RB3 - Clobbering Time, Monarch Warmonger Game
- Thread starter Carbon_Copy
- Start date
1225 AD (0) - Shuffle some units around. When we get Hanging Gardens, the extra population in a couple places is going to be unhappy, but with Hereditary Rule's +1 happy for military units, that is easy enough to combat.
1300 AD (3) - Currency in! And with 4g left in the treasury, drop research to 30%, and Calendar is due in seven turns.
1325 AD (4) -
1400 AD (7) - The annoying barb galley is defeated, and our fishing boats can once again sail the seas safely.
1425 AD (8) - Whip a fishing boat in Calix.
1450 AD (9) - Calender finishes. No clear choice on my mind where to go next, and end up opting for Compass for Optics next, so we can get some ships out there searching for friends (and trades).
1500 AD (11) - Or maybe they will find us instead.
Log was a little lacking, yes, but for the most part the only activity was described above. Just building happy and healthy so that our cities can be a bit more productive. I guess with our game, we'll need to get agressiveish again soon, though we may want to just raze for the most part.
1300 AD (3) - Currency in! And with 4g left in the treasury, drop research to 30%, and Calendar is due in seven turns.
1325 AD (4) -
1400 AD (7) - The annoying barb galley is defeated, and our fishing boats can once again sail the seas safely.
1425 AD (8) - Whip a fishing boat in Calix.
1450 AD (9) - Calender finishes. No clear choice on my mind where to go next, and end up opting for Compass for Optics next, so we can get some ships out there searching for friends (and trades).
1500 AD (11) - Or maybe they will find us instead.
Log was a little lacking, yes, but for the most part the only activity was described above. Just building happy and healthy so that our cities can be a bit more productive. I guess with our game, we'll need to get agressiveish again soon, though we may want to just raze for the most part.
Kylearan
compound eye
Got it, although I will probably need the full 48 hours to play. (Feast mode here as well, even if we don't celebrate thanksgiving over here! 
)
-Kylearan
)-Kylearan
Kylearan
compound eye
Oy, are we behind in techs! 
Genghis is at least Monotheism, Literature, Feudalism, Compass and Machinery ahead of us, and Incans also have Code of Laws!
Our economy sucks, too. Financial advisor says it's mainly city maintenance, plus unit costs. I veto the research on Optics and start CoL instead, to get some courthouses going. I also reconfigure most of our cities (stop growth where we reached happiness limit, emphasize food in cities where we haven't reached the limit yet etc.). Teno gets two scientists.
I also think we need more cottages!
1530: CoL -> Optics. Start courthouses in most cities. Trade CoL to Genghis for Monotheism, Literature and 30g (he wouldn't give up any other useful techs).
1550: Optics -> Machinery (for Engineering, for faster movement and pikes)
1560: I start us on Chichen Itza - 8 turns only, maybe we get it. If not, we will have some money to spend on deficit research.
1570: Unpronouncable gives birth to a great engineer! I move him to Teno and fortify him (I think he's wasted on Chichen Itza). Teno starts Heroic Epic.
1590: Tokugawa finds us! Sistine's get built somewhere.
Some cities will reach their happiness limit during the next turns, so watch out. We might also consider declaring war on Alex again, because we have a ton of units that cost us money, and after this round of infrastructure, more and more cities can build military again now.
Roster:
Carbon Copy
bed_head7
Kylearan -> just played
Daveshack -> UP NOW
Dwip -> on deck
Tidus444
-Kylearan
Genghis is at least Monotheism, Literature, Feudalism, Compass and Machinery ahead of us, and Incans also have Code of Laws!Our economy sucks, too. Financial advisor says it's mainly city maintenance, plus unit costs. I veto the research on Optics and start CoL instead, to get some courthouses going. I also reconfigure most of our cities (stop growth where we reached happiness limit, emphasize food in cities where we haven't reached the limit yet etc.). Teno gets two scientists.
I also think we need more cottages!
