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RB-31: Playing God

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Clovis, May 3, 2007.

  1. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Then it's decided then, I'll be spreading christianity and hopefully I'll have an army worthy of wiping peter by the time my turnset is ended, so that berrie and mrwhite will have some fun toys to play with :hammer:...
     
  2. Berrie

    Berrie Proud father

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    Great! :hammer: :D

    I just remembered that diplomacy is our priority victory condition. After the spreading of Christianity, we should take a close look at our possible friends and enemies. If we go for a true diplomatic victory we should start to pay attention to who we trade with and such, to keep our friends happy.
     
  3. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Wow, some interesting stuff happened... I could put a teaser up and finish tomorrow, but I've got time now:

    IT: do a little check, and most things look good, here's a few things that caught my attention:
    Hebron is building a library? I don't get the rationale there, it's going to spend 25 turns for 2 culture/turn (it's only producing 3 beakers at 100% science)? By the time it's finished we should have captured Novgorod anyway, and the borders will pop in 3 turns anyways, so I veto in favor of a barracks (I hope this isn't a problem, there were only 6 hammers invested so not much was lost). I also notice a russian axemen who's stranded by culture, which could be a problem once we declare war, here's a pic of that:



    Around my 5th or 6th turn I found a spare axe upgraded him to combat 1 to have the advantage, and sent him over there, I'll come back to that shortly.

    turn1: tyre: sword ->sword, jericho axe --> sword. christian missionary FAILS to spread christianity to jericho, that's a major bummer...
    turn2: construction --> alpha
    turn3: jerusalem finshes library, fire priest (no more need for great prophets), hire 2 scientists (great sci would be nice), start catapult
    turn6: tyre: sword--> axe. jericho: sword--> elephant. move the axe I mentioned to shadow peter's axe in the west that you saw in the picture

    I popped another great prophet this turn (gotta love philosophical civs), I'll discuss him at the bottom of this post...

    turn7: holy crap, check this out:



    yeah, well the good news is, we don't get diplo penalties for declaring on a friend, the bad news is, we're not entirely ready, but from looking at the power graph, peter isn't either (I don't know what possessed him besides maybe his stranded axe) also, Jerusalem cat--> jumbo

    turn8: alphabet comes in, we have a sizable tech lead, only tech that anyone has that we don't have is sailing:



    literature due in 4 whip barracks in hebron to start an axe. I see st petersburg is relatively weak, I begin marching on st pete (peter has NO stack anywhere... so why not I guess.
    IBT: trade polytheism to hatty for sailing. it wasn't really worth the time (2 turns to research it ourselves), but I was hoping for a relations boost, so that was my reasoning, I would've waited and discussed it but she offered it, so I figured we could use all the positive relations we could get.

    turn9: tyre: axe-sword, i attack peter's axe with my axe that i sent over there and lose at 70% odds (bummer), but clean up with the new axe:


    BTW, his axe pillaged the quarry, there's a villager there to fix it for the next person.
    turn10: Capture st petersburg, losing two swords in the process (both at over 65% odds... bummer, losses at 73, 68, and 68 in this round), but do take it. When the border pops, we'll get 3 furs, one for us to help further in happiness (but we're not really struggling yet), and a couple for us to trade away for relations boost.

    Ok, I planned on more emphasis on missionaries, but I didn't like what Peter was doing, so I was thinking he might declare on us, and he did, so unfortunately the missionaries will have to wait longer.

    We need to discuss what to do with the great prophet. We could research just about all of Divine Right to land Islam (for denial purposes), we could add him as a super specialist (and beyond that, where to add him, jerusalem or hebron). I honestly don't know, I think it's a toss-up really. Even though I'm running two scientists, we're still getting more great prophet points than anything because of our wonders (we probably need to run caste system in the near future, I probably should've done that), so we'll probably get plenty more prophets, so no use saving him for a Golden Age this early.

    Lots of stuff going on, your thoughts?
     
  4. Clovis

    Clovis Charlemagne's Grandfather

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    I think the prophet should go as a specialist in Hebron. It could use the extra boost, and the long-term effects are greater than lightbulbing him. I think by the time Islam is discovered, everyone will have a well-entrenched religion anyway, so whoever discovers it won't convert to it.

    Besides that, I think we should definitely eliminate Peter before we worry about missionaries too much. Maybe three or four up towards Hatty.

