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RB5 - Rome, Emperor, Lakes, Just win

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Sirp, Dec 4, 2005.

  1. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    Ahhh that's it. :)

    I've never used that button before. I'd have imagined it would have just made the governor try to make the city 'stagnant', rather than allowing it to get lots of food, but stopping it from growing. Thanks. Finishing turn now...

    -Sirp.
     
  2. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    After the court Jester corrected Emperor Sirp's foolishness in restricting the growth of the capital, his reign continued...

    (9) 400BC: Barbarians coming toward Pisae. Pillaging may occur, as archers scramble into position to defend the city.

    I switch Rome to build a worker, due in four turns. Then it can finish its library, and go on to build a barracks and get ready to start churning out military.

    (10) 375BC: Mansa Musa has discovered Priesthood. It's only 2 turns off for us, but I convince him to give it to us, and convert to Judaism for Mathematics.

    Cyrus has discovered Calendar, but won't share it with his friends in Rome.

    And so Sirp's reign comes to an end.

    Research is tenatively set to Monarchy, but that can be vetoed.

    Our quest to get iron is not going so well, due to barbarian disruption:



    the game
     
  3. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    Sirp <-- Just played
    Skyfish <-- UP NOW
    Jester <-- On deck
    Maniac
    bed_head
     
  4. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    Now that we have an ROP with Musa, we have a warrior up by Djenie that was traped in a one tile neutral zone that we can unfortify to go scout some more.

    Consider researching Polytheism. It's only 6 turns. No one will trade it because they are building the Parthenon. Once we have that tech we might be able to trade for Monotheism so we can get Organized Religion. I know we'll want Theocracy soon too, but it would be nice to have OR in the short term.

    BTW - Everyone seems to die of shock when Japan agrees to Open Boarders. I've had Open Boarders with Toku several times. I've seen him have OB with FOUR (of 7) people simultaneously. Of course, one caveat here is, while Toku will agree to open boarders, if his opinion of you drops much at all, or if you refuse even the most insane of requests/demands, he will cancel them and not give them back unless you get to somewhere arround Friendly, so be forewarned.
     
  5. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    @ all - I will not be able to play until tuesday night or wednesday morning. If you can wait that long for me, I will play then. If not, I will need to be skipped.

    - Maniac
     
  6. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    Maniac: I think considering both Skyfish and Jester are up before you, you'll be okay. :)

    I think we're doing fairly well now. I was surprised we were able to get Alphabet first. I didn't realize that AIs 'embargo' technologies while they are building associated wonders. But that's rather smart of them (though after they are close to finishing they should realize that another civ couldn't possibly beat them, and then be happy to trade it).

    I think we should try hard to foster friendship with Tokuguwa: he could be a good ally to have.

    -Sirp.
     
  7. Iester

    Iester Entirely Without Humour

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    "I think we should try hard to foster friendship with Tokuguwa: he could be a good ally to have."

    Toku is the kind of ally you can't reason with. If he starts demanding tons of gold, key techs, or that we join a suicidal war, we can't just refuse and expect to keep him as an ally.

    Most AIs, they'll take the good with the bad, and add up the total. Toku... unless you're absolutely perfect in his eyes, he'll just clam up and never trade with you. Ever.

    That's been my experience with the man, anyway.

    "But that's rather smart of them (though after they are close to finishing they should realize that another civ couldn't possibly beat them, and then be happy to trade it)."

    Next on Jeopardy:

    "I'll take "Stealin' it from under their noses" for 600, Alex."

    "This type of great person can ruin your day by rushing that wonder you've been building for 30 turns in a single turn."

    That's why they don't trade until it's done.

    -Jester
     
  8. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    Jester is right about Toku. He'll warm up to you, but unless you keep relations very high, almost to friendly level, you can't refuse any of his requests and not expect him to immediately close his boarders. I've seen him do it at +9 just because I wouldn't stop trading with somone. He CAN be fostered as an ally, its just rather hard to. Problem is, we don't have any other candidates for best buddy right now, so we may have to try to be friends with him.

    Jester is also right on the wonder reasoning. And yes, the AI does embargo techs that it's building a wonder for, and even techs that lead to the tech it is build a wonder for. Ever seen the excuse "We have our reasons?" for why they wont trade a tech? Now you know what it means.