1530: CoL -> Optics. Start courthouses in most cities. Trade CoL to Genghis for Monotheism, Literature and 30g (he wouldn't give up any other useful techs).
1550: Optics -> Machinery (for Engineering, for faster movement and pikes)
1560: I start us on Chichen Itza - 8 turns only, maybe we get it. If not, we will have some money to spend on deficit research.
1570: Unpronouncable gives birth to a great engineer! I move him to Teno and fortify him (I think he's wasted on Chichen Itza). Teno starts Heroic Epic.
1590: Tokugawa finds us! Sistine's get built somewhere.
Some cities will reach their happiness limit during the next turns, so watch out. We might also consider declaring war on Alex again, because we have a ton of units that cost us money, and after this round of infrastructure, more and more cities can build military again now.
Roster:
Carbon Copy
bed_head7
Kylearan -> just played
Daveshack -> UP NOW
Dwip -> on deck
Tidus444
-Kylearan
Got it, too late to do anything tonight (this morning that is) but barring anything earth-shaking at work should be able to play in around 21 hours or so.
Any comments in favor of or against pop-rushing? I have not looked yet so have no idea whether any of the things we need to build are worth it.
I don't think that a GE can be used on a wonder. The only things they can hurry are ordinary buildings. The other main options are keep around until we get another Great Person of different type for a GA, or super-engineer. Don't recall if engineers can help with techs.
Anyone know how to tell our military strength vs Alex?
That's one thing the Civ3 military advisor did that helped...
Any comments in favor of or against pop-rushing? I have not looked yet so have no idea whether any of the things we need to build are worth it.
I don't think that a GE can be used on a wonder. The only things they can hurry are ordinary buildings. The other main options are keep around until we get another Great Person of different type for a GA, or super-engineer. Don't recall if engineers can help with techs.
Anyone know how to tell our military strength vs Alex?
That's one thing the Civ3 military advisor did that helped...
Kylearan
compound eye
Hi,
-Kylearan
Yes they can be used to rush wonders (or, in case of expensive wonders, contribute a healthy amount of hammers). Because of that, I find starting a GA with great engineers to be somewhat of a waste.DaveShack said:
-Kylearan
Hmm... GE's can be used on wonders now, pretty sure the last time I got one in a personal game they couldn't handle wonders. I wonder if that was fixed in the patch...
Anyway, so if they can build wonders then that makes the upcoming turns even more fun. Just gotta decide what wonder to grab.
And gotta dedicate some cities to building GE's in my personal games. 
Anyway, so if they can build wonders then that makes the upcoming turns even more fun. Just gotta decide what wonder to grab.
And gotta dedicate some cities to building GE's in my personal games. 
I have not figured out the restrictions, but it seems some wonders it cannot rush. I have had a few times where the rush icon was dimmed.
I wish I had taken note of the wonder and conditions, but they sure can rush most. I just rush the GL with one.
I wish I had taken note of the wonder and conditions, but they sure can rush most. I just rush the GL with one.
Kylearan
compound eye
Hi,
-Kylearan
I had rushed both some ancient wonders (great library, for example) and some late-game wonders (Hollywood, ...) with GEs.vmxa said:
Are you sure these were wonders you hadn't been able to rush, not projects? For example, IIRC Apollo and the spaceship parts are projects and thus can't be rushed.
-Kylearan
Carbon_Copy
Elemental
Yeah, I think the operative word is "building". I don't think Engineers can complete the Epics for you, nor the Apollo program or Manhattan Project (guessing on most of these, either for lack of trying to rush them with engineers or for lack of building them in the case of the Manhattan Project), but I haven't come across a building they can't rush yet.
8 turn Chichen Itza? That would be a nice wonder for us to grab. Gogo hooked up stone!
With fast speed turned on, those build times for wonders often make it seem like we're Industrious.
