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Replay #1 Huge Domination by 640 AD [BUFFY]

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Hall of Fame Discussion' started by Seraiel, Nov 30, 2011.

  1. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    Hi everybody :)

    I wanted to start out an "old -> new" series here. Purpose is to show you what I do / did and for you to watch my greatness :D No, really, I suck atm. tbh, and purpose is for me and others to get better and not suck so much.

    The "Replay" has a history in the game of Fifa Manager, where I took some Clubs from the lowest leages to a "Tripple" of Champions League, Championship and Cup wins, sometimes even combined with the World Championship or the European Championship (if I was national trainer at that time) . The "Replay" once went as long as 50 Pages having more than 50k clicks in a forum, which can't be compared to this one, as it mostly consisted out of a handful of fanatic users, I guess it will be very different here, as there is way more knowledge about Civ than about Fifa Manager and there are way more users that can take part in this.

    I will only post games which got accepted in HoF for the moment, and most of them will be on Deity Huge Marathon 17 Civs settings, as that's what I'm trying to achieve atm. I will extensively try to keep my posts interessting for you, and I'm glad for anyone who participates in this series, as I want to learn, and as I will, others will too, and I'm sure this is gonna be a worthwile experience for lots of people, especially myself.

    There has always been only one rule in the Replays, and that is that "'You are all players!" (You won't disagree to that) . You can all say what you want, but try to be constructive instead of destructive. Purpose of this still is for me and others to learn and improve, aswell as to simply have fun with the game, not more, not less. REMEMBER: HAVE FUN!!!


    -----------

    So here are the settings for the first round:


    I (We if someone wants to replay the starting save) play Mr. Imbaness Huanya Capac (remember, I'm still new to Civ and especially Deity and I'm playing for HoF purposes, so surely I pick a "strong leader", but as I will get better with this, I will try out others) .

    Oponements are: Bismark, Cyrus, De Gaulle, Elizabeth, Frederick, Hannibal, Lincoln, Mansa Musa, Joao II, Mehmed II, Napoleon, Peter, Ramsses II, Roosevelt, Suleimann, Victoria, Washington

    Aim of this, was not to take any Leader starting with Mysticism, so I can found Islam (yes, I took choose Religions and I'm a terrorist this time :p) and get a holy City 100% to fund my further warfare. Having a Shrine really helps a lot, and with 17 Civs on a Huge map, chances a low to conquer one, so I took this route.
    Furtheron, I left out any Leader being Protective, as I really tried them with HC, there is no fun in loosing 1/2 of all games because there is a Hills City with dual promoted Archers in it. In addition, I left out Aggressive leaders, as an early DoW can sacrifice the game completely. I certainly chose Mansa to be in the game, as he will always be in them, for being the only leader I know, who will trade Monopoly Techs away, another huge advantage.

    However, some of you might consider this choice of mine "lame", but remember, it's for HoF purposes, so choosing leaders and "making it easy for myself" is perfectly ok, and not choosing Mysticism / PRO / AGG leaders also comes with disadvantages, like having some of the strongest leaders like Hannibal or Elizabeth in it, and AGG leaders aren't that bad either imho. One can easily bribe them against others which is a big advantage, and, if one does know how to deal with them, it's usually another big advantage. It would also have been easier if I had chosen leaders like Ghandi or Justinian instead, but then again, founding an early religion wouldn't have been possible by 100% and then the game would have been a matter of the chance, if I was able to conquer a holy city from the first 3 Civs I'm going to smack into the ground, and I wanted to rule out that chance, as playing Huge Domination takes quite some time. I might however make up another game in time with even easier leaders, to get an even earlier finish date, though that will mean throwing away the majority of games because I simply started in the wrong corner, something which happens to often if playing Huge Pangea with 17 Civs.

    Also in addition, I ruled out Goody Huts, as they seem to help the AI more than oneself. On Deity, AI is starting out with two scouts, HC only has one slow moving Quechua, and I've seen it commonly, that one or two AI's get Writing, BW or even HBR by a Goody Hut early, something being able of changing a whole game. I left in random events, as I don't suppose they're that game changing and they can be quite funny sometimes, as a former MMO player who has played DAoC, Warhammer, AION and RIFT, I like the idea of questing in a strategy game, though I always hated questing in the MMO's and am more the "Grinder" type of person.

