Rampant racism in Germany, Mexico, and Quebec!!!

[JollyRoger]

Because we're all, all 50 States, sovereign republics in our own right and don't need some bureaucratic hellhole 1500 miles away to tell us how to run our elections.

How far away are Mexico, Quebec, and Germany?

 

[Zelig]

We used to be able to do that.

And it's not that I would have a problem showing some ID. But those ID laws must take any ID, and IDs have to be free and easy to get. And that is not true in much of the US.

Well it's really the photo ID that's a problem.

Birth certificates are free, and should be all you need in order to vote.

 

[bhsup]

Wait, what?

I can't really argue with you because I don't know what clause you're even referring to which gives the Feds jurisdiction here.

Answer that, and I'll respond.

First, sorry about the vitriol in my post. That said, man it felt good to get it out of my system. I'll leave it where it is, though, cuz it's surely worth a warning. Stupid northerners...

Anyway, to answer your question, equal protection (14th amendment)

So the basis for your OP was that Germany, Mexico, and Canada all require photo IDs so there can't possibly be anything wrong with doing the same in the US. This is despite having a voting system which works perfectly well without that requirement, and it would disenfranchise tens of millions of current voters at least temporarily.

But now they are actually "bureaucratic hellholes" because these decisions weren't made at the state level instead?

When is our next Presidential election, Forma? November, 2016. You telling me that it would be an undue burden to make someone get a picture ID within 3 years and 4 months??

"You'll need a picture ID for the next Presidential election" "WHAT?! Man, that's, like... come on man, that's just... omg, I cannot believe you expect me to take precious time out of my life to do that."

Well it's really the photo ID that's a problem.

Birth certificates are free, and should be all you need in order to vote.

What? It would cost me a minimum of $15 to get a replacement birth certificate if I lost my original (which is pretty damned faded and tattered now...)

http://www.kdheks.gov/vital/birth_howto.html

 

[Formaldehyde]

When is our next Presidential election, Forma? November, 2016. You telling me that it would be an undue burden to make someone get a picture ID within 3 years and 4 months??

You seem to be conveniently forgetting that the politicians you vote for tried to do this last presidential election as well as the one next year. That it will likely mean that some people won't even bother because they are too inconvenienced to get one. And for what? Trying to supposedly fix a problem that doesn't really even exist?

This is just an excuse to continue to try to disenfranchise those who don't vote for these very same politicians you praise so much so they can continue to not actually represent the views of their own constituents.

And I see you ignored how your "states rights" rant makes no sense whatsoever in your own thread.

What? It would cost me a minimum of $15 to get a replacement birth certificate if I lost my original (which is pretty damned faded and tattered now...)

It takes far more than a birth certificate to get one of the new federal-approved verified residency licenses. It was a major hassle which took me hours to complete. Lots of people were sent away due to not having the proper documentation.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Credit cards or debit cards would not suffice under most U.S. voter id laws or proposals. A driver's license would only be good if the address matched up to an address within the precinct.

Government issued Tax receipt should be made a valid form of voter ID. Those who paid zero taxes dont get no representation.

 

[bhsup]

If you are too inconvenienced to get a picture ID in three years, then I don't care if you feel disenfranchised. My God, how infantilely simple do we have to make the voting process?

And btw, you are conveniently ignoring that I have stated quite clearly if they are going to be required (which I think they should), they should be free and easy to obtain. But some people will never be satisfied because they will scream obstruction and disenfranchisement and racism and whatever the frak else they can throw around.

 

[FriendlyFire]

If you are too inconvenienced to get a picture ID in three years, then I don't care if you feel disenfranchised. My God, how infantilely simple do we have to make the voting process?

And btw, you are conveniently ignoring that I have stated quite clearly if they are going to be required (which I think they should), they should be free and easy to obtain. But some people will never be satisfied because they will scream obstruction and disenfranchisement and racism and whatever the frak else they can throw around.

Thats true, but between states changing voting laws regulations just weeks out from an election, massive gerrymandering, slashing voting time in certain "districts" while increasing voting time in other districts. Ruling that corporations are people and unlimited money can be spent on "free speech".

Probably why you have this kind of resistance, voter ID is sensible.