When last I checked the game, we had the second-largest empire by land area and I think also by population (presumably behind Alex), so it seems like cash production and maintenance reduction are our two biggest priorities. I'm also not certain that we're able to deal with Alex yet, or at least, I haven't been able to make much headway against larger AIs prior to the Industrial/Modern eras, but that might just be my shoddy warmongering (not to mention my penchant for random declarations of peace
).
Well, we made contact with just about everybody now, the only one we're missing now is Napoleon. Maybe he'll come knocking soon.
8 turn Chichen Itza? That would be a nice wonder for us to grab. Gogo hooked up stone!
With fast speed turned on, those build times for wonders often make it seem like we're Industrious.When last I checked the game, we had the second-largest empire by land area and I think also by population (presumably behind Alex), so it seems like cash production and maintenance reduction are our two biggest priorities. I'm also not certain that we're able to deal with Alex yet, or at least, I haven't been able to make much headway against larger AIs prior to the Industrial/Modern eras, but that might just be my shoddy warmongering (not to mention my penchant for random declarations of peace
).Well, we made contact with just about everybody now, the only one we're missing now is Napoleon. Maybe he'll come knocking soon.
Yeah that is the restriction, forgot that aspect.
Summary:
Chichen Itza produced
Got another Great Engineer (that made 2 in pocket)
Rushed Hagia Sophia with one of them
Finished several courthouses, and one of the epics
Built lots of military, positioned in Delphi and border town to the NE, forget the name...
We're still well behind in techs. I couldn't figure out what to use the workers for in the end (all usable tiles improved?) so fortified most of them. The next player can probably take on Alex, if this isn't enough units then we probably can't produce enough.
I would do screenies but my whole family (myself, wife, 2 kids) has been sick, and I'm falling asleep writing this.
Chichen Itza produced
Got another Great Engineer (that made 2 in pocket)
Rushed Hagia Sophia with one of them
Finished several courthouses, and one of the epics
Built lots of military, positioned in Delphi and border town to the NE, forget the name...
We're still well behind in techs. I couldn't figure out what to use the workers for in the end (all usable tiles improved?) so fortified most of them. The next player can probably take on Alex, if this isn't enough units then we probably can't produce enough.
I would do screenies but my whole family (myself, wife, 2 kids) has been sick, and I'm falling asleep writing this.
Kylearan
compound eye
Hi,
-Kylearan
Not only that, but if we won't get rid of some of our military, we will never be able to catch up with research, as they cost us a ton of money!DaveShack said:
Get well soon!
-Kylearan
Kylearan said:
Do workers count towards unit cost? I haven't been able to find a way to merge them back into cities. Is there enough to be gained by disbanding some of them to make it worthwhile to do that instead of keeping them around until railroads? Or am I overlooking improvements which still need to be made?
Carbon_Copy
Elemental
DaveShack said:
I think workers do count towards unit upkeep, though I think it's on a seperate schedule from the military units, but regardless I can't imagine any reason we'd ever want to disband them, especially if we're going to war. If we manage to take territory, we'll want to use them to improve that land once it's off the front lines or peace is declared. If the war doesn't go so well, we'll need them to mop up after the pillagers and get resources reconnected. Even if the fighting does go well, we'll probably need to fix some pillaging, you rarely ever fight an offensive war entirely inside your opponent's territory like you could in Civ 3.
Plus, even with bigger production capability in the Industrial, we're probably going to be too busy building either units or infrastructure for us to easily replace workers that we disband now.
Dwip
Warlord
- Joined
- May 5, 2003
- Messages
- 272
[0] 1675 AD - It's been a while since I've seen Azteca. Things have changed a bit, looks like.
It appears that consensus is war with Alex, who's muskets frighten me, but we'll see how that works out. Such army as we have seems to be reasonably high tech. I will, however, wait for the next round of pikes and lbows to get done.
We are way behind in tech, to the tune of Drama, Theology, Music, Guilds, Philosophy, and Optics to more or less everyone but Khan, as well as Civil Service to Inca. Alex at least is also up Gunpowder, and maybe techs leading there, such as Paper and Education. Not so fantastic, but we'll see what we can do with it.
