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[Religion and Revolution]: Music

Discussion in 'Civ4Col - Religion and Revolution' started by raystuttgart, Nov 18, 2011.

  1. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Hi guys,

    since Religion and Revolution is already a real mega size project,
    I am thinking about even setting up our own background music for atmospherical reasons.
    (Currently this is basically only dreaming.)

    Intro-Music
    Game-Background Music
    Event-Music
    ...

    I am thinking about music in style like
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    this or
    ...
    (Simple but melodic. A little dramatic and maybe even a little sad. Definitely not too modern sounding.)

    These are just examples of the style I am looking for.
    (Of course we cannot use these directly.)

    I know many songs that I believe would fit and create the atmosphere I would like.

    Problem:
    We cannot simply put them into a download without breaking laws (Copyrights)
    even if we are not making money with this mod.

    Does anybody know good atmosperhical music that could be used without risking to be sued ? :dunno:
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 18, 2011
    #1
  2. colonialfan

    colonialfan Warlord

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    Hi Ray,

    I love the Last of the Mohican pieces at the end. One of my all time favorite films and soundtracks. As for music that fits that era and creates the atmosphere we are looking for that is not protected by copyright laws, that's a tough one. I've got some contacts at Colonial Williamsburg in Va. I'll see if they can suggest anything.

    I'll keep you posted.
     
    colonialfan, Nov 20, 2011
    #2
  3. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    I know, but I think it is in all of our interest to not get into legal problems.

    Great. :)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 21, 2011
    #3
  4. Robert Surcouf

    Robert Surcouf Civ4Col Modder

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    I agree... I like your music...
    My question is probably stupid, but what can we use, and what can't we use?

    Can we use classical music? (e.g. Vivaldi) or not?
    What's the problem with Carmina Burana? It isn't "old" enough?

    Sorry, I really don't know anything about copyrights ant so on...:(
     
    Robert Surcouf, Nov 21, 2011
    #4
  5. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Great. :)
    I want the players to really get drawn into our mod and get shivers when they hear the background music.

    Actually that is no stupid question. :)
    It is pretty hard to answer.

    There are 3 major aspects about Copyrights:

    1. Copyrights of the original actor / author / componist --> 70 years after death
    2. Copyrights of the performing actor --> 30 to 50 years after "release"
    3. Copyrights of the publishing company --> ?

    With classical music:

    1. --> not problematic ususally, because authors have lived much much earlier
    2. --> ususally not problematic because they do not tend to have lawyers searching
    3. --> eventually a danger

    Generally classical music is a lot less dangerous, than modern.
    But putting it into a download would still not be legal without:

    Allowance of performing actor and allowance of publisher.

    or

    We continue looking for music that is explicitely shared to public without copyrights.
    (Some actors do that.)

    I really do not want to take any risks here.
    (As small as they might be.)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 21, 2011
    #5
  6. Robert Surcouf

    Robert Surcouf Civ4Col Modder

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    So what? We record on our own Vivaldi or Wagner? :lol:
     
    Robert Surcouf, Nov 21, 2011
    #6
  7. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    That is solution number 3. :)
    (We create our own music. Or somebody else does for us.)

    :band:
    (Religion and Revolution would also be a cool band name ... :lol:)

    Actually one of my former school mates is componist today. :think:

    But I guess, we continue trying to find legal music.

    It is just as colonialfan said:
    Hints from other modders and community would greatly help.

    By the way, everything in other Firaxis games like Civ4, Pirates, ... should be ok.
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 21, 2011
    #7
  8. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    I have just officially asked to artists for permissions to use one or more of their songs.
    Let's see what happens. :)

    Edit:
    Now it is 4 artists I have contacted. :)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 21, 2011
    #8
  9. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Great News:

    René Osmanczyk (a German componist) has granted us permission to use his music in this mod. :woohoo:
    (He is the first to answer my permission requests.)

    His music is really fantastic and very atmospheric. :bowdown:

    One example of his work.
    Another example of his work.
    One more example of his work.
    The last example for now. :)

    Important:

    He has granted permission to this mod only !
    If you should want to use his music yourself, you need to contact him yourself.

    I do not know how the others see it, but I myself feel extremely honored to officially be allowed to use music of such quality in our mod.
    (I do not know of any other CivCol mod that has ever done something like that.)

    @Robert and colonialfan:
    I will put together a list of his songs I would like to use this weekend and put it on our Subversion-Server.
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 22, 2011
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  10. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    The next permission of usage has been given.

    It is a classical theme (from Mozart): Requiem of a Dream (Summer Ouverture)
    The interprets (orchestra) giving us permissions to use their recording for this piece wants to be unnamed.

    Thanks a lot.

    Edit:
    I reread the mail, there might be some other legal things to clarify except the permissions of the interprets ...
    (Not sure if we can use this now, but I will find out.)

