Religion

[STMO]

The more I play the more I am in doubt, when it comes to making religion choices! Examples:
1. Pantheon: I normally goes for Fertility Rites (+10 growth) but consider God of the Forge (+25% production early age units) or Good of the open sky (+1 Culture on Pastures) or Divine Spark (Bonus on Specialists)
2. Spreding religion: Somehow I feel that the passive spread is very slow. I don't fully understand the mechanics. If I take Scripture (Religious spread from adjacent city pressure is 25 % stronger, boosted to 50 % with Printing Press), what kind of differen will that make?
3. Order of building and using religious units: I normally go for 2x missionaries, and then follow with apostles. The first apostle I spread my religion until there is one left and then I use him as defensive unit. The next 2 apostles I evangelize. Later I start making defensive units.
4. Which is best: Defender of the Faith (+10 combat near friendly cities following religion) or Crusade (+10 combat near foreign cities following religion) or Scripture (+25%/50% pressure)?
5. I tend to have a problem when typically Spain suddenly at once attack with 8 apostles together in a Group. Maybe I should look into which countries that have this tendency and then have a "defensive line" (inquisitors) towards these countries borders?
6. What is the most efficient use of Gurus (they have 3 uses)?
I look forward to hear from you. Thank you!

 

[Victoria]

1. No question, just a statement, goddess of the harvest and earth goddess are best but often gone, god of the forge is great for chopping both others are also great, especially when going for religion.
2. They spread 1,2 or 4 points per turn amd 50% with printing... compared to a missionaries 200 in one turn, passive spread is weak in this game, even with moksha.
3. Different ways to skin this cat depending on if you delay your religion or not. The key thing is missionaries are much cheaper and just as effective against a non religious city but pretty poor against a religious while an apostle is great.
4. It depend on where you do most of your fighting
5. It does depend on style, a group of apostles with the right promotions on a holy site will do great, or let them convert then use inquisitors to flip back. Inquisitors are very cheap defensive units and a must have on high levels. They are also great for taking a city then converting it.... or at least wasting what was there.
6. Not buying them is the most efficient use.

 

[STMO]

Thank you Victoria, you are a true master.
1. Aha -I see and I agree! Magnus the Governor combined with Goddess of the harvest is a powerfull combination.
2. Aha! But when 1? When 2? When 4? I guess it depends of your Holy City (maybe 4?) and I guess the 2 is a Holy Site and the 1 is No Holy Site?
3. Agree
4. I am not sure! If on an offensive you can not expect to have your religion in front of your Army but in best case following with your Army, ie. I seems to prefer Defender of the Faith!
5. Yes, I need to learn better to use Inquisitors.
6. I think it may be more complex than that.

 

[RealHuhn]

4. I feel like -30% faith cost for missionaries/apostles is the best, especially if you take beliefs that benefit from religious followers in foreign cities and level up Moksha for the boosted Apostles. It saves tons of faith and as Victoria said, passive spread is very weak. The combat bonus is nice but it doesn't really help you win the game unless you go for Domination victory.
6. A guru is quite useful in mid/late game when you have a couple of Apostles with +20% combat strength. Place a group of them and a Guru right at the heart of a foreign religion, kill all religious units and convert all cities around you. Let the guru heal all apostles at once so you never have to retreat. Support that push with a couple of apostles with the "Eliminate foreign religion" promotion and you can convert a full civ in no time and get a huge boost to culture/science/gold depending on your other beliefs. Also great for triggering the emergency to defend a converted holy city.

 

[Victoria]

2. Normal city=1, holy site =2, holy city=4

4. Crusade is only useful if you convert before you attack, you use this when you have large amounts of faith expected.

5. My favourite unit

6. My least favourite, one or 2 behind a strong attack team perhaps but with so many RV strategies it’s not really needed. I guess when you have limited faith or you need a high attrition factor but the AI is as bad at RV wars so I tend not to bother now because they just hand around not doing a lot.

 

[STMO]

Interesting! That raises a new question: What is a strong attack team? As I mentioned at the start (5) then 8 apostles are really scary - and combined with 2 Inquisitors and 1 Guru there is really power behind. First kill all defense, then use the one that remove most of the pressure from the Holy City, then take one by one.
If the AI learns this really well, then Humans will be forced to use Religion and the game will be more balanced.

 

[Victoria]

Interesting! That raises a new question: What is a strong attack team? As I mentioned at the start (5) then 8 apostles are really scary - and combined with 2 Inquisitors and 1 Guru there is really power behind. First kill all defense, then use the one that remove most of the pressure from the Holy City, then take one by one.

Attack teams are about taking out the enemy and then it’s about having more than 2 debaters and having enough supporting team to flank well. 4-6 converters (like orator) and a martyr or 2, whatever comes up. Every flanking value limits the damage to the debater.

Having a fast military presence nearby is a must to counter DOW situations and possibly make the most of them, even scouts will do.
Your inquisitors are very weak out of home borders so worse than a guru in your attack team.
Naturally your attack team needs to spend all but one charge sooner rather than later unless there is a specific target. Having a martyr makes it more interesting and dynamic.

Chaplain, heathen and proselytiser I would leave out of such a team using the first 2 for individual tasks or as part of a specialist conversion team protecting the proselytiser with ZOC

An interesting thing is the more a unit is damaged, the less conversion strength it has, not the case with a proselytiser

I do like the promotional mix.

If the AI learns this really well, t

it’s a bit more complicated than that. AI strategies are coded fairly well, it’s the more intense tactical side that is tricky.