IBT - According to Thucydides, the largest civs are Alex, us, Sir Not Appearing On Our Map, Khan, Inca, and Toku.
[1] 1680 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Longbow, Unpronouncable Pike->Pike.
We can apparently build the FP somewhere, which we should definitely do somewhere. Delphi maybe?
Move some troops up. We'll be a little thin on defense come the day, but should be ok.
[2] 1685 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Longbow, Teo Longbow->Phant, Tlatelolco Pike->Longbow, Texcoco Pike->Market.
Move some more guys up.
IBT - Khan offers Silk for our Horses, and I accept. Somebody who's not us gets Angkor Wat.
[3] 1690 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Phant, Teo Phant->Phant, Unpronouncable Pike->Longbow.
Move some more guys up. Getting close.
IBT - Somebody who's not us gets Versailles.
[4] 1695 AD - Move a few more guys up.
[5] 1700 AD - Guilds comes in, and we start on Banking. Tenochtitlan Phant->Knight, Teo Phant->Knight, Texcoco Market->Grocer, Unpronouncable Longbow->Grocer, Calixtlahuaca Harbor->Forge.
Today is the day, Alex. Declare. Move lots of guys up. Delphi has ludicrous amounts of guys in it. ETA at Pharsalos 2 turns. Argos, near Teo, is size 12, walled, and has 3 lbows and a Combat I/Medic I pike for defense.
I really want to go to Vassalage, but we can't afford it at all, and I had to drop to 40% science just now.
IBT - Alex catapults our elephant stack outside Pharsalos. Somebody else gets the Spiral Minaret.
[6] 1705 AD - Tenochtitlan Knight->Grocer, Tlateloco Longbow->Harbor.
Move up guys. Pharsalos is defended by a City Defense II Xbow, a City Defense II Longbow, and a City Defense I Longbow, and is size 9 with walls. That's pretty intense, but unlike some other Aztec leaders, I brought a lot of reasonably teched guys.
[7] 1710 AD - Teo Knight->Grocer, Tlaxcala Market->Grocer.
You know, if Alex's Combat I, Cover, Pinch Musket wants to just hang out and not fight me, I think I can deal. However, his Combat II/Formation Muskets near Delphi are going to be an issue.
Begin bombardment of Argos, dropping it to 28% defense.
IBT - Somebody builds the Islamic shrine, and Alex picks Enrico Dandolo in Athens.
[8] 1715 AD - Wherein a single Bombard I pult takes Pharsalos down an astronomical number of defense to 45%. Bombard Argos to 16%.
IBT - Alex's Supermusket destroys a Longbow we threw out as bait, and our Knight at Pharsalos takes down a Maceman Alex built.
[9] 1720 AD - Delphi Aqueduct->Forge.
Pharsalos bombarded to 0%. Argos bombarded to 4%. Horse Archers take down SuperMusket.
IBT - Alex shows up with Pikes and takes our HA down, and takes down a random phant at Pharsalos with Xbows of all things.
Napoleon shows up, and I declare peace in our time. However, our time is over in about a turn...
Assault on Pharsalos:
City Raider II Catapult: Dies, but collaterals a bunch of guys (3 Xbows, 2 Lbows defending now)
City Raider II Catapult: Dies, but collaterals more guys.
Combat II Phant vs Xbow: We win
Combat II Phant vs Lbow: We win
Combat I Phant vs Lbow: We win
Combat I Phant vs Xbow: We win
Combat II Phant vs Xbow: We win, and Pharsalos is ours! We loot 173 gold.
Bombard Argos down to 0%. We are now ready for the assault.
IBT - Alex shows up with 10 or so guys from offscreen, and assaults Delphi for all he's worth. This works out not so well for him, and much better for us.
Khan demands 200 gp tribute, and, er, you know what? We NEED that gold. No. He goes off in a huff, and we're now at +2 rep.
