Recommend for me a new 4X game!

[Alexfrog]

Hi everyone,

Aside from Civ IV, what other new 4X games do you feel are excellent and worthy of play? I've recently been craving a good 4X game again, and am looking for suggestions.

A few possibilities that I have identified:
Age of Wonders 3
Warlock 2
Endless Space
Pandora: First Contact
Anything else I am missing?

(I got Fallen Enchantress and it was okay. GalCiv 2 was pretty good. Havent played any other recent games).


I am posting this on the Civ IV board, because if you, the reader, is someone who is still playing Civ IV after all these years, and not someone who has fallen for the dreck that was Civ V, then you are someone whose opinion I value!


My favorite 4X games from the past:
Civ IV
MOO 2
Master of Magic
SM:Alpha Centauri
Age of Wonders 2/Shadow Magic



My priorities:
#1 Priority for me is interesting and strategically deep empire management. Civ4 was amazing at this, of course! (And I prefer if the amount of micromanagement that is needed doesn't just scale exponentially as the game progresses, with a dominant strategy of 'build as many cities as possible').

RPG/exploration/questing elements such as in games like Master of Magic and Age of Wonders are cool features, but not essential. I tend to like well designed games that include these, but also well designed games that dont.

Combat is a lower priority for me. Its nice if the combat is tactically interesting, but I don't want to just be bogged down in long battles when what I really care about is empire management.

I give absolutely zero f*cks about graphics!

It would be nice if the game ended in a reasonable time frame. Many of these 4X games seem to have no idea that they need to actually end, and I just quit the game after I get way ahead, but its clear that it would take hours more grindy gameplay in order to exterminate every last f'ing enemy unit for the world. I'd rather not have to do that.



So, fellow Civ 4 lovers, what are your recommendations? Have you played any of the recent games I mentioned, or do you know of any others? Which one should I get?


Thanks for reading, and thanks for your feedback! I am hoping this forum is an appropriate place for this thread. If it isnt, I apologize.

 

[lymond]

Only thing I can think of is Crusader Kings 2 and Europa Universalis IV. Really fantastic games that play quite differently from all the ones you mentioned, but have tremendous depth.

CK and EU are similar in some ways, but have differences in empire management and certain strategic aspects like diplomacy. CK games can be converted into EU games to move your empire into a later era.

 

[Alexfrog]

Ah, I should add: Yes, I have played Crusader Kings II and it was great. (But its more of a Dynasty-manager game than a Civilization game).

 

[lymond]

Ah, I should add: Yes, I have played Crusader Kings II and it was great. (But its more of a Dynasty-manager game than a Civilization game).

Dynasty is a big part of it sure, but there is lots of other stuff. However, you probably should try EU IV. Although graphically it is similar, it plays quite different in most respect. You play a province or country and try to build an empire. There's colonialism, naval warfare, trade, and interesting ways to handle research. The National Ideas really add a lot of flavor. Plus, the map is the whole world. So much is represented. You can play Africans, Asians, Indians, and Native Americans. Even Islanders.

You can always check Youtube LPs to get an idea. Arumba has some very good EU LPs. Search for him

 

[Windsor]

GalCiv3 is on early access and will probably be worth a look when it comes out.

But I would recommend Eclipse. Yes its an iPad conversion of a board game, but its very good.

Unfortunately there's very few good 4x games out there.

 

[Verrucosus]

Your priorities (strategically deep empire management, combat not that important, no interest in graphics, sensible victory conditions) made me remember "Imperialism" and "Imperialism II", both from the late 1990s and - you'll be pleased to hear - designed by a studio named "Frog City". I realise you ask for recommendations of "new" 4X games, but you did not mention these among your past favourites, so they may be new enough to you. "Imperialism" is set in the 19th century and has a bit more charm in my opinion, but it's tricky to install on 64 bit systems - the game itself works fine, but the installer does not. "Imperialism II" is more polished, set in the Age of Discovery, so it starts with a partially undiscovered map that might be considered an essential 4X element.

 

[Windsor]

Your priorities (strategically deep empire management, combat not that important, no interest in graphics, sensible victory conditions) made me remember "Imperialism" and "Imperialism II", both from the late 1990s and - you'll be pleased to hear - designed by a studio named "Frog City". I realise you ask for recommendations of "new" 4X games, but you did not mention these among your past favourites, so they may be new enough to you. "Imperialism" is set in the 19th century and has a bit more charm in my opinion, but it's tricky to install on 64 bit systems - the game itself works fine, but the installer does not. "Imperialism II" is more polished, set in the Age of Discovery, so it starts with a partially undiscovered map that might be considered an essential 4X element.

The install issues can be avoided by buying them from gog.com

Being so old the interface is a bit outdated making them hard for new players to get into, but for those who can get around that they are still great.

Three Moves Ahead did a podcast on Imperialism a few years ago http://flashofsteel.com/index.php/2...episode-61-classic-game-analysis-imperialism/

 

[Lennier]

Your priorities (strategically deep empire management, combat not that important, no interest in graphics, sensible victory conditions) made me remember "Imperialism" and "Imperialism II", both from the late 1990s and - you'll be pleased to hear - designed by a studio named "Frog City". I realise you ask for recommendations of "new" 4X games, but you did not mention these among your past favourites, so they may be new enough to you. "Imperialism" is set in the 19th century and has a bit more charm in my opinion, but it's tricky to install on 64 bit systems - the game itself works fine, but the installer does not. "Imperialism II" is more polished, set in the Age of Discovery, so it starts with a partially undiscovered map that might be considered an essential 4X element.

I really miss Imperialism II. Was a very good game.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Rotating between Civ4, SMAX, Colonization, and GalCiv2 allows me to have some TBS game in progress pretty much all the time without ever burning out on any one in particular. When I get sort of 'generally' burned out I either play some sort of city builder, TW, or RTS for a while.