    P.S. Do you play Age of Empires? I noticed you call workers "villagers."

    Overall, good turnset! :goodjob:
     
  5. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    That was what I was leaning towards, this will in all likelihood be our wall street city if we get christianity spread as far as we hope, purely because of the shrine income, and adding more money with a prophet super-specialist will only enhance that.

    That was how I felt, that it was higher on the list of importance.

    Hah, yeah I do, quite a bit in fact (only in MP though, I easily get bored with SP since the AI isn't very good). I often call the villagers in AoE workers too, so it goes both ways. I take it you play it or have played it before?
     
  6. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Hah, almost forgot the save
     

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  7. mrwhite89

    mrwhite89 Bad Lieutenant

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    Nice turns, Scooter!! :goodjob:

    I agree about moving the Great Prophet to Hebron as a specialist. :please:

    Since Jerusalem is obviously going to produce most of our Great People and it is spitting out one Great Prophet after another, we could change that by building Sistine Chapel & then the Great Epic, which should skew the probability away from prophets and more towards artists.

    Additionally, we should think about cottaging most of Jericho and building the Great Library there. That city could become our main science city. :D .

    Looking a little further down the road, Hebron might be a good spot for the Spiral Minaret. If we get enough culture going in Hebron, we could eventually snatch Elephantine from Hatty without having to go to war with her.
     
  8. dawn

    dawn Redophile

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    Nice turnset!

    I mentioned that axe in my notes as it surprised my that Peter would strand him near the coast. Way to follow your intuition on building up the military. Remember that he has a settlement over on the island to the South. Would be nice to push him off the continent and make him a non-factor (as if he is now :p ). I wonder if the only reason he declared was due to that stranded axe?

    As for the GP, I like the idea of settlinging in Hebron also. With Sistine we get another +2:culture: for him.

    Tech track - still going for Music, right?
     
  9. Berrie

    Berrie Proud father

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    I see it, but tonight is a no-go. Will try to play tomorrow...
    So you have still some time to discuss some things further.

    Scooter, do have some info on the foreign relations?
     
  10. FeedBack

    FeedBack Time for some FeedBack!

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    lurker's comment:
    Hello, guys. I just read your thread. Actually, I saw you planning this on RB and just remembered to check here now... :mischief:

    Just a random thought: I saw you got Oracle for Metal Casting, but I didn't see you guys building any forge, workshops are useless at this stage of the game and you didn't get Machinery early too. You could have get something better for you at that time, like Code of Laws, Iron Working or even Alphabet, as you are now beelining to Music.

    But, as you say, this is Noble. Shouldn't be much of an issue.

    Back to lurking. Nice SG variant! :goodjob:
     
  11. mrwhite89

    mrwhite89 Bad Lieutenant

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    You've got a point there - in hindsight Alphabet would have been the best choice, considering our decision to beeline towards Music :blush:

    But we did definitely get additional benefits from the Wonder -- namely GP points and the satisfaction of getting a free tech :) .....and denying our neighbors a free-bee :D
     
  12. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    I agree with you, but as we're all new to SG's there wasn't really any conversation about which tech to pick, so whoever was up wasn't sure which one to pick...

    I forgot to include this screenshot, just in case you didn't notice it in my report, take a look:

     
  13. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Heh, must've missed that, that's what I get for reading it late at night...

    Yeah that was what I had in mind. He has 3 cities now on the mainland, moscow, novgorod (the one by hebron) and one off in the east that we can only see a tiny bit of the cultural borders. Novgorod will be somewhat tricky to take, since it's archers fortified on a hill, but thankfully they're not city garrison. Do NOT attack them without having enough to take the city on that turn, that's all we need is a couple city garrison archers on a hill... I'm not usually a big fan of suicide cats but Novgorod would be a good use for them.

    As for Music, Literature is due in 1-2 turns, and Music comes right after that, so yes, meaning we need to decide what to do with the Great Artist. Right now it seems like we need to use him for a culture bomb, I'm just not sure where. what we could do is capture either Moscow or novgorod, and culture bomb it immediately, ending resistance, and giving us complete control of the battlefield (moscow would be the ideal place I think since it's central to the other two cities), and giving us more land where our units would heal faster. What does everyone think of this?
     
