[Pre-Poll] Which civs would you like to see in a (potential) 4th expansion pack?

[krmarci]

In this thread, I would like to collect your ideas about what the next civs for Civ6 could be (if there will be one). Post any civs you would like to see / you think are likely. Suggest any leaders if you can.

I will collect ideas until Tuesday, 25 May 2021, 23:59 UTC. (I might extend the deadline if there are too few suggestions.) After that, I will create a Google poll, with which we will choose the favourites.

EDIT: Extended to 25 May.
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Civs that I would like to see (or at least can imagine):

• Western Europe: there aren't many options left. Austria, Bohemia and the Visigoths/Ostrogoths are our best options.
• Eastern Europe: my favourite here would be Lithuania, probably the largest empire in history not to be a civ. Other options could be the Kievan Rus (Russian alt leader or separate civ?) or (medieval) Bulgaria.
  While I would like to see some South Slavic country like Croatia or Serbia, the other options are more likely to fill the slot, and the Balkans are already a bit too dense due to the tons of Hellenistic civs.
• Africa: hard to guess, I'm not really familiar with the region. Maybe Morocco?
• North America: I would love to have the Inuits, but maybe a more "organised" Native American civ is more likely?
• Middle East: from the three big ancient Middle Eastern civs, we are still missing Assyria. Also, while not exactly Middle Eastern, ancient Armenia would also be an interesting option for an otherwise relatively "unknown" civ in the area.
• I don't really have an idea for the Far East, most civs are not only included, but they also have an alt leader. Maybe a postcolonial nation like the Philippines?
• South America: we could get another native civ, or maybe a postcolonial civ like Argentina?

 

[Askia Muhammad]

I don’t want to see anything else added to Western Europe. They could add 1 MAYBE 2 civs in Eastern Europe.

Africa: Oyo Empire, Asante, or Almoravids (would prefer Almoravids + one of those two).

South America: Same as Western Europe. We are reaching saturation.

North America: I’m not very knowledgeable but there is a glaring open spot in Western United States area that should be filled by a native group.

Southwest Asia: We have Babylon and Sumeria. I don’t think Assyria is necessary. I’d rather see a classical Islamic empire Umayyads or Abbasids.

SE Asia: Im not sure.

East Asia: We are at the point of saturation.

 

[Bactrian]

Nothing. I'd rather they put Civ VI to bed and start anew.

That being said, if they choose to continue, I'd love to see an alternate leader for Persia/Iran. Nader Shah would be an obvious choice, but they could go down a totally different route and choose someone like Abul-Qasem Ferdowsi. It might be interesting to see what they could do with a figure that had enormous cultural and civilizational influence (to oversimplify, his work revived Persian language and culture after the Arab conquest) but was never a political leader in any sense of the term.

 

[Futumch]

Nothing. I'd rather they put Civ VI to bed and start anew.

I agree with this.

But if new civs were on the drawing board, maybe Prussia, Lithuania, Israel in some form and the Berbers from Northern Africa. I almost think we've reached a full house in some regions. It would be a case of having to use the same people from different time periods, like the dynasties of China or Egypt. I suppose you could think of Byzantium (and maybe even Germany) as a "son of Rome" in that regard.

 

[Haig]

Comanche or Apache

Morocco

Italy

Romania

Assyria

Siam

 

[Evie]

Well, since the topic of which regions are saturated has come up, here is a list of most saturated to least saturated world regions. Civilizations are assigned to regions based on a balance of their capital location, historical association, and where the bulk of their cities are located (so: Ottomans and Arabia in West Asia, despite their Capitals being in Europe and North Africa, but Byzantium in Southern Europe). Scythian cities being high nonsense, they are assigned to Central Asia where Tomyris is most associated with. All land areas for regions are rounded to the nearest 100 000 square kilometers below 2 millions and the nearest 500 000 square kilometer above. (sqkm)

To avoid skewing things too much in favor of sparely inhabited tundra and desert colonies, Greenland, Siberia, Alaska, the Canadian territories and the Northern Territory of Australia and are excluded from the land area of their respective regions.

