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-Prethread- NCNESIOT: Blackened Skies

Discussion in 'Imperium OffTopicum' started by Nuka-sama, Dec 8, 2015.

  1. Nuka-sama

    Nuka-sama :)

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    Yea they are French
     
  2. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    NEW RULES: Army Doctrine and Deployment System, Action Potential Fully-Realized, and Discoveries

    Hello everyone! We're back to our old tricks here at Nuka-Crezth Productions. A quick glance at my inbox confirms general lack of confidence in these new changes, so I'm here to set the record straight and assure you all that this system is vastly superior to the old system.

    Army Doctrine & Deployment

    First of all, I've been wanting to get rid of the old Das/EQ model of buying units in discrete stacks. Although, in theory, it allows a player to control their force composition and the pace of a build-up, it's always too abstract to allow an accurate description of a nation's military. It is a true fact, for instance, that the number of U.S. Army men-at-arms is a little under half of all active U.S. Army personnel, all of whom are necessary to provide the logistics and support for the functioning of the army. The point is that a military is more than just war machines and soldiers, it's a (generally quite large) government institution. We've been working towards representing more and more government policy discretely, and an idea I had to address the military problem was to treat the military like another government policy.

    Hence the Army stat now shows six sub-stats: Mass, Firepower, Movement, Integration, Support, and Discipline. These are not an objective measurement of your army quality, as the previous stats were: these are sliders where you can increase or decrease focus in any category to get concomitant bonuses. Each point in an Army category costs 1 AP per turn to maintain, just like social policies (and the General Conscription/Service By Requirement policies will changed to increase your maximum manpower pool, as investing points in Mass accomplishes the end of a build-up). Hence, these stats represent the government effort in focusing on those aspects of its military machine. This automatically dictates the pace and composition of military build-ups, and the force composition of your troops.

    Army quality, etc, are now being represented in the XP system: Army, Navy, and Air XP refer to general competence in these areas, and appropriately increase your ability to pioneer new technologies in this area, and also indicates general army quality.

    The six stats of Army Doctrine are:

    MASS. Army focus build-up. Each point in Mass decreases recruitment cost by 10% and increases recruitment speed by 10%.
    FIREPOWER. Weapons, artillery, heavy firepower focus. Each point in Firepower increases army lethality by 10%, anti-armor and flak power by 10%, and upkeep cost by 10%.
    MOVEMENT. Tanks, half-tracks, trucks, and motorization focus. Each point in Movement increases army maneuver by 10%, and upkeep cost by 10%.
    INTEGRATION. Radio comm. technology focus, cross-sectional commands, hierarchy. Each point in Integration increases recruitment cost by 10% and increases bonuses received from armor and air superiority by 10%, but reduces upkeep cost by 10%. For each point of Integration above Support, recruitment cost is increased by another 10%.
    SUPPORT. Med-kits, soldier tools, infantry support weapons, radios. Each point in Support increases combat strength by 10%, anti-armor and flak power by 10%, and increases recruitment and upkeep cost by 10%.
    DISCIPLINE. Loyalty, enforced either by commissars or special training. Each point in Discipline increases resilience by 20%, and increases recruitment cost by 10% but reduces upkeep cost by 10%.

    "Great," you say, "So now we know how to instruct policy. How is this executed?"

    Automatically, your Deployment level, which represents a % value of your maximum theoretical sustainable deployment, crawls towards your Mobilization value, whether it is higher or lower. If your Deployment is higher than your Mobilization, you are "demobilizing" the armed forces; if Deployment is lower than Mobilization, you are "mobilizing." Hence when you are mobilizing, expect to spend money building up a grand army.

    100% Mobilization will now, appropriately, represent a maximum and considerable effort involved in building up a military.

    Some players, especially communist ones, may chafe at this because the temptation to stay 100% Mobilized to control your entire economy can be strong for the autarkic among you. However, the gradual military build-up is meant to address the strain of this ownership. In reality, state relationship with the economy is a complex beast, and even massive state entities like the Soviet and Chinese governments depended at least partially on private actors, or at least actors whose authority as well as responsibility is centralized completely within themselves.