    - Maniac

    Edit: On the other hand, Mansa Musa, Cyrus, and FDR are all very dependable buddies in my experience. Watch out for Musa though. He has a knack for 1) ending up hated by lots of people and 2) Running away in tech. In my experience, hes the best performing AI.
     
  9. Skyfish

    Skyfish Emperor

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    Wow, with a massive turn in RB2a plus the Epic One report to finish, this week-end is my first Civ IV (over)feast :crazyeye:

    Got it !
     
  10. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    Massive turn? I just played like 80 turns in 3 MoO (one of them ended as a 2 man game between me and Zed) SG's in an 18 hour period, and wrote reports that included at least 50 pictures. That was durring the time I played my turn here, and while working on my Epic one report!

    Somehow, I think you'll manage ok. I have confidence in ya. :)

    - Maniac
     
  11. Iester

    Iester Entirely Without Humour

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    Funny thing is that, while the Firaxians have modeled Toku's "Xenophobe" personality after his policy of shutting down Japan to foreigners, Tokugawa Ieyasu was a master at diplomacy and manipulation, entirely unlike the crazy halfwit they have here.

    But that's just the history geek talkin'...

    -Jester
     
  12. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    It's nice to have the AI with diffrent personality, but I wonder... Has anyone had a game where Toku did well?? He's allways awful in my games, and I suspect it's because his trade revenue sucks. I'm starting to think Toku is going to become the Mrrshan of Civ 4. The perenial also ran, that only very rarely rises to any position of strenght.

    - Maniac
     
  13. Kylearan

    Kylearan compound eye

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    Hi,

    I agree that he sucks most of the time, but in my second last Immortal attempt, he was in fact the tech leader by far at the beginning of the modern age! :eek: That was probably because he had waged no war for a change (only had a small border to one other civ). That was...amazing.

    If he had been able to even launch first I cannot tell, though. I got conquested before. :crazyeye:

    -Kylearan
     
  14. Iester

    Iester Entirely Without Humour

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    "The perenial also ran, that only very rarely rises to any position of strenght."

    Now where have I read *that*?

    :lol:

    In my last monarch win, a cultural victory as Cathy, I went from first place to 2nd last as I sunk into culture accumulation mode, and everyone else plowed on towards the space race.

    However, I was never in danger of dropping into last, even though I was producing next to nothing. That position was Toku's forever. He's the self-hosing man.

    I've never seen him do better than the bottom three, except by me forcing it by conquering other people.

    -Jester
     
  15. ToddMarshall

    ToddMarshall Maniac - Stellar Wingman

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    Well, it seems i'm not alone in that experience then.

    Maybe his AI will get some kind of boost in the expansion.

    Seems like the "xenophobic" AI would have done well to have been given the comercial trait, rather than the Organized one.

    Organized seems to only matter a lot on large or huge maps, at least for the AI. It would be diffrent if the AI was more adept at taking cities perhaps.

    The human, who can get the most out of a set of traits and who doesn't have to be a xenobhobe with Toku would probably do quite well however.

    - Maniac
     
  16. Skyfish

    Skyfish Emperor

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    Turn 100 (375 BC)
    Neapolis's borders expand
    Judaism has spread: Pisae

    Turn 101 (350 BC)
    Archer defeats (0.75/3): Barbarian Axeman
    Neapolis finishes: Archer
    Pisae grows: 3

    Our culture and science are good, Washington and Napoleon are not as advanced as us.
    I believe we have this game well under the control, I would have hoped for
    a bit more challenge ;)



    Turn 102 (325 BC)
    Neapolis begins: Archer
    Archer promoted: City Garrison I
    Archer promoted: City Garrison II
    Archer promoted: Drill I
    Archer promoted: Drill II
    Rome finishes: Worker
    Archer loses to: Barbarian Axeman (1.25/5)

    Turn 103 (300 BC)
    Antium finishes: Archer
    Cumae finishes: Worker
    Archer defeats (1.38/3): Barbarian Axeman

    Turn 104 (275 BC)
    Cumae begins: Walls
    Archer promoted: Combat I
    Antium begins: Chariot
    Rome finishes: Chariot

    Turn 105 (250 BC)
    Rome begins: Jewish Temple
    Antium grows: 6
    Pisae's borders expand

    OK shoot me if you want I go for a Temple here as it will allow us to grow to
    size 8 ! Library can wait for when we are stuck at that size.