Western Europe - One civilization per 0.2m km2 (France, Switzerland, Low countries, British Isles - 1m km2) - France, England, Scotland, Netherlands, Gaul
Southern Europe - One civilization per 0.3m km2 (Iberic, Italic and Balkanic peninsulas - 1.5m km2) - Spain, Portugal, Rome, Greece, Macedonia, Byzantium
Central Europe: One civilization per 0.4m km2 (Poland, Germany, Austria, Czechia, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania - 1.2m km2) - Poland, Hungary, Germany
Northern Europe - One civilization per 0.8m km2 (Nordic and Baltic country, sans Greenland - 1.5m km2) - Norway, Sweden
West Asia: One civilization per 0.9m km2 (Iran and westward including the Caucasus - 6m km2) - Babylon, Sumeria, Phoenicia, Persia, Georgia, Arabia, Ottomans
Pacific - One civilization per 1 million km2 (Oceania sans Australia - 1m km2) - Maori
Central America - One civilization per 1.3m km2 (Mexico to Panama - 2.5m km2) - Aztec, Maya
Southeast Asia: One civilization per 1.5m km2 (Indochinese Peninsula, Indonesia - 4.5 m km2) - Vietnam, Khmer, Indonesia
East Asia - One civilization per 3m km2 (China, Korea, Japan, Mongolia, Taiwan - 12 m km2) - China, Korea, Japan, Mongolia
Central Asia - One civilization per 4m km2 (The Stans except Afghanistan and Pakistan - 4m km2) - Scythia
North Africa - One civilization per 4m km2 (Mediteranean Africa, Sudan, Western Sahara - 8m km2) - Egypt, Nubia
South America - One civilization per 4.2 m km2 (South America) - Inca, Mapuche, Brazil, Gran Colombia
East Africa - One civilization per 4.5m km2 (Everything south of Sudan, east of Congo and north of Mozambique - 4.5m km2) - Ethiopia
North America - One civilization per 4.8 m km2 (Canada, USA, sans territories and Alaska - 14.5m km2 ) - Canada, America, Cree
South Asia - One civilization per 5 million km2 (India, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Bangladesh, etc - 5m km2) - India
West Africa - One civilization per 5 million km2 (Everything west of Cameroon/Chad and South of Algeria/West Sahara - 5m km2) - Mali
Eastern Europe - One civilization per 5 million km2 (Russia sans Siberia, Ukraine, Belarus) - Russia
Southern Africa - One civilization per 5.5 million km2 (Everything south of Congo and Tanzania - 5.5m km2) - Zulu
Australia - One civilization per 6 million km2 (Australia, sans Northern Territory - 6m km2) - Australia
Central Africa - One civilization per 6.5 million km2 (Chad, Cameroon, CAR, Congo et al - 6.5m km2) - Kongo

This is not to say that all of those regions should be EQUALLY saturated (no, really, they shouldn't be), but it gives a clear picture of how saturated the regions are.

One does fail to see how South America is saturated but West Asia has room for adding Umayyads or Abassids (an Alt Leader for Arabia would probably be better to represent those anyway).

Personally, in light of that I'd probably aim, if I were expanding the design, to have:
3 African civilizations. One in Central Africa (probably in Chad, so helps Western Africa too), one in Southern or Eastern Africa (on their respective borders, to help both regions), and one in Northern Africa as there is nothing west of the Nile). I know 3 is unlikely, and even just Berber + one other African civilization is a hard sell, but Africa is by far the most untapped region in this game.
1 South Asian civilization, South Asia need something for sure, though if we play our cards right we can get a civ in Afghanistan or Pakistan that also helps central Asia and take care of two birds with one stone.
1 Eastern European civilization: the one part of Europe that definitely has room for more!
1 Western/southern/central European civilization: Just because an expansion without a recognizable big ticket western/southern/central European civ is about as unlikely as it gets.
1 South American civilization, though that's the least important of the group to me.
1 North American civilization.

Bringing me to my list:
-The Kanem-Bornu (or Kanuri) civilization - the obvious pick for Central Africa, filling a great Sahelian void between Mali and Nubia.
-The Swahili civilization - Narrowly beating the Shona kingdoms of Zimbabwe, mostly because they occupy a larger space than the Shona, and have less overlap with the Zulu.
-The Berber civilization - A broader take on Morocco that greatly helps the Maghreb.
-The Cossack civilization - Kievan Rus is a little too close to its Muscovian cousin, and the Cossacks provide an extremely intriguing alternative to filling up Ukraine and Southern Russia.
-The Guarani civilization - The only American indigenous people whose language is still a first language of a modern country, who formidably resisted the Spanish.
-The Comanche civilization - Love the Iroquois, but geographically they're no help. The Western US are where we want help, and that boils down (with the Pueblo off limit) to Navajo or Comanche (with Shoshone as a backup plan again).
-The Italian civilization - It's either them or Austria, and I'd rather use Germany to represent Austria than Germany OR Rome to represent Italy. The fact that they were distinct city states for most of history is not a problem, see Greece.
-Not sure about South Asia. the Kushan are super interesting but may be hard to do right due to information and portraits available. The Timurid are kind-of-sort-of in the right general area but really more Central Asian. The Cholan are interesting, but it seems to me getting something in Afghanistan/Pakistan should come before splitting India. Kushan, if they can be done, are the best bet IMO.