    -----------

    Enough of the prelude: Here is the start!


    (Actually, I don't know how to include a picture here as I have no webspace available atm. so I guess you have to scroll down to the attachements to see it) .

    Questions:

    Did I reroll the start? Of course :D There is no need to play with a weak start if attempting for HoF, so of course, this start is good.

    What was I looking for, when creating the start? I was looking mainly for a plain Hills with a forrested plain Hills in the BFC, because that's what you need for the Quechua Rush. Plain hills gives 2 :hammers: and forrested plain hills gives 3 :hammers: so one is able to produce Quechuas in 6T. I tried out other good starts (sometimes I got as much as 5 Gems or something equal to that) but Quechuas every 7-8T is already luck dependent, as one can only attack the first target with 5-6 Quechuas instead of the 7 needed ones. A plain hill with a forrested plain Hill is a 100% safe way to get enough Quechuas for the first target, which will again be 7. 2 for every Archer he might have +1 for being extraordinaryly unlucky.

    What was I also looking for when trying to achieve a "good" start: Mainly I looked for a riverside Gold or Wine on which I can settle, getting me the plain hills production bonus +3 :commerce: . Better would have been a Marble or Stone hill, but they are so extremely rare, that this start simply doesn't have one. I also looked for a 2nd LUX that can be worked early as Maintenance is a big problem with HC, conquering so many cities and having so many units. This start has Gems, which might be even better than a 2nd Gold due to the additional luxury ressource. In addition the start has enough food, so that the city can become a giant commerce city, ok, a dry corn + a FP isn't the best you can get, but nobody won't argue against this start being decent.
    If the start is underaverage or ueber with HC again is decided later, as it depends on what land you conquer, besides whom you start and other things like how many Quechuas do you loose which is RNG. This start fulfills the basics of having enough food, a plain hill to settle on, a forrested plain hill to be worked early and a 2nd LUX for City and Troop Maintenance.

    -----------

    What did I do? Move the Warrior to NW to go scouting, as it was clear for me to settle on the Gold. Great City of Cuzco founded 3985 BC working the forrested plain Hills and going full Quechua production of 7 (!) Quechuas. I researched Meditation, again, remember the plan to make Cuzco the holy City of Islam and a supercommerce Capital.

    -----------

    For the next part I have to reactivate my webspace, as I don't want to spoiler this map for anyone who wants to play it and I don't know how to include pictures in the spoiler-text with using the attachement function of this fourm, guess I'll need to link it from an URL.

    The starting save is attached, and there is more to follow soon, be prepared :D

    Till then, Seraiel
     

    Attached Files:

  2. GGracchus

    GGracchus Tribune of Rome

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    :eek: That's a sweet start. I'm eagerly subbing to see if I can learn something out of this. I could never get 640 AD domination on Deity...
     
  3. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    Thx :)

    And you will laugh at me when you will see the flaws I had in early game and think "if 640 AD is possible with such flaws, I will go for 640 BC!" ;)

    My webspace will be up again tomorrow, then I will continue the story very fast, as it's already played till the end, so it will only take me the time of writing and making the screens, not actual playing which is the most part.
     
  4. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    The difficulty here for most, including me if I have time for this one, will be adapting to the settings and adjusting for the intended VC. Domination is different on mara than normal, and different on huge than standard. Optimal unit choice can change, timings change, etc. To truly be competitive one must have enough practice with the settings or have an inordinate skill advantage.
     
  5. MarigoldRan

    MarigoldRan WARLORD

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    Can't seem to get the save working even with the Buffy mod.
     
