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Realism Invictus

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by Walter Hawkwood, Feb 13, 2011.

  1. [Y]

    [Y] Warlord

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2010
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    This would be great.

    One of the lessons I learned as I took on harder difficulty levels is to value coastal cities low unless the city was specifically intended to be a trade-based commercial city or a navy manufacturer. Otherwise, I aim to have it more inland, closer to resources, and with more workable land tiles, since they eventually outshine ocean tiles by a huge margin. An additional health boost would make the coastal tiles significantly more tempting.
     
  2. Zap0

    Zap0 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2020
    Messages:
    28
    Re: Coastal Cities
    My preference is to found coastal for the ability to produce naval units and the trade, but to minimize the amount of sea tiles in range.
    A health boost through the Fishing Docks would be somewhat of a hidden boost to coastal cities, I'd wager most people wouldn't include that boost in their decisions.
    Each coastal city is also a border, as I've come to know through the AIs ability to execute devastating naval invasions, even if a land route is available. Only inland cities can be actual hinterland.

    Re: Ironclad balance
    I defer to you in the realism aspects. Realism is kind of on the tin for this mod, so I can understand deciding in favor of it.
    Any thoughts about the two naval techs being so closely intertwined?

    Re: Masonry Materials
    Limestone spawns were adjusted already? I didn't run a comparison of course, but I didn't notice in playing. The Roman comparison came to my mind too.

    Different topic, any suggestions for diplomatically keeping the AI off one's back?
    Frequently they take turns attacking me - often for a reason, since I get outproduced on units. Is it viable to keep bending backwards to accede to their demands, proactively giving tribute, sticking to certain civics? Is the answer just to have more units?
    Edit: I play Monarch, often with "AI plays to win" on, which I presume is what makes them smell blood.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2020
  3. Dairokutenmaou

    Dairokutenmaou Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2019
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    Just reporting I finished the game and the unit cost issue didn't show itself again, Waiting warmly for r5260 or above since the logs mention some bug fixes coming up.
     
  4. jafink

    jafink King

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2005
    Messages:
    632
    I don't usually play with "AI plays to win" turned on, so I am not sure how much that will affect things. The AI in Realism Invictus is much more aggressive, which is a big part of what makes this mod so good, but I have been in situations where I am just endlessly being attacked by different AI Civs, and it gets very frustrating.

    There are two effective ways to reduce the amount you are being attacked. Firstly, diplomacy. The most important thing for diplomacy in the first half of the game is religion. If a lot of strong civs have the same religion, I will take that same religion if I can, or take no religion at all. Taking a different religion than most of the powerful Civs is very dangerous, and rarely worth it. Although religion is the most important aspect of diplomacy there are other things to consider as well. I know it is not fun to "stop trading with Civ X" or to pay some gold as tribute, but sometimes it is worth doing. Also, trying to trade resources with powerful civs can help them like you more as well. Sometimes it is worth trading resources in a way that is not very economically beneficial for you, just to pacify a dangerous threat.

    The second main way to reduce the amount you get attacked is to increase your "Power" rating. This mostly involves building more military units, and using Great Generals to found Traditions and Doctrines. I know that sometimes you want to keep building buildings to help your economy, and don't want to "waste" hammers building soldiers that will just sit there and cost money in maintenance. But you have to think of those soldiers as contributing to you not being attacked. Being attacked by an enemy of similar strength is very bad for the economy. If building 3 or 4 more military units in the early game will stop you from being attacked, that is probably better for your economy than building an extra couple of buildings that will only net you a couple gold per turn.

    My final advice regarding this is to be patient, and try to weather the storm as best you can. My first-ever win on Emperor I was in a situation where I was one of the 3 strongest Civs in the game, but the other two were taking turns attacking me, again and again. I was holding off their invasions without losing any cities, but I was forced to build so many military units that I was worried about my economy. I was getting frustrated and considered quitting the game, but I stuck with it and eventually one of the powerful Civs declared war on the other powerful AI Civ instead of me. This game me a great opportunity to "gang up" on one of my main rivals, easily capturing several cities, and cementing my position as the strongest Civ in the game. I learned not to give up too soon, because even though the AI has attacked you 4 times in a row, they might randomly attack someone else the next time.
     
    sazhdapec likes this.
  5. BCheek

    BCheek Warlord

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    The only thing the AI truly respects is power. This has been true throughout all of Civ 4.
     
  6. Zap0

    Zap0 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2020
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    Moar Units it is; no more "that's definitely enough to keep the barbs in check and cover surprise attacks".