[10] 1730 AD - Banking comes in, start Gunpowder. Tenoch Grocer->Bank, Teo Grocer->Bank, Tlateloco Harbor->Market.
Assorted side actions against pillagers. Delphi has some issues, but I can't really deal with them right now, except to spend some of that gold I didn't tribute Khan upgrading guys in Delphi.
Assault on Argos (2xLongbow, Com1/Med1 Pike, Raid2 Catapult):
Barrage I Catapult: Dies to longbow, causes some collateral.
Barrage I Catapult: WINS vs longbow, causes some collateral.
Combat I Knight vs Pike: We win.
Combat I Phant vs Longbow: We lose.
Combat I Phant vs Longbow: We win.
Flank I Horse Archer vs Catapult: We win, and Argos is ours. We loot 204 gold.
In one of those "Boy, isn't THIS amusing things, I send two of the pults I left in Delphi to take down Alex's pults, and follow up with a Jag.
We have, more or less, achieved my war aims. We have the troops, after they rest and refit, to continue the campaign.
We have lots of scattered horse archers, including two in Delphi, that could be knights, and should be knights. We also have a lot of gold. I left this still to be done, however.
Our whole country is building commerce infrastructure, for the obvious reasons. Although we've made enough to move back to 50% science, we should not grow complacent, and should endeavor to build more commerce infrastructure.
It appears that consensus is war with Alex, who's muskets frighten me, but we'll see how that works out. Such army as we have seems to be reasonably high tech. I will, however, wait for the next round of pikes and lbows to get done.
We are way behind in tech, to the tune of Drama, Theology, Music, Guilds, Philosophy, and Optics to more or less everyone but Khan, as well as Civil Service to Inca. Alex at least is also up Gunpowder, and maybe techs leading there, such as Paper and Education. Not so fantastic, but we'll see what we can do with it.
IBT - According to Thucydides, the largest civs are Alex, us, Sir Not Appearing On Our Map, Khan, Inca, and Toku.
[1] 1680 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Longbow, Unpronouncable Pike->Pike.
We can apparently build the FP somewhere, which we should definitely do somewhere. Delphi maybe?
Move some troops up. We'll be a little thin on defense come the day, but should be ok.
[2] 1685 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Longbow, Teo Longbow->Phant, Tlatelolco Pike->Longbow, Texcoco Pike->Market.
Move some more guys up.
IBT - Khan offers Silk for our Horses, and I accept. Somebody who's not us gets Angkor Wat.
[3] 1690 AD - Tenochtitlan Longbow->Phant, Teo Phant->Phant, Unpronouncable Pike->Longbow.
Move some more guys up. Getting close.
IBT - Somebody who's not us gets Versailles.
[4] 1695 AD - Move a few more guys up.
[5] 1700 AD - Guilds comes in, and we start on Banking. Tenochtitlan Phant->Knight, Teo Phant->Knight, Texcoco Market->Grocer, Unpronouncable Longbow->Grocer, Calixtlahuaca Harbor->Forge.
Today is the day, Alex. Declare. Move lots of guys up. Delphi has ludicrous amounts of guys in it. ETA at Pharsalos 2 turns. Argos, near Teo, is size 12, walled, and has 3 lbows and a Combat I/Medic I pike for defense.
I really want to go to Vassalage, but we can't afford it at all, and I had to drop to 40% science just now.
IBT - Alex catapults our elephant stack outside Pharsalos. Somebody else gets the Spiral Minaret.
[6] 1705 AD - Tenochtitlan Knight->Grocer, Tlateloco Longbow->Harbor.
Move up guys. Pharsalos is defended by a City Defense II Xbow, a City Defense II Longbow, and a City Defense I Longbow, and is size 9 with walls. That's pretty intense, but unlike some other Aztec leaders, I brought a lot of reasonably teched guys.
[7] 1710 AD - Teo Knight->Grocer, Tlaxcala Market->Grocer.
You know, if Alex's Combat I, Cover, Pinch Musket wants to just hang out and not fight me, I think I can deal. However, his Combat II/Formation Muskets near Delphi are going to be an issue.