  6. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    I'm sure you have a great chance of an even earlier Domination Victory, as I made lots of faults in this game. To help you adjust to the settings without you asking questions, I can only say that with 17 Civs, space is really rare, so make sure you conquer some people fast and after that pump out even more Settlers if your economy can afford it. Marathon gives you a lot time to scout and move units and the Quechua won't get outdated as fast, even at 2000 BC which is 1 million of turns on Marathon it's possible to conquer someone with it if you choke the horses / copper. You do not have to worry about an early DoW because everybody is peaceful and once you have the Shrine, most things do not matter any more. Diplomacy though can be a pain in the ass, be prepared to be asked by several Civs every round (!) to stop trading with or declare war on, once the Religions are spread and hate develops, so make sure to spread your Religion well (if you go for that approach) and get your neighbours pleased, cause there are a lot of hidden warmongers in this game.

    Works fine with my PC / Civ version. Do you have the latest Patch + the latest BUFFY and did you do whats told in the installation explanation? There are some steps vor Vista and other users one has to perform to get BUFFY running properly.
     
  7. Mylene

    Mylene Deity

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    Hall of Fame could be renamed to Hall of cheese :D
    I would feel silly playing this, just to be on top of some ranking that isn't connected to playing skills ~~
    It leaves out every aspect that makes Deity a challenge, normally.
     
  8. Archbob

    Archbob Ancient CFC Guardian

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    How the heck do you guys get these starts? How many times do you have to regen the map?
     
  9. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    You wanted to stop making comments about that Mylene, as you actually play games with superior knowledge to the blind first-attempts HoF players play :p Playing a Huge Domination against 17 AI's is a challenge, you will see, even with Mr. Cheese for Hall of Cheese with 2 Cheesecakes in the BFC :p Join this game, see if you can beat it earlier than me, you actually have to, cause I sucked so bad at that game, I'm only posting it because it was my 1st successful attempt at HoF and I will make a writeup of every successful attemp.

    I will have to guess there, but for this start? Maybe 100-200 times, not more, surely not less. I had even better starts though, like tripple riverside gold and +8 Food in the BFC, but I lost them due to too risky play (if one wants to dominate early, one has to take risks) or bad luck like loosing 9 Quechuas against 3 Archers or if all enemy cities were placed on hills. That's the good thing about this start...

    Spoiler :

    ... there are lots of Civs near you, which is bad, optimum is 3 near rest far giving one victims to conquer and after that room to peacefully expand, but at least, noone settled on a Hill this time :)
     
  10. Mylene

    Mylene Deity

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    I do? I didn't know anything about Dirk's game, Isa, etc...
    you are starting to become boring, and in fact i won't comment your posts anymore if that is what you wish. But stop spreading false rumors, thanks.
     
  11. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    No worries, this is a submitted game. No other attempts on this map will be eligible, nor will they count. Feel free to destrollish him if you think you can do it and your name won't take any spots ;).

    Hall of cheese my foot. The challenge in HoF is to out-play the other humans. Beating the AI is only a tiny stepping stone on that path. If you think HoF is all about cheese play, why don't you try beating some of the top submitters in HoF challenger or beating some of the deity times/gauntlets? There is a reason that the HoF crowd is competitive in games like SGOTM (though plastic ducks has been pretty dominant lately, the HoF crowd has been close) and players known mostly for play on that side of things have taken XOTM gold medals/etc (XOTM is one of the best pure-competition settings in existence, and Rusten's recent dominance there proves he's a top player...).

    Although it has some very poor settings allowed/disallowed in general play, HoF is nevertheless a legit competition and the better players *usually* do win.

    Anyway I think that most here who look down on HoF would struggle to make a serious dent in the tables, and would be hard-pressed to take all the #1 slots in the challenger series. Some of that is due to repetition, but a lot of it is that there is more skill than implied.
     
  12. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    Omg, there's a smiley behind the sentence... Actually I cannot even know if you look at the spoilers, or if you reload in ceratain situations, or whatever, actually I don't even care... All there is, is that you always start to belittle me and put yourself over me, perhaps you should think about that, but I guess that's just your sense of humor and I guessed you were negging. That was why I negged back and you get totally grave about it, that was neither my aim nor was it to stop you from making any comments about my posts, I like anybody who plays, I don't care how, purpose of playing is to have fun, everybody may have his / her fun the way he / she wants, be free, do what you want, but think one minute about what I said.
     