    Nevertheless, I will continue exploring ways to add nuance to the system and continue tweaking the manpower values.

    Navy and Air are now Navy and Wing, representing naval and wing forces in your nation. The new canonical term for an air force is a "wing" and I expect that to be used from henceforth. Anywho, these stats list all of the big war machines the nation controls.

    Screens: Destroyers and lt. cruisers. Useful for anti-aircraft and anti-submarine warfare, escorting capital ships, and escorting trade convoys.
    Capital Ships: Heavy cruisers and battleships. Fast, high-seas battle. Excellent ship-to-ship power. Accuracy and overall effectiveness heavily dependent on Navy XP.
    Carriers: Slow, high-seas battle. Can stage Lt-Fighters and Tac Bombers (takes up more deck space). Overall effectiveness and quality of air support heavily dependent on Air XP.
    Submarines/Raiders: Sneaky or fast. Excellent on the attack, heavily reliant on stealth for defense. Very good at attacking trade barges.

    Tac. Bombers: Short-range ordnance delivery systems. Good at providing close-air support when army Integration is high. Can perform a wide variety of bombing tasks. Vulnerable to enemy fighters and anti-aircraft artillery.
    Stg. Bombers: Long-range, high-altitude ordnance delivery systems. Require Hv-Fighter escorts to operate in enemy territory. Good at bombing large targets like factories and fortresses.
    Lt-Fighters: Short-range, agile aircraft. Good at fighting enemy aircraft. Ace pilots can take full advantage of their maneuverability to be nigh-unbeatable in dogfights.
    Hv-Fighters: Long-range, heavy aircraft. Limited maneuverability, but mount stronger guns. Generally tougher than Lt-Fighters.

    Pricing for these units will be put on the pricing sheet when I update it, as well as what the current military build-up "base" cost is for you.

    Action Potential

    Action Potential has been increased across the board, as you have no doubt all noticed. This is because Action Potential's role has been upgraded: it is now the primary currency of action for everything in the game. Spending EPs/ICs is now performed automatically to pursue the policies you command.

    There are two kinds of Policies you can enact with Action Potential:

    Maintained - This is a policy maintained from year to year. Their effects are recorded in the Activity Audity and a full list of Maintained Policies will be kept in an easy-to-access reference on the front page (pending as of Jul. 11). Some maintained Policies are "special" Policies that cost no AP or no IC to maintain and are granted by special plot effects. Typical maintained policies include infrastructure development, economic investment efforts, and government social programs.

    Immediate - This is a policy that is really more like an edict, an executive command, or a direct order to subordinates. The spending of an AP represents the flexing of your influence necessary to force this to happen. The effects of immediate policies can vary widely, from being a call to action that vitalizes the nation, to being a fruitless order to retreat not one step back, to being a general call for more books, schools, or teachers. They lack the carry-through of Maintained policies, but sometimes their spirit and spontaneity can provide great results.

    Example- The Democratic Fascism of Germany has declared war on the People's Empire of England. The DFG spends 1 AP issuing the declaration of war, giving them plausibility in the eyes of the world, and stating their intentions clearly to their own people. They also enable the creation of a War Committee at 1 AP/turn, charged with mobilizing the nation's resources for war.

    Example 2- The Democratic Fascism of Germany has invaded the People's Empire of England. The DFG neglected to declare war, saving them an AP and allowing them to focus their political efforts on the logistics of the invasion, although rendering the invasion an unscrupulous and dishonorable sneak attack. They enable the creation of a War Committee at 1 AP/turn, and also enable a policy of General Conscription at 1 AP/turn.

    AP that is spent maintaining Army Doctrine points counts as AP that is being used for Maintenance, for all intents and purposes.

    Discoveries

    Scientific progress will be modeled in this game with Discoveries. Each year, depending on the amount of education occurring worldwide (with bonuses for educational systems that interact with each other, i.e. international student support), there are chances of Discoveries occurring in each expertise category. Discoveries are generated in the world and assigned to a nation randomly depending on its percentage ownership of the global XP in that category. Hence, the more XP you have, the more likely you are to spawn Discoveries.

