Quest for the silmarils

[thomas.berubeg]

(Copied and pasted from Chamber of records- Elda King)
These are my ideas for the Silmarils, and the quests for finding them. I don't know if it can be done, or how, so I though about many alternatives to it.
History: Fëanor, the greatest elven smith ever, created 3 bright gems using the light of the two Trees that lighted the world (they later gave origin to the Sun and the Moon); they had light of their own, and all desired them. They were called the Silmarils. But the Enemy destroyed the trees and stole the Silmarils, and now they must be recovered by the free peoples.
Ideas The National Wonder "Quest for Silmaril - 1", when built for the first time, makes one Silmaril unit (barbarian unit) randomly appear at any land tile on the map. This unit is invisible to all that didn't build the wonder, and can't move by itself - but can be "taken" by any hero unit and moved to anywhere. The building only generates a Silmaril when built by the first time, but anyone can build it to be able to see this Silmaril - or to search for another Silmaril.
When a player captures the Silmaril, it must bring it to his capital; while at a players capital, it gives several benefits to that civ: extra gold/hammers/research, more XP, more happiness/health, etc (I'm not quite sure).
After one player have built the "Quest for Silmaril -1", it can build the "Quest for Silmaril -2" and start searching for another Silmaril, even if it didn't find the first. The same for the "Quest for Silmaril -3".
Goals make a barbarian unit spawn when a building is built by the first time, but not when it's built again; have a unit that must be moved by another unit of a certain category (like treasures of Civ3, or perhaps after captured, the capturer gets a promo - like FFH "Orthus' Axe", that goes to who kills it - and must return to the capital?); give benefits while a certain unit is at the capital of the civ.
Alternatives These are to be used if something is impossible or too hard to be done: instead of a building, a tech could spawn the unit when researched by the first time; the unit could be spawned at the start of the game, but would only become visible with the building/tech; any unit could capture it; the unit could trigger a golden age that last while it's at the capital.

 

[Love]

That civ who have the silmarill is war declared by house of fëanor direcly?

 

[Elda King]

No! Imagine: you are playing with the House of Feanor, then you simply start a war with the biggest war power in the world just because they got a Silmaril? And, worse, they have the bonuses from the Silmaril, and you don't.
Also, the Sons of Feanor didn't destroy Ossiriand, nor attacked Thingol. They are aggressive, and bound by a terrible oath but I think we don't need to make their oath a part of the game.

 

[JohnCrenshaw]

It seems to me that if they are bound by an oath, that is a disadvntage. That disadvantage ought to carry on to anyone that plays as them. There are probably a large number of races you could play as that would have inherent disadvantages like this. For example, if there were a hobbit race, wouldn't their war weariness be wild?

 

[Love]

It should be a rubber band mechanic on house of Fëanor atleast or something, a negative...

 

[Death900]

I'll see what i can do about the national wonder idea. I think it's doable, but I haven't looked at the code yet.

Instead of having a unit spawn, we could make it like a resource of some kind, since the Silmaril are gems. It will ensure they don't move, we won't have anything to spawn on a first-time basis and the resource mechanism in Civ4 has already some sort of condition to make them invisible. I'm pretty sure it's easy to make a resource become visible when a particular National Wonder is built. When the hero enters the tile of the Silmaril, a new action could be available, like capture Silmaril or something. Then the silmaril would disapear from the tile and the hero receive a kind of promotion that says he has the Silmaril. When the hero comes back to the capital, it could "unload" the silmaril and that would make it appear in the resource tab of the city view, where we could give the bonuses.

What do you think?

BTW, i haven't started anything yet, the week as been pretty loaded up to now and i have like 30 mins for myself each day (which I spend playing to relax).

 

[thomas.berubeg]

That might work.
if the heroe dies, the silmaril will be turned back into a resource...

BTW, do you have BTS?

 

[Death900]

yeah, let's not forget that the little puny hero can die...

BTW, no. I'll get it as soon as i can.

