Prehistoric Era Revamp

KaTiON_PT

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For the past few months I have been working on improving the already great prehistoric era, mostly by integrating suggestions and accommodating complaints regarding units or buildings that should be useful but simply aren't, like Chasers.

I wanted to share my proposal first as I feel this is too profound a change to introduce without discussing it first.

The first and most important change is to the tech tree itself, I tried my best in reordering the technologies to make buildings/units unlock in a more balanced way while at the same time keeping up with their expected historicity (mainly by researching through Wikipedia and the scholarly sources it cites).

Proposed tech tree vs. Regular tech tree

An unexpected but favorable change is that players now start with three choices instead of two, and each was made more meaning, requiring players to ponder more what will be the first technology.
  • Cave Dwelling is the first choice, it allows access to six different prehistoric cave world wonders that give tremendous bonuses ( :food::hammers::gold: ) for the lucky civilization that manages to constructs it. This is also where the Neanderthal culture resides, allowing the player to build neanderthal units that are stronger compared to regular Homo Sapiens. This is an high-risk/high-reward pick however, so make sure you got caves nearby and hope another civilization doesn't chose the same wonder as you do!
  • Nomadism is the second choice, although seemingly bare compared to the previous pick this one allows the construction of the first exploration unit, the Wanderer, that is able to get much better results from Goody Huts compared to Stone Throwers. There's also the not so obvious benefit of getting to Scavenging or Gathering faster, very important technologies for revealing many map resources and unlocking many :food: and :hammers: buildings.
  • Language is the third choice, pick this one first if you are near to a Wonder of Nature as these provide various bonuses that can kickstart a player's development. It also allows direct access to the first two civics, both of which improve :science: rate.
The next big change is to how units are unlocked. Hunting units are now more evenly spaced in the tech tree, with Chasers lasting a longer time. In other words, Chasers are now your early-prehistoric hunters and Trackers your mid-prehistoric hunters.

Education providing and crime and disease combating units are now situated in the same column in the tech tree, meaning you could unlock them at roughly the same time. Like hunters they are more evenly spaced between each other.

The first important "strike team" units, Rouges and Ambushers, now unlock with the brand new late-prehistoric tech called Nocturnalism.

In regards to buildings, not much has changed. The two most important would be Harems, which now unlock at game start and require the Alpha Male building, and Elder Council, moved to Chiefdom. A few buildings have had their unlock requirements changed to be more easy to get and fewer less had their yields modified a little bit.

Many buildings have had their names changed though not drastically (e.g. from "Wood Carver's Hut" to "Wood Carver").

Last but not least, many cultures are now unlocked later when their first unit is made available. Normalized Heroes strength too as there were a couple of cases where there were 13:strength: heroes in a time where the most powerful unit is 6:strength:.

In my playthroughs the AI plays just fine, I would actually suggest you to lower your difficulty a level or two in order to adapt to the new changes.

I then present to you my proposal for a changed and, hopefully, better prehistoric era.
 

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With Size Matters, Hide and Seek and Without Warning, Chasers are completely useless, so moving Trackers later just leaves more hunterless time for animals to conglomerate.

You must know how research has been stomped on in Prehistoric already. Moving the Elder Council so late just seems like another unnecessary dollop of the same.

I have a bad feeling about the move of Ambushers and Rogues to late in the era. It just seems to be making Prehistoric longer and more boring for no good reason. What's the slowest speed you tested on?
 
With Size Matters, Hide and Seek and Without Warning, Chasers are completely useless, so moving Trackers later just leaves more hunterless time for animals to conglomerate.

They have been made stronger.

You must know how research has been stomped on in Prehistoric already. Moving the Elder Council so late just seems like another unnecessary dollop of the same.

I can move it back. Though I found that with these changes you get more research than normal.

I have a bad feeling about the move of Ambushers and Rogues to late in the era. It just seems to be making Prehistoric longer and more boring for no good reason.

This is a decision that was made in conjunction with thunderbrd, those two units are quite powerful and were available too soon. You still got your thieves if you want to do covert actions.

What's the slowest speed you tested on?

Marathon.
 