 

[FriendlyFire]

In Germany Even most hobos have IDs

Can I ask is it true in Germany that everyone, pays for public transport and never thinks of cheating the socialist government out of money because they are ashamed to be caught cheating the system.

The train exits are often unmonitored, unmanned and no ticket checks but everyone buys a ticket regardless.

 

[Lone Wolf]

All people whom I know who were to Germany state that Germany is in a state on unrelenting horror of dirt and impoliteness, so I dunno.

 

[Formaldehyde]

My God, how infantilely simple do we have to make the voting process?

The current system is actually "infinitely simple". It has been successfully implemented in countless countries to assure fair election voting and which is completely impervious to major voter fraud.

Why do you continue to try to rationalize and defend such an obvious attempt to disenfranchise voters, especially when it is clear there is no widespread voter fraud except by those who continue to try to disenfranchise others for quite obvious political reasons?

 

[Yeekim]

In Germany you have to register a seat of residence (or your parents have to do so, if you are a minor). Not doing that is a misdemeanor. Not doing so for a year is a felony.
Once you have registered a seat of residence you are forced to keep (and pay for) a national ID. Not having one is a misdemeanor and probably becomes a felony at some point too. Take note of the "keep" - you don't own the ID, the Federal Republic does.

As a result of this the problems with getting an ID in the US do not occur: People here do not have (or not have) birth certificates for starters. Their identity is never "lost". The only way for there not being records of them would be for their parents not to inform authorities when they were born, which - i am pretty sure - does qualify said parents for not one but several fellonies.

I can almost hear horrified silence from across the Atlantic.

 

[mitsho]

Can I ask is it true in Germany that everyone, pays for public transport and never thinks of cheating the socialist government out of money because they are ashamed to be caught cheating the system.

The train exits are often unmonitored, unmanned and no ticket checks but everyone buys a ticket regardless.

Sure, but there are controls. These are just not regular or anything. In the local public transports/busses/trams, those are often just painfully obvious (fat old men who very obviously wear something "icognito") and you can get out when you see one... On the distance trains though, that's not an option and they are more numerous there.

In any case, the very large majority of people pay*. But it happened to me that I bought the wrong ticket, lost it, threw away the new one and kept the old (yes, I'm that dizzy), so I've paid my fair share of fines... [*Most people who are not paying can either not afford it (like asylum seekers), but take the risk, or like the rist (teenage boys...]

And thanks to Metatron for spelling out better what I was alluding to before. Can our Americans think of such a system of "registration with the city/state at all time" which seems much more sensible to me than the American trial-and-error thing...

 

[Farm Boy]

Uhh, back to this outdated constitution again...

Of course of course. The basis for our rule of law and a living document that can be changed. How cumbersome of us to discuss it when arguing about our internal elections processes.

I can almost hear horrified silence from across the Atlantic.

Nah, we're just trying to figure out how to work in "PAPERS PLEASE" without Godwinning the conversation. Or it's early and we're still sleeping.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

In a documentary I recently watched it was said that before Prussia graped half of the German territory and the eventual unification of German states, Germans were actually known to be buoyant easy-going people. But because Germany had such a high population-density for its time, (Prussian) centralization of power went hand in hand with a political culture of rather strict order.

 

[Borachio]

I
The only way for there not being records of them would be for their parents not to inform authorities when they were born, which - i am pretty sure - does qualify said parents for not one but several fellonies.

I know it's an offence in the UK not register a birth (or a death). What kind of offence I'm really not sure.

But it's such a basic requirement for a developed country, I would find it hard to believe it's not an offence not to register a birth in the US as well.

In (relatively) undeveloped countries, it's a major problem for some individuals to find that the state has no record of their existence at all.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Pretty sure it's an offense here as well Borachio.

 

[Borachio]

So, the government's got your papers from the very beginning. Done job.

Spoiler :

Then there's that lump beneath the skin behind your left ear. Have you felt for it yet? It's that chip they implanted when you were born. (It's very very small. So that's why you've not noticed it before.)

 

[Terxpahseyton]

I actually think the lump is bigger as behind my right ear.

 

[Borachio]

I suspect that's some chewing gum left there by somebody sitting behind you on the bus.

 

[Farm Boy]

Ew. Thank goodness we don't mess with that busing thing here.