    Edit 2:
    No it is no problem, we could use Mozart's Requiem of a Dream (Summer Ouverture) played by the orchestra which we asked. :)
    The other legal stuff would have been valid, if Mozart would have died less than 70 years ago or if the
    music would be taken from some kind of CD or anything else that was sold.
    (This is not the case for us here.)

    Only the interprets had to be asked in our case.

    • Don't take songs from any medium that is / was sold without asking the publisher ! (We don't.)
    • If you want to use music from living componists or interprets you must ask. (We did.)
    • It they are dead less than 70 years, you must ask the responsible organisations. (Not necessary in this case.)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 22, 2011
    #10
  11. colonialfan

    colonialfan Warlord

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    Great job Ray :goodjob:

    I listened to the samples of René Osmanczyk's work you provided and was blown away. This composer is fantastic. Just from the samples, there is plenty of music that fits with what we are trying to accomplish. I say let's go with René.

    Just as a side note, one of my contacts from Colonial Williamsburg got back to me and recommended that we aim to use some period music of the time, the more obscure the better. The advantages is that the composer has been dead for a long time, so we don't need permission and the more obscure the piece the less likely is it to be copyrighted or belong to any publishing house. Unfortunately, she could not give any examples but said she would try to dig something up. Personally, after hearing René's music I think anything she might suggest, if we use it should only be a soundbite or filler.
     
    colonialfan, Nov 22, 2011
    #11
  12. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Thanks. :)
    However, I am still in contact with other musicians and componists, too.
    But this simply takes time.

    Absolutely agree. :)

    Yes, René Osmanczyk's music is fantastic. :thumbsup:
    His music will be used for most of our background music.

    But give me some time to finish up talks with the other musicians and componists. ;)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 23, 2011
    #12
  13. Robert Surcouf

    Robert Surcouf Civ4Col Modder

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    Yes! Good job indeed Ray! :goodjob:
    I've listened to René's music, and I like it?

    However, It's quite unfortunate you haven't booked him for the next ten mods we're going to do together. :lol:

    [offtopic] This is kind of awkward...
    I think you've got something wrong Colonialfan... René is a "he" and not a "she" if I'm correct.
    By the way, his first name (René) is quite frenchy! Renée is the feminine version, in French that is!
    Sorry about that!
     
    Robert Surcouf, Nov 24, 2011
    #13
  14. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    When colonialfan says "she", he is refering to his contact from Colonial Williamsburg (not René). :)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 24, 2011
    #14
  15. Robert Surcouf

    Robert Surcouf Civ4Col Modder

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    Oh my ... :blush:
    I must learn how to read again... Sorry !
     
    Robert Surcouf, Nov 24, 2011
    #15
  16. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Any suggestions for music from the community ? :)
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 24, 2011
    #16
  17. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Hi guys,

    I have been told about a platform named Jamendo with music that we could use without legal problems.
    (Possible because we are not commercial. Of course giving credits.)

    A while ago, I have searched Jamendo and found some stuff I liked. :)

    Here is a selection of stuff that I found:
    (I just did a pre-sighting, often listening into it only a few seconds.)

    Spoiler :

    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/729308
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/25218
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/821047
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/57859
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/461104
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/674462
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/169203
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/19978
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/816194
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/362638
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/track/477307
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/59800
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/60869
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/92216
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/52162
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/45473
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/26621
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/50098
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/101584
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/3480
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/3495
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/68337
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/85641
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/97922
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/85233
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/78275
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/95667
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/78477
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/99940
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/81080
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/100899
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/20443
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/36868
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/51894
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/37134
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/98002
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/42878
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/35660
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/38507
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/90381
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/21250
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/39117
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/45308
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/98473
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/85643
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/84480
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/69247
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/81906
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/40538
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/70534
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/93317
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/83766
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/62445
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/16649
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/73275
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/56298
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/60748
    http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/38862


    I am sorry but I did not really have time to listen to these thoroughly. :(
    (I would rather spend the spare time I can invest for this project with programming our features.)

    Could somebody do the thorough sighting ?
    Finding the good ones, sorting out the others and putting together a list (of links).
     
    raystuttgart, Nov 30, 2011
    #17
  18. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    I picked 19 Songs of René Osmanczyk for our Soundtrack.

    They will be added to the playlist.
    (The original music of Vanilla will still be played, too.)
     
    raystuttgart, Dec 16, 2011
    #18
  19. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Did anybody check the music here ?
    (That is stuff we could use.)

    Actually it might be better if we simply include only the great music of René Osmanczyk. :thumbsup:
    (That will probably be enough. It does not make sense to put too much music into our mod.)

    We should probably better invest our time in modding and not in searching more music.
    (It is a game after all and not a "best of"-mix. :) )
     
    raystuttgart, Dec 16, 2011
    #19

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