    Bug:
    The Incan distinctive Cataphract says it replaces the Knight and it's distinctive Explorer says it's actually Light Infantry.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2020
  7. aantia

    aantia Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2019
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    I've just found a bug in the current SVN version: Warriors are incorrectly being treated as ranged units (I'm playing as Carthage, not sure if it's a universal problem). The 'pedia says they replace archers, and they're providing ranged support.
     
  8. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

    Joined:
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    London, UK
    That's strange to hear. Here's a screenshot from a quick test start I did with Carthage:

    Spoiler screenshot :
    upload_2020-2-7_17-33-33.png


    A warrior can clearly be seen here being a warrior. Please provide screenshots/saves and make sure this is not a game during which you've updated SVN - this sounds suspiciously similar to something that would be caused by that.
     
  9. aantia

    aantia Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2019
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    Well, this is definitely a problem on my end, not yours. The game crashed when I tried to load the save. It's weird; I definitely started a new game after updating Realism this morning.
    Sorry to bother you with a false alarm.
     
  10. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Right, I am very nearly done. While I'd like to run at least one-two more test games, I'm fairly certain that what I have is what's going to be 3.5; for those of you waiting, here, as per tradition, here's a change log and an updated manual.
     

    Attached Files:

    arievillo and f1rpo like this.
  11. Phylhom

    Phylhom King

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    Great News!!!
     
  12. Sathar

    Sathar Chieftain

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    Late entry: I'm not sure if it's intentional, but as far as I can tell Helepolis appears to be treated as a gunpowder unit with regards to attacking against Walls et al. It's been this way for a long time.

    Also: The new separation bonus for Local Autonomy does not show in the tooltip. It was added to the Civilopaedia entry. For that matter, a lot of the Epidemic boni don't show correctly in the build bar either, especially when they upgrade an existing building. For example, building an Aqueduct in a city without a Public Well will show a net effect of +4 Health -4 Epidemic, but if there is a Public Well then the net effect is listed as +2 Health (though of course the full benefit is applying once it is built, so like Local Autonomy it's only cosmetic).
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2020
  13. BCheek

    BCheek Warlord

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    Love the new dynamic naming and flags. Very cool. Also really like the new mountain texture.

    I did notice some strange behavior re revolutions that I wanted to give you a heads up about because I don't think it's intended. I captured Persia's capital, rioting broke out the next turn. I chose "harsh punishment" with the -30% separation modifier, so I had -130% separation with the provisional government, but still ended up with a 67% chance of separation with probably a half dozen units stationed in the city. Then a few turns later the city re-joined Persia (who still had cities left) and forced me into a peace deal with them. Saved game attached.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Why is everyone calling separatism "separation"? :dunno:

    Yeah, I know tooltips are a bit wonky when it comes to separatism. I never got around to updating relevant BUG code. And as for Helepolis, yeah, that's what makes it so useful.

    Took a look at the save game, didn't see anything out of ordinary. You've had an almost +100% separatism modifier, mostly from war weariness, and 80 base separatism just from unhappiness in that city, plus lots from other factors. If you make peace by ending both wars, the war weariness is no longer factored in, and separatism in Persepolis becomes manageable. Otherwise, you'll only be able to hold it by stacking a real lot of units there.
     
  15. Colon

    Colon King

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    Looking forward to trying it out. Thanks for cranking out one more version.
     
  16. BCheek

    BCheek Warlord

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    Okay, so that part makes sense. I didn't realize war weariness contributed to separatism, but what troubled me the most is I was forced into peace automatically when Persepolis separated from me.
     
  17. Dairokutenmaou

    Dairokutenmaou Chieftain

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    What file controls the amount of barbarian civs allowed to settle? I want to try increasing the number.

    Edit: Also what line too, I think I found the file but I can't guess what value is it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2020
  18. MalayanGamer

    MalayanGamer Warlord

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    When the version is release?
     
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  19. sazhdapec

    sazhdapec Warlord

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    Aug 6, 2015
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    Several small things.
    1) When a civ rises from the dead and signs peace treaties the message in the log doesn't show the name of this civ.
    2) Golden age start sound is the same as the golden age end sound. But there exists a different sound file for a golden age start. It is located in a CIV4gamefolder\Assets\Sounds folder.
    3) City "trading" removes all culture of a previous owner from it. With revolutions enabled this is one hell of a cheap way to get rid of foreign culture. Is there anything that can be done?
    4) How is "you're getting ahead of us" working? What values are being compared?

    And a personal wish.
    5) Make all leaders more likely to trade (both luxury and strategic types of resources). With the latest changes to diplomacy it's much harder to have positive relations. But for a lot of leaders this means that they won't trade at all: they have the surplus but just sit on it.
     
  20. arievillo

    arievillo Chieftain

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    +1 here. Excelent mod by the way.
     

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