Begin bombardment of Argos, dropping it to 28% defense.
IBT - Somebody builds the Islamic shrine, and Alex picks Enrico Dandolo in Athens.
[8] 1715 AD - Wherein a single Bombard I pult takes Pharsalos down an astronomical number of defense to 45%. Bombard Argos to 16%.
IBT - Alex's Supermusket destroys a Longbow we threw out as bait, and our Knight at Pharsalos takes down a Maceman Alex built.
[9] 1720 AD - Delphi Aqueduct->Forge.
Pharsalos bombarded to 0%. Argos bombarded to 4%. Horse Archers take down SuperMusket.
IBT - Alex shows up with Pikes and takes our HA down, and takes down a random phant at Pharsalos with Xbows of all things.
Napoleon shows up, and I declare peace in our time. However, our time is over in about a turn...
Assault on Pharsalos:
City Raider II Catapult: Dies, but collaterals a bunch of guys (3 Xbows, 2 Lbows defending now)
City Raider II Catapult: Dies, but collaterals more guys.
Combat II Phant vs Xbow: We win
Combat II Phant vs Lbow: We win
Combat I Phant vs Lbow: We win
Combat I Phant vs Xbow: We win
Combat II Phant vs Xbow: We win, and Pharsalos is ours! We loot 173 gold.
Bombard Argos down to 0%. We are now ready for the assault.
IBT - Alex shows up with 10 or so guys from offscreen, and assaults Delphi for all he's worth. This works out not so well for him, and much better for us.
Khan demands 200 gp tribute, and, er, you know what? We NEED that gold. No. He goes off in a huff, and we're now at +2 rep.
[10] 1730 AD - Banking comes in, start Gunpowder. Tenoch Grocer->Bank, Teo Grocer->Bank, Tlateloco Harbor->Market.
Assorted side actions against pillagers. Delphi has some issues, but I can't really deal with them right now, except to spend some of that gold I didn't tribute Khan upgrading guys in Delphi.
Assault on Argos (2xLongbow, Com1/Med1 Pike, Raid2 Catapult):
Barrage I Catapult: Dies to longbow, causes some collateral.
Barrage I Catapult: WINS vs longbow, causes some collateral.
Combat I Knight vs Pike: We win.
Combat I Phant vs Longbow: We lose.
Combat I Phant vs Longbow: We win.
Flank I Horse Archer vs Catapult: We win, and Argos is ours. We loot 204 gold.
In one of those "Boy, isn't THIS amusing things, I send two of the pults I left in Delphi to take down Alex's pults, and follow up with a Jag.
We have, more or less, achieved my war aims. We have the troops, after they rest and refit, to continue the campaign.
We have lots of scattered horse archers, including two in Delphi, that could be knights, and should be knights. We also have a lot of gold. I left this still to be done, however.
Our whole country is building commerce infrastructure, for the obvious reasons. Although we've made enough to move back to 50% science, we should not grow complacent, and should endeavor to build more commerce infrastructure.
Carbon_Copy
Elemental
*chomps cigar*
I love it when a plan comes together.
Sounds like a great set of turns on the whole, I'm sorry to have doubted our war preparedness. Let's keep pounding!
Up now: Tidus444
On deck: Me
I love it when a plan comes together.
Sounds like a great set of turns on the whole, I'm sorry to have doubted our war preparedness. Let's keep pounding!
Up now: Tidus444
On deck: Me
There's still nothing better than overwhelming numbers! 
Now as long as Alex doesn't counterpunch with overwhelming numbers of his own, this could be the point where it tips in our favor.
Now as long as Alex doesn't counterpunch with overwhelming numbers of his own, this could be the point where it tips in our favor.
Kylearan
compound eye
Great set of turns, Dwip!
Hope our economy will recover now, although we might not have lost enough units...
-Kylearan
Hope our economy will recover now, although we might not have lost enough units...
-Kylearan
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