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Questions about Sucellus

Discussion in 'Fall from Heaven Lore' started by Verdian, Apr 13, 2009.

  1. Verdian

    Verdian King

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    I am trying to dig up more information on Sucellus for the Divine story I am taking part it, and would love for some help. Here is what I know about him so far.

    He was the god of nature, and lived with and protected the elves during the Gods War. He eventually took sides when Agares threatened his arch-angel (and son?), Cernunnos.

    He was okay with withdrawing when the Compact was signed, because he did not want to see his children, the elves, hurt. He also did not like the destruction it was causing the world.

    When Mulcarn entered creation, Sucellus volunteered to stop him. He fought Mulcarn and was killed. His body was divided into 7 pieces and placed in seven Tombs of Sucellus.

    He was the first god to die and travel to the underworld, where he met Arawn. He convinced Arawn to give him the precept of Life so he could return to the world and bring life back to it. When did this rebirth occur? Before or after Mulcarn was killed by Kylorin?

    In order to be reborn, Sirona had to gather the seven pieces of Sucellus and bring them together. She did this because she is believed to be Sucellus' lover.

    This is my current understanding of his lore. I also had some questions.

    Is Basium now technically Sucellus's arch-angel, as he was created to be the arch-angel for the precept of Life? If not, does Sucellus have an arch-angel, or any for that matter? Can he just whip some up?

    What is the difference between the precept of Life and Nature? Is the creation of a living thing Life, but the rearing of it Nature?

    Thanks a lot!
     
  2. Giga-Gigan

    Giga-Gigan Warlord

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    I do believe that Sucellus was raised after Mulcarn was defeated, I think that mostly by virtue of the fact that he wasn't around for Mulcarn's own death.

    Also I do believe it was Nanusultra(sp?) who was romantically involved with Sucellus, as it was she who sent Kylorn to battle Mulcarn.

    I do believe Basium is still technically arc-angel, that or no one has taken up the position in his absence. I'm by no means sure but if anyone were still capable of making a creation as resource intensive as a respectable arc-angel then it would be the god of life...

    Finally I'd check the Creation, Dimensional, Force Lore thread in this very forum section for all your creation magic inquiry needs.


    Now that thats done I have my own question about Sucellus... Just where is he now? Has he taken up shop in the Netherworld? Did he retain his old vault and made the new God of Nature take a hike? Or was Nemed's vault still around? Or is he living with his Girlfriend?

    Edit: Sorry I got mixed up, (just because I can't sleep doesn't mean I don't need it) The God of Creation is probably the best off as far as creation goes... Still said thread is a valid resource to read.

    Further musings: I suppose since Nature Magic is all about Nurturing (and judging Basium's Nature) I imagine that life magic is more about healing, restoring, and perhaps energizing/invigorating. Though not to the extent of augmentation/grafting which I would say is more body magic. All in all I think that Life magic is more of a quick fix (like a splint for a broken bone), where as Nature Magic is long term investment (drinking lots of milk for stronger bones).
     
  3. PaulusIII

    PaulusIII Unholy Warlord

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    In response to the archangel question:

    Basium is no longer affiliated with any god, even though technically his people the Mercurians are in the Life sphere - Basium wished to become the God of Life when Arawn let the Life sphere go to heal the world from Mulcarn's reign. Arawn did not want to enter creation himself - his entire focus is on the Underworld - but instead gave the Life sphere to Sucellus.

    Basium also has nothing but disdain for Sucellus, so I doubt he's affiliated with him.

    Furthermore, we know that (following Magister's theory that the stronger beings a god created, the less powerful he is because of the power invested in the creation) Sucellus is not very powerful, since his former archangel Cernunnos (the current God of Nature) was one of the strongest beings created. So I doubt Sucellus has an archangel to serve him, since Cernunnos is now a god and Basium doesn't want anything to do with him - and I don't think he can create another.
     
  4. Kael

    Kael Deity

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    There are no examples of a god creating a 2nd archangel.

    As PaulusIII mentions Basium hates Sucellus. This is because Sucellus refused to participate in the godswar, that he lost the battle to Mulcarn and that Arawn gave him the dominion of Life (which Basium believes he should have).

    As Giga-Gigan mentioned both the promotion of Cernunnos to god of nature and the rebirth of Sucellus happened after Mulcarn was killed.
     