I can move it back. Though I found that with these changes you get more research than normal.
How much more? I suggest that if you don't get to Sed Life within 12% of turns (which is already very slow) on any speed (at say Monarch diff), research is too slow.
 
When I tried a noble game I got there at 11% without beelining.

On immortal I got there at 14% but I had to beeline and focus my city to "research tech".
 
When I tried a noble game I got there at 11% without beelining.

On immortal I got there at 14% but I had to beeline and focus my city to "research tech".

That's not too bad, but you have to admit, it's not fast. I still think the Elder Council should be earlier where it's been for as long as I can remember.

Their strength vs. animals was increased from 150% to 200%.

If you mean bonus vs. animals, it must have been only recently reduced to 150%. It was always Wanderer 1 + 100%, Chaser 1 + 200%.

With Size Matters' 33% reduction, this is still only 0.66 + 200% = 2, which is only enough to hunt harmless animals, although on favourable terrain (50% bonus or better) it may discourage basic predators from attacking.
 
With Size Matters' 33% reduction, this is still only 0.66 + 200% = 2, which is only enough to hunt harmless animals, although on favourable terrain (50% bonus or better) it may discourage basic predators from attacking.
I'm totally cool with having to be delayed in taking down larger game until a bit later. Previously, you could just pass over chasers entirely and just go from wanderers to trackers. So they were basically a non-existant step.
Their strength vs. animals was increased from 150% to 200%.
OK. That works for me.
If you mean bonus vs. animals, it must have been only recently reduced to 150%. It was always Wanderer 1 + 100%, Chaser 1 + 200%.
I don't think it was too recent actually but I do remember it being 200% when it was originally introduced.

Random idea here: What if we gave the Chaser a strong subdual bonus that makes it technically even much better than a tracker at subdual (they aren't really using much in the way of weapons so it actually makes sense.) That way you are compelled to use them as quick as you can to get a surge of subdued animals when it matters the most (if they can survive, which is a longshot). Then you take a dive and work back up to stronger subdual values later as you start getting more and more survivable hunting units.

This might make it not feel like just a linear improvement chain on both survivability and subduability, which could be an interesting tradeoff.
 
Previously, you could just pass over chasers entirely and just go from wanderers to trackers. So they were basically a non-existant step.
Agreed.
 
Random idea here: What if we gave the Chaser a strong subdual bonus that makes it technically even much better than a tracker at subdual (they aren't really using much in the way of weapons so it actually makes sense.) That way you are compelled to use them as quick as you can to get a surge of subdued animals when it matters the most (if they can survive, which is a longshot). Then you take a dive and work back up to stronger subdual values later as you start getting more and more survivable hunting units.

This might make it not feel like just a linear improvement chain on both survivability and subduability, which could be an interesting tradeoff.

Interesting idea, how better at subduing should they become?
 
Interesting idea, how better at subduing should they become?
What are the current base subdual % rates for Wanderers, Chasers, Trackers, and Hunters? I'm not even sure how to reference that exactly since this has been done a little differently than what I expect in standard XML.
 
Alright. :) Let me first do a few minor corrections and modify the chaser's subdue value.
Yeah, you never answered my question on that... I'm still curious.
 
Found the tag, <iCaptureProbabilityModifierChange>

The 1st ensnare promotion gives +10%, how high should the chaser have?
 
Found the tag, <iCaptureProbabilityModifierChange>

The 1st ensnare promotion gives +10%, how high should the chaser have?
CaptureProbability is not the same as SubdueChance.

SubdueChance is defined on the UnitCombatClass I think. Modifiers are defined in the mission/outcomes where promotions are mentioned.
 
CaptureProbability is not the same as SubdueChance.

SubdueChance is defined on the UnitCombatClass I think. Modifiers are defined in the mission/outcomes where promotions are mentioned.
Hmm... maybe we could add it to their weapon UnitCombat... like an extra 20%.
UNITCOMBAT_WEAPON_H2H_FIST

That would naturally give Brutes a 20% Subdual as well... Which is interesting. Maybe only 10% then?

It's at least logical that if you beat up an animal you're more likely to end the fight taming it rather than killing it. I know that most subdued animals are the young but this is an interesting story alternative to that.


FYI: Capture percent is for the captive system (human captives)
 
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