    Discoveries will range from plot-important discoveries, like Alphonse Elric's theory of quantum mechanics, to practical inventions, like a carburetor that can take 98 miles to the gallon refrigerators.

    Discoveries will be listed in totum at the end of each update, including the effects they incur and the patent-holder (although there is no internationally accepted patent standard, this will represent the first patent of its kind. In some cases, there will be multiple patent holders).

    Wrap-up

    That's it for now. Next rules update I am looking at modeling resources, including shortages and supplies, and diverse valuation of IC. Base Cost will be split into Base Cost, which will be the cost of inputs, partially dictated by the availability or shortage of resources; and Base Value, which will be the economic value of the outputs, based on the quality of those goods which will be determined from your XP, and saturation of the resources represented by those goods in the markets you operate in. These changes will merge into the Trade Group system.

    After that, I acknowledge the manual is in dire need of an update. I hope to finish the new manual by the end of August.
     
  3. Ahigin

    Ahigin Chieftain

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    I actually like these changes. Being able to select particular division types was fun, but I agree the current system is pretty robust.

    Does mobilization/deployment impact only the amount of Public IC? Are there any combat bonuses from mobilization for the troops?
     
  4. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    Mobilization no longer confers combat bonuses; it is a measurement of policy. It will still affect Public/Private ownership and reserves trickle (which will now reflect the long, slow, painful growth of your service-fit population).

    Deployment is the heart of all combat strength. The % is the percentage of your reserves that have been mobilized.

    edit: noticed the Reserves stat was inaccurate and referring to deprecated values. zzz. it's been fixed now and should list ALL of your remaining, recruitable reserves, and the concomitant reserve trickle.
     
  5. Mosher

    Mosher Mushroom dad

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    So does this mean that you no don't recruit your combat divisions? You only get divisions through mobilization/deployment (you can't buy divisions with IC)?
     
  6. Double A

    Double A wak

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    Do we still buy units? If not, and AP is now so prevalent, what do we even use EP on?
     
  7. Masada

    Masada Koi-san!

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    I hear the golden statue and white elephant business is booming
     
  8. arya126

    arya126 Squad Leader

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    If we dont use EP for units any more how do we determine our forces composition? What if we want to recruit armored and motorized forces instead of infantry? How do we buy fighters vs. bombers or capital ships vs screens (why not just simplify it to Battleships and Destroyers/Cruisers by the way? Battleships sounds so much better than Capital Ships, and screens likewise is so bland)?
     
  9. JohannaK

    JohannaK Careless Whisperer

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    Capital ships can be Battlecruisers or Heavy Cruisers, too. Of course it can also be carriers, but those have their own category, so...
     
  10. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    That is quite correct.

    EP is spent to afford the IC-costs of your various projects. If, for example, you have a project that is projected to cost 10 IC, and you have a Base Cost of 2 EP/IC, you can surmise the total cost of the project will be 20 EP. You don't have to budget this explicitly anymore, because of the AP system.

    Airframes and navy vessels, and how to purchase them, will be shown on the pricing sheet (when I update it, within the next few days). Like projects, they will have a projected cost and then a varying actual cost, and you will build them continuously over X-amount of time. I decided to do it this way because Hearts of Iron IV is a good game.

    Force composition is dictated according to your military's doctrine, as I already explained. Here's some examples:

    What would an infantry-heavy army look like? - 0's everywhere; this is default
    What would a large, quickly raised infantry-heavy army look like? - 6 Mass, 0's everywhere else
    What if those infantry have good guns? - 6 Mass, 1 Firepower
    What if those infantry have extensive fire support and logistic organization? - 6 Mass, 1 Firepower, 1 Integration, 2 Support
    What would an army with a lot of tanks look like? - 4 Firepower, 4 Movement
    I mean a LOT of tanks? - 2 Mass, 4 Firepower, 4 Movement
    Blitzkrieg army (CAS + Armor spearheads)? - 2 Firepower, 5 Movement, 3 Integration
    Deep battle army (many heavy divisions and attack companies)? - 4 Mass, 1 Firepower, 3 Movement, 2 Support
    American army 1945 - 4 Firepower, 2 Movement, 3 Integration, 1 Support
    Japanese army 1937 - 4 Mass, 3 Firepower, 1 Integration, 2 Discipline