  5. Nikis-Knight

    Nikis-Knight Deity

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    To clarify, Kael mean creating an archangel a second time. Basium & Gyra are both Archangels created by Arawn, but at once, as twins.
     
  6. Kael

    Kael Deity

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    Good call. Its also worth noting that one of the Archangels was created significantly after the others. Agares didn't make an Archangel when the rest did, and instead created a corrupt version of Cernunnos as his Archangel.
     
  7. Nikis-Knight

    Nikis-Knight Deity

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    That's a good question. I'd guess he's clearing the cobwebs out of Nemeds vault; the gods and their domains are so intertwined it would probably feel quite odd to reside in a mismatched one.
    Since Nemed resigned before the godswar, he likely had the least servants, so unless some Nature spirits came with Sucellus, he's probably a bit short handed as well.
     
  8. Giga-Gigan

    Giga-Gigan Warlord

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    Interesting... Are all of the vaults stable, or do they break down without proper maintenance? Also what goes on God when a god assumes a vault? Can they just pick it up willy-nilly? Or is it a involved process that takes time for the god to make what ever changes he needs to do before he gets settled in?
     
  9. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    I don't think we really have an answer to those questions. We do however know that Bhall's holy heaven fell apart when she fell into evil and joined Agares in his hell. I suspect that some of it remains where it was, but ti is not what it used to be.

    I hadn't really thought about Nemed creating a vault, but it makes sense that he would. (If vaults do need maintaining, I doubt Arawn kept it in good shape.) He would not have had any angels serving him as the first of these were made at the start of the Godswar, but he may have had many elementals under his control. Sucellus likely doesn't have any True Angels serving him, but he is one of the most popular gods so he would have plenty of mortal souls on their way to becoming his angels. Based on his old entry, Arthendain gave his soul to Sucellus in exchange for resurrection and so will likely become an angel of life next time he dies, despite being a member of Kilmorph's religion.





    Creating a new living thing is in the sphere of Creation. As soon as the life is created though it would probably pass into the Nature sphere, as a fertilized egg doesn't become a grown man overnight.

    Maturation is the essence of Nature, as is evolution. Is is always changing, always growing. The growth of an infant from conception to old age in in this sphere.

    Life is about rebirth, restoration, healing, determination, waking up and fighting on despite the odds. Life is a struggle for survival and for making the world a better place. It teaches us to never give up, for failure is but a step on the road to success. The sphere also seems to entail some self sacrifice, enough to lead the god of the sphere to sacrifice the sphere's power twice. It is more than physical life, so this may represent something like the biblical quote "Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it." If so, Sucellus's move to the sphere of life began when he chose to stand against Mulcarn, not when he returned. I see Life as being close to Fire and Spirit, and to the original sphere of Hope.

    Death is about giving up on the world after growing weary of the stresses of life, and withdrawing to one's own dream world to rest, wait, and stay out of the way as the world goes on without you. It teaches us that is is easier to accept failure and just not try anymore. Death is close to Water, Ice, all of which are important parts of sleep and are fairly apathetic. It is also rather close to the corrupted sphere of Despair, but not malevolent.
     
  10. Verdian

    Verdian King

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    Excellent, thank you all. :) Basium makes a lot more sense now, too. He exemplifies all of the qualities MC mentioned, just taken to a dangerous extreme.

    Since no one said otherwise, there were in fact seven tombs, yes? I heard that story so long ago I wasn't sure if I made part of it up. :lol:
     
  11. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    I believe the pieces of Sucellus were buried in seven different locations, but when we say Tomb of Sucellus we mean the single site where the seven pieces were brought back together right before his resurrection.


    Edit: When smana's thread necromancy led me to reread the thread, I noticed a mistake in the OP which has not been addressed. It was not Sirona who gathered up the 7 pieces and reassembled Sucellus in order for him to be resurrected, but rather Nantosuelta. She was Sucellus's lover; although there is no evidence of sexual relationships among the gods (the closest it comes to that is Aeron's attempt to rape Gabella), there was an extremely deep emotional connection between this pair. Nantosuelta had gathered 6 of the 7 pieces before the death of Mularn, but since the god's heart was buried within Mulcarn's palace (which later became Letum Frigus) she could not complete the task until Kylorin slayed the God of Winter and retrieved it.
     
  12. smana

    smana Chieftain

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    life is just complete life nature involves death and life, the whole cycle.
     

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