Might try some of the games recommended here though at some point.

 

[LincolnOfRome]

Master of Orion I and Master of Magic from the early 90's were excellent games.

 

[Jabarto]

If you liked Age of Wonders, try Eador: Genesis. It has a surprisingly beefy tech tree and a lot more options for provincial development than Age of Wonders, Heroes of Might and Magic, Disciples, etc.. There's a remake called Eador: Masters of the Broken World, but it's almost the exact same game with a graphics update. I'd say it's not really worth the higher cost. Both of them are on GOG.com.

I might also suggest Dominions 4. It's more of a wargame than a 4x but it's incredibly good. There's some exploration, but city/province development is unfortunately pretty basic. On the other hand, it's pretty much perfect for you if you don't like a game to drag on for too long, because there is a lot of crazy end-game magic that will seal a victory if there's a stalemate; things like unleashing ancient dead gods from Tartarus to fight for you, cursing enemy mages to be attacked by Cthulu-esque horrors every time they try to cast a spell, or just blanketing the whole world with lightning/fire/poison/other nasty stuff.

 

[Slarki]

Imperialism 1 is a great game! You can also get it for free, I think it's just 5 mb. It is really well designed and easy to learn. You get pretty fast in a flow.

EU IV disappointed me for the lack of depth, I prefer BtS in that way. But it is not turn-based, which is really refreshing! I am waiting for a mod which randomizes the world like in imperialism or civ.

 

[AdamCrock]

Elemental the Fallen Enchantress is basically MoM* with a new suit ! Very good game I reckon. You can't go wrong with MoM* ^^

*MoM = Master of Magic

 

[Iranon]

Considering

I give absolutely zero f*cks about graphics!

:
Aurora. It's rather nerdy even for a space 4x, but a fantastic game.

 

[Quintillus]

I'd recommend Europa Universalis IV (on sale for $9.30), or if you're feeling cheap and miss that sale, Europa Universalis III Chronicles. While not 4X per se, they're both highly strategic (as opposed to tactical like Civ5), and meet your top requirement of interesting and strategically deep empire management. Diplomacy is also better than Civ4, in particular that in EUIV (but not so much III) your neighbors will work together to keep you from expanding too quickly, even if they themselves are rivals (and they'll do this to AIs that are expanding rapidly, too, so it's not discriminatory against humans).

After getting Europa Universalis III a couple years ago, it nearly entirely replaced Civilization (3 and 4) for me for the next year. If nothing else, try the demos.

I haven't played any of the titles you mentioned in your first post. I have heard good things about Age of Wonders 3 (but haven't wanted to shell out to buy it yet), but when I asked about Endless Space 3 in the Other Games forum, was advised that it isn't really worth it compared to other space strategy games.

EU IV disappointed me for the lack of depth, I prefer BtS in that way. But it is not turn-based, which is really refreshing! I am waiting for a mod which randomizes the world like in imperialism or civ.

You may be looking for the Conquest of Paradise expansion, which allows randomized New Worlds. It's not totally random, but for the purposes of colonialism it's mostly random (although I haven't bought it yet myself).

I'm not sure what you mean by "lack of depth", though. There may not be as many buildings as Civ4, or the health system, for example, but strategically it's as good as Civ4.

 

[Tigranes]

What is going on with language on public forums these days. Some individuals do not seem to able to connect words in sentences without dropping F bombs in every paragraph.

 

[NihilZero]

Perhaps slightly off-topic, but I thought I'd ask anyway - in the opinion of this forum, is EU IV really all that good? I was a huge fan of EUIII but I have heard some not-so-great things about the sequel.

I still have some very fond memories of EUIII multiplayer. Gods, that was fun.

 

[lymond]

EU IV is awesome and addicting. I enjoyed III for years as well.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I finished my Civ IV game...and about the same time found Space Empires V. So rather than go straight into another Civ IV I'm trying that out again. My previous play was raw with no patches, and it had issues, but from reading various forums the fully patched version is good, and I picked up a very widely used 'unaltered but better' mod. Seems very complex, which may mean deep...hard to tell yet, but it's a break from the warrior and settler front.

 

[Slarki]

I'd recommend Europa Universalis IV (on sale for $9.30), or if you're feeling cheap and miss that sale, Europa Universalis III Chronicles. While not 4X per se, they're both highly strategic (as opposed to tactical like Civ5), and meet your top requirement of interesting and strategically deep empire management. Diplomacy is also better than Civ4, in particular that in EUIV (but not so much III) your neighbors will work together to keep you from expanding too quickly, even if they themselves are rivals (and they'll do this to AIs that are expanding rapidly, too, so it's not discriminatory against humans).

After getting Europa Universalis III a couple years ago, it nearly entirely replaced Civilization (3 and 4) for me for the next year. If nothing else, try the demos.

I haven't played any of the titles you mentioned in your first post. I have heard good things about Age of Wonders 3 (but haven't wanted to shell out to buy it yet), but when I asked about Endless Space 3 in the Other Games forum, was advised that it isn't really worth it compared to other space strategy games.



You may be looking for the Conquest of Paradise expansion, which allows randomized New Worlds. It's not totally random, but for the purposes of colonialism it's mostly random (although I haven't bought it yet myself).

I'm not sure what you mean by "lack of depth", though. There may not be as many buildings as Civ4, or the health system, for example, but strategically it's as good as Civ4.

Yes, strategically it is as good as civ. But I wish there were more different ways to play the game, like in civ. With the expansion, there is a mod I found which completely randomizes the whole world, but it is rather buggy right now. The add-on is great, go buy it!! The next add-on is about to come.