    Essentially, the point is that the decision of recruiting "more armored divisions than infantry" is a misleading one as it runs contrary to the actual responsibility of the pinnacle policymaker. Building micro-units doesn't make sense on a macro-scale. Hence, all you should be responsible for is the status of the overall build-up effort.
     
  11. Double A

    Double A wak

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    actually yeah that makes a ton of sense
     
  12. Masada

    Masada Koi-san!

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    Dunno if I agree with having everyone start at 0 military XP.

    How does doctrine adoption work?
     
  13. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    Everyone should not have 0 military XP right now. I'm away from my compy but I'll check when I can.

    Doctrine adoption, by which I assume you are referring to the doctrine archtype, is an automatic description of which doctrine archtype matches your country's military doctrine. The match is confirmed by having the lowest value of the squared error of the individual doctrine stats.

    All doctrines will be listed in the same resource I will put all the social programs and prices on.
     
  14. Masada

    Masada Koi-san!

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    It's more some militaries would have more experience than others. That's also true of navies. How are you tracking that?

    Are there more archetypes? And can we get a write-up of the doctrines to give people and understanding of what they actually entail.

    Can I also change my doctrine name to "Fire and shock?"
     
  15. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    Can't spend long on this because I have to go, but real quick:

    1. XP is tracked dually: XP gained recently/total XP over time. There will be an XP decay at some point but not yet.

    2. There will be more archtypes eventually, this is just because the World War is only starting. I'm still working on the exact function of archtypes but I can get a description out... later today.

    3. Yueah.
     
  16. Masada

    Masada Koi-san!

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    1. Oh ok. Flow not stock.

    2. Ok.

    3. Sweet.

    **

    Are there other variables sitting under the hood that vary between countries?
     
  17. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    Yeah, there are. I can get into that now while I'm on break:

    Since the Modifier subsystem has been deprecated (replaced by the Policy module which is far more robust and can achieve a much wider variety of functionality), a lot of modifiers which I previously used had to be rolled into the new system. Many modifiers were made obsolete by policies, just because policies are able to achieve all the same effects with less headache and more interaction with the economy system.

    Stuff-that-isn't-policies (hard-coded modifiers or unlisted modifiers) are very few. Off the top of my head I can't even think of one, not so much as a BritishNavy *= 1.5. Everything emerges from the system. Hence the only distinctions come from XP and Policies, and the internal politics that allow these XP and Policies. This is because I have put a lot of effort into making sure the system is consistent and information is delivered to the players in a consistent manner. That is why, instead of the unlisted and frustrating Modifiers system, we have the above-books Policy system.

    However, sometimes special policies are given. Any policy listed as [CLASSIFIED] is a secret policy and sometimes also a special policy that costs no AP. Rocket test sites, weapons skunkworks, you know the drill. Which [CLASSIFIED] is which will only be perfectly obvious to the policy enactors. Other policies are unique to countries, called "special policies:" Australasia's factory-fortresses policy is one such, Russia's Purification program is another.

    When resources get introduced, some policies will also consume resources, causing efficiency hits when the resource is in shortage and efficiency boost when the resource is in surplus.
     
  18. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

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    The front page of the main thread has been updated with new tables detailing all (most) of the active social policies and explaining a few of the new rules. This document will be updated over the next few days with additional context-specific information and assistance, however in general it should be clear how it works. Building units, for instance, is now accomplished through programs.

    Here's a quick link
     
  19. Masada

    Masada Koi-san!

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    Can you clarify how unit building works, with some examples please?
     
  20. Double A

    Double A wak

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    Does building one category of unit still only cost 1AP? Do units cost any AP at all?

    Also I still feel like EP has lost the vast majority of its functionality.
     

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