 

[T_F]

Not a bad idea. (Like the resource idea, that way they are generated at the beginning instead of when you build the wonder.)

The war-with-Silmarillë-possessors is an interesting idea, certainly would be a disadvantage. Still, it is accurate.

 

[Elda King]

Great, this way is even easier and better than I have thought of! As a resource, we have not to worry with it moving, nor with it being in the same tile as an enemy unit or being destroyed. About the war, perhaps this wonder (or the Silmaril itself) could cause penalties on diplomacy...

 

[T_F]

Idea: Instead of a national wonder, we could have a world wonder that enables it for all civs (like the Manhattan Project and nukes) - you could call it 'Fëanor's Workshop' or something.

Like the diplomacy idea - something like -5(?): 'You have a Silmaril in your posession!' (Only from Sons of Fëanor)

 

[Death900]

Idea: Instead of a national wonder, we could have a world wonder that enables it for all civs (like the Manhattan Project and nukes) - you could call it 'Fëanor's Workshop' or something.

Not a bad idea, but depends on what we want. I don't think it would make it harder or easier to make though.

 

[T_F]

Well, what do we want?

 

[Death900]

We want the banana dance!
Peanut butter jelly time!
.
..
...
erm maybe not.

Anyway, i think we should have a talk about it. What's the main idea about the quests? I don't know everything about LOTR, but for me you have to start the quest to have access to the special activities it implies. So that means (for me) that the National Wonder is more appropriate for this.

Something just struck me: we'll need to make the AI know about this quest and act upon it. That might be the thougher part...

Sorry i just can't say more, i'm just so tired. I'll post something tomorow too.

 

[T_F]

Couple of relatively unrelated ideas:

Silmaril Victory? Get all three Silmarils and you win.

Maybe when you get a Silmaril, instead of having an automatic diplo penalty with the Sons of Fëanor, they pop up and ask you for it next turn. (Maybe we should have a 'negotiate the price' option here.) If you refuse, then you get the 'You refused to turn your Silmaril over to us!' penalty.

Also, there should be a wonder like Eärendil's Voyage that you can build in a coastal city with a Silmaril. When it's done, it consumes the Silmaril (thus nullifying anyone's hope of a Silmaril Victory), but allows you to call down the Wrath of the Valar one time on one of your enemies.

 

[Elda King]

Maybe when you get a Silmaril, instead of having an automatic diplo penalty with the Sons of Fëanor, they pop up and ask you for it next turn. (Maybe we should have a 'negotiate the price' option here.) If you refuse, then you get the 'You refused to turn your Silmaril over to us!' penalty.

If it's doable, it's great.

Also, there should be a wonder like Eärendil's Voyage that you can build in a coastal city with a Silmaril. When it's done, it consumes the Silmaril (thus nullifying anyone's hope of a Silmaril Victory), but allows you to call down the Wrath of the Valar one time on one of your enemies.

I was planning have a Voyage of Eärendil victory condition, you have to build a lot of "pieces" (before the end of the First Age) and after x turns you would win (perfect with the new system of Beyond the Sword - we could even give Morgoth an alternative victory condition, like "Corruption of the World" or "Super-secret Weapon").

 

[T_F]

I was planning have a Voyage of Eärendil victory condition, you have to build a lot of "pieces" (before the end of the First Age) and after x turns you would win (perfect with the new system of Beyond the Sword - we could even give Morgoth an alternative victory condition, like "Corruption of the World" or "Super-secret Weapon").

That sounds good (what would the 'pieces' be?). The Morgoth victory could be that if every city in the world has a sort-of Morgoth Worship religion (esp. if we had an Inquisitor-type unit, then as its only religion), then he wins.

 

[xmen510]

I twould be interesteing if you could put the scenarios together. Such as when you complete the Voyage of Earendil you then have the option sort of like in Rhyse and fall of civ to then switch to the next era in gameplay. If you had say the first age as it's own, then the second, etc., but you start a whole new game instead.