"Professional army" no longer gives happiness?

[Chiatroll]

I was on the honor tree trying to get happiness so I could continue to warmonger for techs while I beeline military as Assyria and noticed that "Professional army" still has the cost reduction for upgrades but no longer has happiness for walls and castles and such. It looks like they replaced it with a reduction in the cost to build the Barracks, Armories, and military academies 50% faster.

Was there a point to picking honor outside of fixing the unhappiness caused by your expansion from constant conquest?

I only tend to build these in key unit making cities myself to keep my maintence costs down so I can unit spam when I'm going military so this benefit just isn't going to come up in many cities, but I always need happiness when I'm on an extended (permanent) military campaign so I feel this was a bit of an odd change for the tree.

It seemed honor was always unpopular when polled and when you see a deity lets play it seems to still be unpopular and when madjinn tried to explain how to use it, even though he was picking civilizations that do better with honors then other civs, he had to retry several to make it approach being as worth while as other openers.

I'm not sure if I missed something about honor though so I thought I'd bring it up on this forum. What are your thoughts on this change in the game?

 

[Santa Maria]

I think the cost reduction to Barracks, Armories, etc. should come with the opener or the 1st policy in the tree.

 

[Browd]

The Professional Army happiness buff was transferred to an Autocracy level 1 tenet - Fortified Borders (+1 local happiness from every castle, arsenal and military base).

 

[Chiatroll]

I think the cost reduction to Barracks, Armories, etc. should come with the opener or the 1st policy in the tree.

that would be nice.

I was checking policies in new Autocracy and saw "Fortified Borders: +2 Local Happiness per Walls, Castle, Arsenal and Military Base" so it made be to avoid giving away 3 happiness per those when people combine them... but it still feels like a weakening of the tree that didn't need to be weakened.

I can't say honor got the fair end of that deal. I'd take some sort of early happiness management for my conquests over 50% faster buildings that cost gold maintenance so will only get build at rare times. If they became free I could at least say I was getting an attempt to stay balanced.

oops didn't see what Browd posted before I replied.

 

[Venetian Legion]

Honor has never been my favorite policy branch. Especially now that a great happiness booster has been removed to a tenet late in the game. Oh well!

 

[Chiatroll]

So why in the world should anyone pick honor now?

 

[Browd]

Nostalgia?

 

[pilot00]

Nostalgia?

So why in the world should anyone pick honor now?

Moar gold and culture? Those commodities seem to be in short supply at the start at least.

 

[Rhaegar7]

Still better than Liberty.

 

[George Abitbol]

So why in the world should anyone pick honor now?

I pick honor when playing China, England or even Sweden: Military Tradition is awesome for their UU (gain 50% more experience in combat). I often have galleass with range promotion very quicly... Or longbows with logistics... Or Chu-no-ku with range +1 ...

 

[Ryoga]

The Professional Army happiness buff was transferred to an Autocracy level 1 tenet - Fortified Borders (+1 local happiness from every castle, arsenal and military base).

The problem is that this way they changed a policy tree that could potentially give 5 happiness per city into one that only gives you 1 happiness per city.

Honor was already considered the weakest opener but I always maintained that it was awesome in late game for a total conquest strategy because of professional army.

Now it doesn't even have that.
There are now very few reasons to choose honor at all, especially when you consider all the alternatives. The bonus to the exp gain is the only thing that is truly worthwhile, but it comes at the cost of three policies.

 

[pilot00]

Still better than Liberty.

Yeah if liberty couldnt get any worse, they gave GE to tradition :facepalm.

 

[Triskelli]

The Honor opener is still really damn useful with the addition of trade routes and the more aggressive barbarians. Knowing where barbs are coming from is indespensible for the early game. Aside from the opener though there's very little reason to continue up the tree. Maybe if they added a policy that removed the XP cap from killing barbs.

 

[Simplicity2]

Warmongering has two major hits in BNW. One is the happiness. the other is the gold hit from losing trade. Good luck keeping trade routes up if you fight a lot. The gold finisher is indispensable at that point. The XP bonus is huge. The flanking bonus is like +15 to all of your attacks if you have a large army. It's not a bad tree for war.

 

[DogBoy]

This may sound like a stupid question, but where is Autocracy now? I'm playing my first game of Brave New World and I can't find Autocracy. Is there another way to make my Aztecs happy with walls, castle, and arsenal?

 

[TheMarshmallowBear]

This may sound like a stupid question, but where is Autocracy now? I'm playing my first game of Brave New World and I can't find Autocracy. Is there another way to make my Aztecs happy with walls, castle, and arsenal?

Build three factories or reach Modern Era and you will find your answer

 

[LoneRebel]

This may sound like a stupid question, but where is Autocracy now? I'm playing my first game of Brave New World and I can't find Autocracy. Is there another way to make my Aztecs happy with walls, castle, and arsenal?

Autocracy is now an Ideology, along with Freedom and Order. Ideologies only come into play starting in the Industrial Era, either by building three Factories or reaching the Modern Era, whichever comes first.

The old happiness boost from defensive buildings was transferred to an Autocracy Level 1 Tenet, "Fortified Borders", as mentioned earlier.

There's also a level 2 Autocracy tenet that grants happiness from the unit-training buildings...

Edit: Someone beat me to it, of course.

 

[reddishrecue]

Honor will prevent barbarians from plundering your improvements easier but it won't make building wonders easier. Military caste can get you culture and happiness but at least you also get cheaper upgrades for your units.