Refining the Rules

Originally posted by Cyc
Good idea, BCLG100. I don't know what the bank does with the money anyway. I've never seen any bookkeepping for the bank's gold. In accordance to Strider's suggestion of the food places charging automatically (that not a bad idea, except for the people that don't own the food places), I think the food places need to but their goods from the wholesale places, like the farms, the smokehouses, the breweries. Just like Shaitan has started purchasing products made from natural resources to use in his Home Construction business. Like Donsig said this can work if you can come up with a good idea, if not than you can live free in the city on 200g per week.
Click to expand...

How bout this:

1. Farming:

A. Farming requires either a plains or grassland owned tile.
B. Start-up costs for farming is 200g

Or something like that to start up farming, cattle herding etc. If business's want to sell a food item they either have to farm it themselves or pay to get access to the farms

Also IE:

S&E inc. sells gem. Strider who owns half of S&E inc. owns some mountains from which they aquire their gems. Thus they do not have to pay someone to have access to those items.
 
BC: the 20-40% do NOT go to the bank! read the rules!
they are tax, maintenance, work, raw material...
but not for the bank!
the only thing the bank (bavarian) earns is the loans thing. nothing more!
so we already do a payment on the money we spend.
but what about letting businesses which do not give revenue for 4 TC's in a row run out?
or maybe a minimum per TC maintenance payment relative to the startup cost? like 1% of the startup cost per TC?
example:
a normal biz has 1000gold startup cost.
its the first biz, so i dont have to pay that.
but i have to pay a minimum of 10% of 1000gold, which is 10gold per TC for maintenance.
so the income of the biz will be directly without reduction(!) payed to my account. after the TC, the bank uses this data to calculate the revenue. then the "costs" will be payed of the biz-holder's account. if it is lower than 10gold, 10 gold will be payed anyways.

see it as tax declaration at the end of the year ;-)
btw:
the advantage of the "tax declaration" system would be that people could "work" with the tax money between the chats. they would just have to have enough on the account for paying the tax after the TC :-)

Some things we should urgently implement imho:
1) travel charges. also for good transportation
2) tax for land ownership
3) tax for holding money on the account (i thought of 1% per TC of the money in the bank :-P )

the "tax+cost" money should not, like now, vanish in the black hole. it should be recycled. for example a cheap lottery could be used to get the money out (run by the state of course! no profit making!).
maybe i even have another idea: we give money for official jobs. now that money has to come from somewhere. so thats where that money should go :-P
we give away over 1000gold each TC. i wonder how much money those 20-40% bring in... :-)

we urgently need an overall economic calculation with circulation controll for money!
 
a comment to my above post: saying tax i always mean "tax, maintenance, workers, raw material and etc. costs".
this is all accumulated into one factor for simplicity.
 
Just incase everyone is wondering..... money from the bank does not go into a black hole... It goes into 100g/turn salary everyone gets.

Dis: You just managed to confuse me..
 
Ok here's a suggestion:

The RPG manager/sub-managers control how much money is currently flowing. They do this by adding money in (IE: Give everyone 500 gold or something like that) or taking money out (IE: stopping the flow of money in someplace that will harm no-one)
 
I like Strider's idea about the farms. Owners of forest tiles could sell lumber. SaAm's lake and the coastal tiles could produce fish. We should work up a list of what kinds of businesses need a tile and what kinds of businesses are supported by the different tiles. We should include resources. A tile with horses is the supplier for Equiss, etc. Keep in mind that some businesses are city businesses though.
 
Now instead of just sitting here making up new idea's (like we seem to do in the RPG) we need to improve are current ones :)
 
I have to agree that I disagree (:D) with the fact that the bank seems to generate an endless vortex of money. I look to the management's purchases of basic houses and horses from Acroama and Equarias, respectively. Management spent more than 100000g on those purchases. Where did that money come from?

I would recommend the following changes:

a. Set a total amount of money for the whole RPG. That way, no money is simply 'generated'

b. Pay those with no jobs with a MUCH smaller amount of money. This encourages people to do work, and start businesses.

c. If any major reform is to be done, start from scrach. Everybody with with little or no money, no businesses, no possestions purchased by management.
 
youve got the bank heads support.
now just get donsig (think you have it) and BCLG's, and your fine.
and mr doughnut, no way to part c. if we do, keep the cash.
i like a, though. if the FRA could actualy produce money, it would earn money and it would allow things to go easeir.
and as i have emphaisied, AUTOMATE THE SYSTEM
 
there is one issue i think needs to be adressed: monopolies

there should be a limit on the number of companies that you own. i would say 3.

there should also be a limit on the companies that you own shares in. i would say 8-12.

this would still allow people to amass huge wealth, but would keep them from diversifying to much
 
i resist giving support for anything without a worked out ruleset for it. so please formulate the ideas floating in here into the ruleset and post it for review.
what about charging the startup cost multiplying it with the number of businesses somebody already founded -1?
so if someone founds(!) his 3rd business, he will have to pay 2x the startup costs. somebody who founds his first biz will have to pay 0x the startup cost (current system for 1st startup).
notice here i used "founded", so sold companies or changed company types will also count!

this way people would be naturally limited in founding new businesses by their money.
we could of course reduce this rate if the biz is going directly public and all shares belong to the biz and not the founder, as he will have no profit out of it.
 