If we can't get all three African civs, then Kanem-Bornu should be the one axed - Swahili is the more important of the two. If so, that civ should probably go to some highly requested civilization outside Europe, most likely in West Asia (Hittites are my personal favorites here).

 

[Julius Carr]

I think European nations are already saturated, except for 1 or 2 in Eastern Europe (Bulgaria is a good choice),

It would be perfect if they added some African civilization, I believe that Africa is one of the least exploited continents and that in its scorching heat there are still great civilizations to add: Morocco, Libya or the kingdom of Kilwa.


In central Asia, the Timurid Empire, which was hardly been exploited in the civilization series having starred in great achievements such as the capture of an Ottoman emperor, is undoubtedly an excellent option.

In East Asia, Nepal or Tibet are interesting subjects. In the rest, I think we have already completed quite many empires.

As for Oceania, I have no ideas, I would say Hawaii but the fact that we already have the Maori would take a lot of prominence from Hawaii.

In the middle east, Israel. Although it will probably present itself as a modern civilization, which can lead to problems

In North America, the Sioux, the Lakotas or any other indigenous tribe would come in quite handy since we only have the crees as a North American indigenous civilization, while South America has about 2 (the Incan empire and the Mapuche). At least they should try to balance this, we see the great space that North America has for this, with respect to Mexico and the Caribbean I think they are regions too small for a new civilization, but if this were possible, 1 or 2 would be interesting there.

In South America, I think there are already enough civilizations, Great Colombia, the Incas, Brazil and Mapuche occupy a large part of its land, I think there could be no other.

 

[Ryansinbela]

The Lakota is another way of saying Sioux (although some people prefer the word Lakota due to the meaning of Sioux)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Here's my ideas:
Europe: Italy and Austria. I already know Europe is saturated but these would be my last two picks for Europe. Romania would be interesting too if we needed one from Eastern Europe over Austria.
North America: Iroquois and Navajo are my preferred choices but I'll take any one or two civs. My next choice would be a PNW culture like Tlingit/Haida
Caribbean: Haiti. I know this is part of North America but I made this separate considering we haven't had a civ from the region yet.
Africa: Berbers. North Africa to me is the real only missing region of Africa needed. If we have to do another Sub Saharan African civ I guess I'd go with the Swahili but I'd prefer more NA civs first.
Middle East: Assyria. I actually wanted them to return over Babylon.
East Asia: Siam. I know we just had a SEA civ but I don't see many other possibilities. Central/South Asia has great options like Mughals or Tibet but not sure if that's realistic or not?

 

[Edgecrusher]

I personally would prefer if they did not add any new Civs, and instead create alternative leaders from different Eras of existing civs.
For example, a new kingdom leader for Egypt, industrial-era leader for Germany, a different dynastic leader for Persia or Arabia, etc..
Tie in a metric that poor leadership would effectively cause Civs to change leaders mid-game.
Additionally, include a metric in which Schisms or Revolutions could essentially split Religion or Civilizations into a breakaway Religion or Civilization. i.e. spawning a new Civ from a neglected/remote collection of cities that effectively may have developed their own culture. For example, say a colonial set of cities of Spain, under the right circumstances decides to break away. Instead of being independent free cities, a new civ rises up uniting them that isnt currently in the game. A religious schism could be a mechanic to facilitate a breakaway culture. Say 3 or 4 colonial cities have a foreign religion, instead of the home religion.

