RAND 2.0 beta Gameplay and feedback

Discussion in 'Rise of Mankind: A New Dawn' started by JosEPh_II, Jan 21, 2012.

  1. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    I'm starting this thread for the purpose of giving reports on how the Mod is playing for you and what's up in your game.

    In my 1st game of RAND 2.0 beta I'm up to turn 435 on Epic speed, that's 105AD. I've not experienced any CTD after 8+ hours of play today. So stability is good so far.

    My game is on a Huge Archipelago world, 8 AI, low sea level, tropical climate and Noble level.

    Apparently my starting position isn't that great. I have the Khmer on the same archi as I am. To the east I met Stalin and Shaka (oi vey!). To my south is Mao. Somewhere out there in the unexplored area is Dido, Wilhelmina, Pericles and Pacal. Shaka and Stalin both have Dow'd me twice with the last time dragging in the Khmer and Pacal. It's been a dogfight. Down to just Stalin an the moment.

    I find that there's not enough hammers to really get rolling production wise. For my liking the Forge is weak. Paved roads don't give another hammer for mines either only Road does. Jungle camps are not what they used to be when Vincentz introduced them to RoM. It's still relatively early in the game even though the Era is medieval.

    I've been able to keep research at 60 to 70% and have 10 to 70 gold a turn. It fluctuates. With the Wars my treasury is trashed. I barely have a 200 in reserve.

    I'm researching techs at a rate of about 1 for every 4 to 10 turns. Not bad but I'm not the leader either by a long shot. Wilhelmina and Shaka lead there. And that's bad news when it comes to Shaka having advanced Tech. :cringe:

    I have 12 cities, Willma has 25, Shaka has 19. Only Pericles and Dido have the same or less than I do. So I rank 7th out of 9 Empires. I desperately need to expand and get some breathing room. I just got caravels so I can start seriously exploring. Hope there's some empty islands still left.

    One of the Civics states,"Consumes all Gold and Silver". Not sure I want to use that Civic cause what does Consume mean? Will my Gold mine and Silver mine cease to function under that Civic? Or is it that all the Revenue is siphoned off and the local cities don't get it? Not sure.

    Well it's a start.

    So how is your game going?

    JosEPh :)
     
  2. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    It means that it will be like you have no gold or silver in any cities. Mines will still get the bonus for having a resource under them, but it will be as if you completely lack the resource.

    This is because it is all being used to be turned into currency. ;)
     
  3. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    Does it stop Jewelry from being available?

    JosEPh
     
  4. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    Yes... I am pretty sure it does.
     
  5. zulu9812

    zulu9812 The Newbie Nightmare

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    Does the gold or silver come back when you switch to a different Economy? Also, what's the point of Coinage giving a bonus for having access to Gold or Silver, if you have no access to Gold or Silver?
     
  6. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    Yes, access returns once you switch out. And you still earn the civic bonus for those two resources.
     
  7. CivFanCCS

    CivFanCCS Warlord

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    Just passed the AD line and I'm really enjoying the game. To me the first 1900 years always played really well in AND, it was the last era's that it seemed the AI faltered. I know Afforess was making strides in gettting the AI to industrialize and in the beta change log he said he dealt with the military issues.

    The only real problem I still see has to do with diplomacy. Try and get a civ to make peace with you and another civ... it's impossible. You could have them down to nothing, their last 2 cities, and they'll give you one for peace, but if you include peace with Civ, xyz they refuse everytime. Also in diplomacy civ x asks you to go to war half way around the world about 500 BC (snail speed, world map) . On my earth map France and England know china in the first 100 turns because of the ability to trade contacts. I think this needs be adjusted... maybe something like Rhye did with limiting how many turns you know a civ after intial contact. I think after 10 turns you would "forget" the civ if you aren't right there with them until like 1000 AD when some tech came along. Civ AI to do with declaring war and asking for help in a war needs some help.

    War... example:
    vikings have a 1 city revolt, 100 turns in.. asks china for help (realistic world map).. china agrees..

    This just shouldn't happen.. because china really sends troops, and has both Japan and Mongols + barbs to deal with.

    So maybe when saying yes AI should consider map size and how many tiles to enemy + friendship with asking civ.. IDK just a thought.
     
  8. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    Some more observations, lamentations, and things learned:

    Sustained war before AD is hard to do.
    1. Because hammers are in short supply so therefore units may take up to 10+ turns to build (for the better ones).
    2. But even the cheap low level archer can take 4 turns to produce in a size 6-10 pop city.
    3. The AI will produce as many archer/chariot units as it can with 1 or 2 Longbow/mace as lead units. So while you are trying to have 3 or 4 Mace and 3 to 4 Longbow to attack or defend with the AI will bring in 3X the number of above mentioned low level units to wear you down. Generally with one such stack at a time. It will expend the 1st stack to get your defenses down and give damage to your defenders and then try to overwhelm you with the 2nd stack. For the AI this isn't a bad strategy except once it overruns your city you do have a 3-4 turn window to counter attack before he brings another low level SoD in. But if you've used up your reserves, trouble.

    Jungle Camps, my beloved JC's are so weak. If you build one on a hill you lose the hammer that the hill had. I think this is wrong. It's making the AI chop all the jungle down. Couple this with Paved roads not giving Mine, LumberMills or JCs an additional hammer, and it just keeps the hammer count low, the JC is not as good as a cottage in the long run.

    Paved Roads:The Only benefit is going from 1/2 MP to 1/3MP but the Gold cost to build is too high for me. So I stick to plain roads. And especially so without the additional hammer yield. If it gave an extra Gold I might be persuaded to build it.