  14. Berrie

    Berrie Proud father

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    It was during my turnset that the oracle was completed. But look at the screenshot I posted on page 2:

    Code of Laws and Alphabet weren't available and we were researching Iron Working. I would say that, giving the options, Metal Casting was the best choice. And I tought we would be building some forges in the near future, but the game turned out differently. I don't think it was a case of :smoke: on my part

    EDIT: Oh, I forgot, I was actually considering Metal Casting and Monarchy, but decided Metal Casting as it was the most beakers.
     
  15. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Yup, like I said we should've discussed ahead of time. Honestly I don't think we would've really used monarchy that much either (besides hooking up the wines) so there wasn't really even a good option, which was everyone's :smoke: for not setting it up properly (probably mostly mine since I was the turn before you), so it wasn't your fault anyway.
     
  16. dawn

    dawn Redophile

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  17. KMadCandy

    KMadCandy giggling permanoob

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    for what it's worth i don't think it was at all either :). MC is a great choice. forges even give you the option to run an engineer and get an early GE, some people pick it for that reason alone. doesn't apply here since your GPs are getting so expensive.

    in my own games, if i think it's safe enough, i build the oracle to within a turn of completion and then work on prereqs for a better tech choice and then pray i don't get beaten to it. i would never do that in an SG without agreement beforehand. you guys also had no way of judging where the others were tech and priority wise, and seem to be not really comfortable guessing where the AI will stand techwise (i expect that'll change now that you have alpha :) ) and knew you have industrious competition out there. you did what i'd have done so of course i consider it not :smoke:.

    you may want to consider researching liberalism to until you get it one turn from finished, and then try to get a prereq out of the way to pick something more expensive if you deem it safe, when those days come around. make sure you have an unresearched second-choice to take if you do panic and change your mind to finish/win lib early, so that your efforts aren't wasted ;). that's far in the future but i'll still be around, i'm having fun watching this! so i'll remind you if you don't think of it.

    @berrie: i know fb, i'm certain he mentioned that to help you all, and didn't mean it as "the one that picked MC did something :smoke:". i don't know you, if you took it as directed at you, even in the teensiest bit, don't do that. i'm in an SG with fb right now where we are learning a lot, and some of us aren't playing so well, and we just might, ummm, lose our game :eek:. we're playing ours to improve our play by seeing how others play, and sharing some definitely :smoke: moves with each other so that we learn to fix 'em! yours wasn't even a case of that, but in that spirit, i know 100% that he means to help, not point fingers. i always do too, and i hope that my posts will be read that way by all of you. if i'm really curious (or suspicious :lol:) about one person's reasoning i'll go ahead and ask ya.
     
  18. scooter

    scooter Prince

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    Yeah, while I don't actually know him, just about everyone (that I've come across) from RB never mean to hurt or accuse when they make a comment like that, but rather to help or make a suggestion. Hopefully that's not how you felt.

    As for the GA that I mentioned, does using him for a culture bomb in a capture russian city (such as moscow preferably or possibly novgorod) sound appealing or is there a better option I'm missing?
     
  19. FeedBack

    FeedBack Time for some FeedBack!

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    lurker's comment:
    Well, as my name keeps getting mentioned, I shall post again. :mischief:
    KMad is right. I didn't want to point a finger on anyone's face. I just saw you guys are new to SGs and, as you are playing on Noble, kinda new on civ too. I'm not that good player at all. I just wanted to point something you may have not noticed. :deal:

    KMad is right again :queen: when she says about getting the Oracle until 1 turn left and finish the pre-requisites. If you guys had gotten Writing before IW, you'd be able to get one of that techs I pointed. It was just a matter of timing.

    About the liberalism race, one thing that always works is lightbulb Philosophy with a GS and keep the Monopoly on it. Then, research Paper and lightbulb partially education with another GS. When Education finishes, keep watching the foreign screen for almost every turn. When the Paper monopoly is broken, start liberalism and get the free tech you can. Democracy or Steel are easily doable on Noble.

    I'll sit back here and enjoy the ride. I love reading others' SGs to kill some time at work. :coffee:
     
  20. Berrie

    Berrie Proud father

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    Oh, I'm no that 'touchy'. Absolutely no damage done. :)

    I just felt I had to explain my reasoning behind picking Metal Casting

    I will start to play now. Wish me luck! :hammer:
     

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