing access to many resources and destroying many buildings.
    2. This means that only the post-apo units can be built.
    3. As you recover buildings and resources the normal units become available.

    So for each apocalypse you have a set of units that aren't quite as good as the normal units, do not require the same buildings and resources and upgrade to the normal units. It makes the whole apocalypse thing a bit more organic and does not require special code. Eg modern units require "oil products" which requires a refinery and ammunition but modern apocalypse units don't and if you make them not quite as good as cav all the better.
     
  17. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    @Dancing Hoskuld

    Ok lets take the Urban Crossbowman for example. These would come about if you lost even your oil, ammuntion and sulphur resources.

    In a normal game you have ...

    Light Crossbowman (Ancient Ballistics) -> Crossbowman (Engineering) -> Heavy Crossbowman (Metallurgy)

    I would assume even with an Apocalypse we could make crossbows that rival the Heavy Crossbowman. So I am thinking possibly the upgrade path would be ...

    Heavy Crossbowman (Metallurgy) -> Urban Crossbowman (Guerrilla Warfare) -> Musketman (Flintlock)

    That way once you got sulphur back online then you could at least make Musketman again (and whatever they upgrade into).

    I am not 100% sure if it would work. But I suppose we could always make the unit and see if it works.
     
  18. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    Exactly. It would need to be thought out on a unit by unit level and apocalypse by apocalypse. A bit of thought and I am fairly sure we can have what we need without any programming work except XML.
     
  19. Kreatur

    Kreatur Warlord

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    what about linkin the post apocalyptic units to civis like tribal ore survival. the reason is that during an apocalypse sosciety as we know would break down, who would vote while the nuclear power plant is exploding ore whatever. The survivors would fall back in soscieties simplest forms. to represent this the player have to switch back to the simple civics to use the apocalyptic units. They were weaker but buildable without any special recources, after the apocalypse is over and you rebuild your country and switch back to more advanced civics the post apocalyptic units would dissapear
     
  20. Il Principe

    Il Principe Prince

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    But linking them the apocalypse and the units to a forced civic change is a bit narrow. And not exactly suitable for all apocalypses.
    It might work with some Nuclear War apocalypse, or a giant meteor.. things that go along with destroying huge parts of infrastructure and possible go hand in hand with an EMP.
    Those wouls make modern comunication break down, and by that governments.

    The crux with that is: A classic or medieval Civ would not be affected in the same way. A nuclear winter, wether it´s caused by actual nukes or a meteor) would still have svere effects, especially on farming. But where a railroad, telephone or computer network is pretty sensitive to the kind of destruction in the above scenarios, a comunications and trade network relying on courriers on horseback is not. A few horses might be killed and a few waystations hit so things slow down. But they wouldn´t break down the way modern comunications would, nor would governments. There´s a reason why aristorcatic systems were so widespread for milenia ;)

    A pandemic on the other hand will always have roughly the same effect: killing large parts of the population.
     

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