    I did get a Sugar resource from one of my JC's, but just that 1 resource out of 20+ JCs in a 14 city empire.

    JCs on rivers should also get an additional Gold. Easier to transport those Jungle goodies so commerce needs to be enhanced.

    Starting location and amount of resource near your starting point is crucial to be able to flourish. Wilhelmina is a prime example in this game. She has double the # of Cities I do (28) and that's because she had some very strategic resources by/in/near her early main cities. Same with Shaka. Even Stalin (21 cities) flourished with Shaka (23 cities) as his next door neighbor. Mao got a whole archipelago to himself and he has 23 cities too. And they all had very good allocations of resources. Of course this is luck of the draw on the resources and is Very dependent upon type of map too.

    These are some of the things I'm learning about this version of RAND. It is leaner in terms of what you can build. It is leaner in the number of units you can support. And it is leaner in both production and gold totals. So you have new set of rules for balancing your needs as a growing Empire.

    I just hope I can get some more cities started now that I finally have fluyts and galleons. If all the land is gone but for those few scattered small islands and the arctic/antarctic waste lands I'm in big trouble for the Ren and Industrial Eras.

    JosEPh :)
     
  9. gunburned

    gunburned Warlord

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    Havent had any problems yet besides...
    Are religions disabled in this beta build? Or have I missed the button to enable?

    Seems when I go to quick play religions are enabled, but when I create a custom game religions always seem to be disabled.
    Any idea would be thankful.
     
  10. gunburned

    gunburned Warlord

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    Errrr.... Seems the problem has gone away. Im suspecting one of the custom options may be responsible for switching religions on and off.

    I hope this information will be useful to someone experiencing a similar problem.
     
  11. zulu9812

    zulu9812 The Newbie Nightmare

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    This brings up an interesting point: automated workers will build the best roads available (i.e. they'll always prefer to building paved roads as opposed to plain roads). There's no way to set the worker AI to not build certain routes. Perhaps something to add to the BUG Automations tab?
     
  12. gunburned

    gunburned Warlord

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    I noticed in the civopedia each of the leaders have a personality description. However, I cannot quite understand what all the numbers mean exactly, can anyone elaborate to help me explain. I like the Idea, but maybe it should be explained better perhaps?
     
  13. antoca

    antoca Chieftain

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    I suppose this is what we pay for the game without permanent stacks. I mean AI never declares a war with a ready stack. Only with a small group of units - this is not a 100 or 200 units stack from vanilla RoM. He builds units for rampaging stack only after declaring a war.

    What is better? I don't know...

    If we will have no stacks and such AI behavior, the game will be not interesting. However I am not sure about low level units you mentioned. I didn't see it yet.
     
  14. stingo

    stingo Chieftain

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    Yes I also found that religions did not work and I also had a custom game.
     
  15. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    My religions work just fine, iirc I've founded Hindu, Judaism and Buddhism so far. After that I got into those wars and started falling behind in tech. Needed the money to upgrade and fight instead of high research %.

    It has to be an Option or choice of Options that you either have or have not Enabled.

    In the BUG options screens I have Multiple Religions checked. But at Start Up screen for setting maps etc I Do Not check Limited Religions or Choose Religions.

    JosEPh
     
  16. Zootroy

    Zootroy Chieftain

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    Hi,

    I'm having the exact problem as gunburned and stingo. Religions disabled when starting Custom game, but working normally in Play Now. I've tried all permutations of checking/unchecking Limited/Choose religions to no effect.

    Is this a bug through the custom form? I wasn't aware Religion could be turned off through *any* setting in AND
     
  17. stingo

    stingo Chieftain

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    It is possible to make it run with religions as a cutsom game. The reason it works as play now is because it resets most settings to default. I could start custom game with religions eventually but I could not find the settings that caused the problem. I suspect if you uncheck inquisitions this happens, but I did not test that.
     
  18. gunburned

    gunburned Warlord

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    I believe lots of people are experiencing this problem.
    My problem seemed to go away after starting a quick game. Give it a shot.
     
  19. gunburned

    gunburned Warlord

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    The Computer Centre Nation wonder gives +5 to mech units, but this category has been removed.
    I suppose it should be switched Robot units, they would be the closest match.

    Nvm I must be going blind, sorry about that.
     
  20. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    Play Now clears the cache of any old settings used by previous versions or mods. The same can be done by holding down the Shift key while the Mod loads.

    And if you have played 1.75c or 1.76beta or even C2C recently the cache could be holding old data that is no longer correct. Thus the strange inability to run religions.

    It also brings up the question what do you mean by,"Religions disabled when starting Custom game"? You can not found any religions? The religions are not in the game at all?

    Please be more detailed. What did you select during game setup? What did you select or deselect once in the game thru the BUG Options screen under it's multiple tabs?

    I can tell you this, for sometime selecting Choose religions and Limited Religions at game start up has cause some strange behaviours. But by leaving them Unchecked at game start up and then once the game has started checking the Multiple Religions works just like vanilla BtS. And plays quite well. Let the Races begin with this selection.

    Are you perhaps using the Divine Prophets checkbox? (Ill have to check to see if RAND2.0 beta has this option still available). With Divine Prophets once you research the tech that enables the religion you get a prophet that you can use to "Found" that religion, either in the city the prophet originates or sending him to another city to found the religion there. You can also use the Prophet to Not found the religion but like all other Prophets acquire a new tech.

    JosEPh
     

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