Yes, lots of ideas. Lots of conflicting ideas. What is it we are trying to accomplish with these ideas? Make everyone have the same amount of money and assets? C'mon people, quit whining. Get off your duffs and do something.

SAaM, automation is a great idea but we haven't found anyone who is capable and willing to do it. So, the bank has gotten unwieldy. Too much for one person to handle. Idea: distribute the work by opening more banks!

Open a farm. Open a logging company. Use your imagination but remember that the most successful businesses find a need and fill it!
 
an idea for non-existing items (items which are not yet invented):

1) items which are known to any of our known nations (ingame) can be sold
2) items which are not yet to be produced by ourselves (we dont own the tech) receive a much higher revenue reduction. the seller only gets for example 10% of his net-income because it is an imported item. also, as soon as we get the technique to know it ourselves, the price MUST be at least 1/3ed.

this way we would have fancy new items to sell, but would also punish the seller and with that automatically increase the price of the product.
this should also apply to resources which exist in the game, but we do not have in our area of influence!

example 1:
the futuristic weapon shop wants to sell catapults.
* as long as none of our neigbors knows mathematics, the shop can not sell those.
* as soon as one of our neighbors gets mathematics, the shop may sell the item, but only receives 10% of the sales price. So if the price is set to 900 gold for the shop owner, he only gets 90gold for the sale.
* as soon as we ourselves get the tech, the shop receives its 80%(i think) of the selling price, but has to put that price to 1/3 of its previous amount immediately! So in our example the price would be set to 300 gold automatically.

example 2:
a shop wants to sell incense
* as long as none of our neighbors has it in its radius, this is not possible
* as soon as one of our neighbors has it, the shop gets 10% as above
* as soon as we have it, the shop will get its 80%?.
with resources not in the game, this will be handled differently. they will be considered available (like stones, wood etc).
as soon as a raw produces buys a tile and produces the raw-good, the raw-product must be baught from him!


the responsiblity to track the sold things would be the item-managers's. he has an inventory of items and can intervene when things are sold which are not possibly sold. a sold item which does not exist will be deleted from the inventory and the resulting bank transaction will be deleted.
 
After a little reflection it seems our problem is that we have money coming from nowhere and money going into nowhere. Let us try to eliminate or reduce this. One way would be to allow people to start businesses that would tap into the 'freebies' we get. For instance, when we start a business we pay so much in start-up fees that is supposed to represent infrastrcuture. Rather than just send the start-up fees into oblivion let them go into other businesses. New businesses need a building or buildings. Let a construction company get paid (out of the start-up fees) to make the building. I'm sure we can come up with more ideas of what goes into start-up. These ideas will generate new companies. Let's have more than one construction company. New businesses can take bids for their new buildings, etc.

As for income that comes from nowhere, perhaps we should change it so that once you own a business you forego your basic 100g/chat income. We should also let people get jobs without owning a business. If there's a construction company it should have some workers on it's payroll. Anyone employed by a company would also forego the 100g/chat income. This would give people an incentive to get their businesses going! (Geez, I sound like a Republican now! :blush: )
 
@dis way earlier i have read the rules but where that money goes nowhere so what is the point of paying money that goes nowhere wice once for the 80%thign and then again when we have to give 20%to the bank


also how about thsi every age the 100gold/tc increases because you wouldnt find a gun nowadays that costs the same as a club so therefore the new things have to be more expensive so people need to get more money
 
Here's some ideas:

Ok about the farming, lumbering etc:

Create a price for farming, lumbering etc. Here my proposal:

Farming: Requires a Grassland, plains, or floodplains tile. Price: 400g per tile
Lumbering: Requires a Jungle or Forest tile. Price: Jungle: 600g
Forest: 400g
Mining: Requires a mountain tile. Price: 500g
FishingRequires a coastal/lake tile. Price: 400g

I also recommended once some tiles open up the RPG grabs them and starts up a lumbering, farming etc. places.

Also here's away to keep money from going into a blackhole:

Mix the RPG more with the Goverment. Give each Department/office or whatever money. The money that business's lose on taxes goes to the departments account. The departments can then use that money to hire professional polling people or hire to people to work on something etc.

And another idea:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

The_J
New Civ7 default style
2 3
Replies
58
Views
3K
Civinator
Civinator
S
The Market Line (UPDATED for 1/1/2025)
Replies
2
Views
589
PiR
PiR
Lazy sweeper
Civ 3 = Chess. Set standard rules. Where is true innovation?
Replies
8
Views
605
Lazy sweeper
Lazy sweeper
V
Fireside chat with Andrew Frederiksen
2 3
Replies
47
Views
2K
Verified_Confection_Being
V
P
  • Locked
Goodbye Civ, and thanks for the memories
4 5 6
Replies
108
Views
8K
The_J
The_J
Back
Top Bottom