If they were to add new Civs, I would like to some that had truly unique playstyles. For example:
Venice, not being able to create Settlers. In lieu can only grow by "buying" city states in which they are a suzierain or through conquest/capturing settlers.
Austria, having a similar diplomatic marriage ability to absorb city states through the marriage ability.
Huns, Play similar to how the barbarians are. in lieu of a settler, start with a camp that spawns units. Can build additional camps to do the same. Can take cities and "empire build", but has a difficult time managing them.
Sioux, Similar to the Huns

 

[Ryansinbela]

William used Venice's ability for the Vandals but they can only get settlers from Barbarian camps and coastal settlements

 

[TeddyMain]

Europe: Italy, Finland, Romania
Africa: Swahili, Morocco/Berbers, Ashanti, Benin
Asia: Burma, Timurids, Chola
Oceania: Hawaii
North America: Haida, Tlingit, Inuit, Navajo, Texas (pipe dream pick)
South America: Muisca, Argentina

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

North America: Haida, Tlingit, Inuit, Navajo, Texas (pipe dream pick)

Besides the Inuit I really don't hate these choices at all. Having both Haida and Tlingit might be a little too much though.

 

[TahamiTsunami]

I hope I'm not too late to the party to offer my 2 cents. It's hard to know how many more Civs Firaxis would include if at all so I'll just mention some that I'd like to see.

• Western Europe: Not too many viable options left here that I recall apart from something like the Visigoths, etc. My choice if we had to have more from this location would be Ireland. Perhaps led by Brian Boru or Grace O'Malley for more of that pirate queen flavor. Don't know where Scandinavia lands in a split between western and eastern Europe, but Denmark under Margaret I could be interesting and different enough from from Viking Norway or Industrial Sweden.
• Eastern Europe: A couple of good options here such as Bulgaria with Simeon I as the most notable option. Austria with Maria Theresa would be a good returning option. Lithuania sounds like an interesting choice though I'm not sure who would lead them. Depending on where you split Europe from the Middle East, I'd also like to see Khazaria lead by Bulan as my top choice for the region followed by Bulgaria. I would pick them for interesting gameplay potential involving religion.
• Africa: An entire continent that's severely lacking representation. If I had to name my 3 most desired choices, it would be Zimbabwe with Nyatsimba Mutota, Benin with Idia, and Morocco with Yusuf I. I gotta give shoutouts to some other good choices like Dihya for the Berbers, Soleiman Hacen for the Swahili / Kilwa, Ranavalona I for Madagascar, and Osei Kofi Tutu I for the Ashanti. Also want to mention Seretse Khama leading Botswana for a more modern choice.
• North America: Another region that I find severely lacking so I'll name my top 3 options here as well: Tlingit lead by Katlian, Navajo lead by Manuelito, and Natchez lead by Qiugualtam. A load of good choices here but a PNW coastal civ, and a SW desert farming civ, and a Mississippian mound building civ seem the most preferable to me. A few other strong contenders that should be known are the should-be-returning Iroquois (Thayendanegea or Jigonhsasee), the famous Powhatan (Wahunsenacawh), and the fearsome Comanche (Puhihwitsikwasʉ aka Iron Jacket).
• South America: I know that they share a lot of land with Colombia, but I'd still like to see Nemequene lead the Muisca as my top choice. I haven't looked too much into them, but I've heard that Sepe Tiaraju leading the Guarani would be another good choice. For a more modern choice, Argentina makes sense and has some interesting leader options like José de San Martín. Also want to shout out Anacaona to lead the Taino from the Caribbean and Zuangua to lead the Purepecha from Mesoamerica.
• Middle East: Obviously Assyria is going to be my first choice for this region and they have a ton of good leader options such as Tiglath-Pileser III, Ashurnasirpal, a less conventional choice like Shammuramat for those who want it, etc. After Assyria, I'd like to see the Gurkani to have a civ that covers the Timurids and the Mughals in a more poorly covered part of the world. I think a leader from between the 2 heights of the dynasty like Babur would be my pick but I wouldn't complain about Timur, Shah Jahan, etc. A few other honorable mentions for Judea under Hezekiah, Armenia under Tigranes II, and Yemen under Arwa Al-Sulayhi.
• Far East: My top choices are Burma under Bayinnaung, and Siam under Rama V. They aren't too likely but my honorable mentions for this region are to the Philippines under Lapulapu, Hawaii under Kamehameha I, and Tonga under Sālote Tupou III.

Besides the Inuit I really don't hate these choices at all. Having both Haida and Tlingit might be a little too much though.

I agree that we most likely won't be seeing both together for a while but I would love to see it at some point in the far future. If we can have England and Scotland together, then we can dream about a future civ game with far more Native American civs that has both the Tlingit and Haida!