    Turn 106 (225 BC)
    Neapolis threatened, we need a road to get there ASAP.



    Pisae grows: 4
    Archer defeats (3.00/3): Barbarian Archer
    Archer defeats (1.83/3): Barbarian Archer

    :hammer:

    Turn 107 (200 BC)
    Archer promoted: City Garrison I
    Warrior defeats (1.20/2): Barbarian Warrior
    Antium finishes: Chariot
    Pisae finishes: Barracks

    We are up Med, Priest, Pottery and Alpha
    on Toku but he still does not want to trade Poly
    ..and he just finished Parthenon ! :rolleyes:
    The cultural pressure is going to be too high, his territory
    is right by us towards the equator..and I dont like him :)
    I maintain he should be our first target.

    Turn 108 (175 BC)
    Antium begins: Chariot
    Pisae begins: Archer
    Warrior promoted: Combat I
    Chariot promoted: Flanking I
    Neapolis finishes: Archer
    Cottage completes in Rome since we are at max happiness I switch
    tiles around for Gold and Hammers. Temple will be ready just before
    we grow to size 8 :)
    Saladin is busy makinbg friends ;) Our rep is going down fast with him...



    Turn 109 (150 BC)
    Neapolis begins: Archer
    Archer defeats (3.00/3): Barbarian Axeman
    Cumae grows: 3

    Turn 110 (125 BC)
    Chariot promoted: Flanking II
    Archer defeats (0.60/3): Barbarian Warrior
    Ravenna founded
    Ravenna begins: Obelisk
    Archer promoted: City Garrison I
    Chariot defeats (1.76/4): Barbarian Warrior

    Our costs goes thru the sky when founding our Iron city
    we can only sustain 40% research and are 12 turns
    from Monarchy which Washington already has.

    But Praets are soon to come :D

    http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/RBC5_BC-0125.Civ4SavedGame
     
  17. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    Great work getting our iron city going Skyfish! :)

    We are doing rather better than I expected. The voice of sanity really does say that we should make Toku a target rather than a friend, so let's do that. Mansa Musa can possibly be our friend for a while.

    Sirp
    Skyfish <-- Just played
    Jester <-- UP NOW
    Maniac <-- On deck
    bed_head
     
  18. Sirp

    Sirp Emperor

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    Nice turn, by the way Skyfish. I had intended to settle on the iron, but I guess the iron city will be a little more productive in the long-run due to your settling location.

    We really do need more workers. We need to get a road out to Neapolis, because it needs defense from barbs, and Saladin isn't exactly fond of us either, and he's over there. Also, I would imagine the liberation of Jute will be the first target for our praetorians.

    Another reason we need workers is that Antium and Neapolis are surrounded by unimproved terrain. We need to get them producing faster and better. We'll also want to start chopping down some forest to push praetorian production soon enough (there is plenty outside of city radiuses, if anyone is squeamish about cutting down our beautiful Roman forests).

    I think we're going to have to source more workers from somewhere other than Rome. Rome is busy building a temple now (an excellent choice), and then we will probably want a library and a barracks. We could get one worker out of there after the temple though, I guess.

    Pisae can build workers in 5 turns, so we can build one there.

    We're progressing very nicely though. So far we seem to be 'cruising' nicely. I'm sure the game will have a curveball to throw at us sooner or later though. :)

    If Toku declared war on us now, for instance, we might be in some trouble.

    -Sirp.
     
  19. Iester

    Iester Entirely Without Humour

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    Got it!

    -Jester
     
  20. Skyfish

    Skyfish Emperor

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    Agree on the chopping however I would use them to speed up *some* infra before going on a Praets spree ! We need Libs, Walls and Temples in all of our secondary cities, and need them fast too !

    Also I say we just need one or possibly 2 more workers short term : 3 of them are mining the Iron now but should go back to either roading to Neapolis (take the south of mountain route for less river
    crossings) or improving Pisae/Cumae. Antium is at max happiness capacity and we dont need the Marble asap...
     

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