  13. Mylene

    Mylene Deity

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    Omg..smiley or not, you said i play with knowing the map.
    That is a lie, you can make it look like a joke now, but we all know what you ment.
    And i also don't reload...who do you think you are?

    You are actually trying to put ppl like AZ down who play a map they already know for fun, making a video out of it. It's not me with the issues here, you keep arguing with guys like Ahcos who says Immortal rushes are hard to pull of on Deity, then "proof" him wrong by doing it on Marathon.
    Then you get offended when someone points out that you are not playing the standard settings for your cases, "belittling" you while we are just putting things into a perspective.
    Anyways iam done with this silly arguing, you are right it was truely my fault to make any commens about it.
     
  14. Manco Capac

    Manco Capac Friday,13 June,I Collapse

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    ^
    I like how you overlooked TMIT comment to storm Seraiel and just hammer more nails into him...:o
     
  15. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    @TMIT

    as I found out HoF and SGOTM are great reminders about your own skillz ;-).

    One thing really annoys me at HoF though and that is the allowance of events and huts. That really skews the comparison.

    But enjoying the new challenges/gauntlets without them. Well the challenges...the settings lately are not that inspiring...everything quick speed or no vassals or some other not so nice thingys...makes me not want to play.

    The Minor 133 otoh... oh boy so much fun ;-) submitted already 3 attempts, the last one (1810) being by 150 years better then first one (1961)...
    Never thought that Enviromentalism and forest preserves could have such great use...At least for that i think it was worth the experiment...
    I would advise anyone to attempt that Minor, has high educational value imo.
     
  16. Mylene

    Mylene Deity

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    Mind your own business.
    TmiT likes to provocate people, i like him (a lot actually) but he is no angel so i don't feel like a i have to comment everything he writes to justify myself.

    There are a lot of things wrong with this forum, i have to be super careful with what i write, while others can rant and blame as they want. Maybe cos iam female, it's especially fun to get on my back isn't it.
    Well i don't need this i can tell you that much, so i'll take a long break and play my games just for myself again. HF
     
  17. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    Reading this, I won't post what I just wanted to post, but simply say "cool down, nobody is against you".
     
  18. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    Ok, as my webspace is online again, I can continue the story :) I'm not so used to Spoiler-Tags, but will try my best :)

    Here are the the years 4000 BC until roughly 2000 BC:

    Spoiler :


    While researching Meditation and building the 7 Quechuas which are needed for the 1st target I went exploring...


    Spoiler :




    As you can see we have coast to the south, which is good, as starting in the middle always makes diplomacy even more difficult. To the west we have Cyrus, in the further west which you can't see is Peter, and to the east we have Mansa and Washington who is in the northeast. I was able to reach both coasts, the western one aswell as the eastern one, and there are four Civs. Due to maintenance reasons it's only possible to conquer up to three, so the first plan is to conquer Cyrus, cause he has a forrested plains hill in the inner BFC (available without borderpop) . I need that forrested plains hill as I want to switch the production site. Cuzco shall only produce the 7 Quechuas for Cyrus, after that Persepolis shall continue the production for Peter and Moscow and Persepolis shall produce the Quechuas for Washington. Purpose of this is to construct SH in Cuzco as it gives the earliest great Prophet points available, after that Cuzco shall directly continue with the Oracle giving it even more great Prophet points, and once Cuzco has a Shrine, it will run 3 Priest specialists to create another great Prophet to bulb Theology. I want to ignore Mansa as his Skirmishers are decent defenders against my Quechuas, and because Mansa is the only AI willing to trade monopoly techs, so I wanna keep him alive if possible, with as less land as possible.

    As you can also see, there is enough food on this map to found several other cities, and there is lots of silk, which will make a great tradegood and get us all the ressources we want. There is also Stone and Marble, which will give us the chance at any world wonder. Land is really decent, only thing being there aren't any additional luxury ressources to fund our empire early, besides the ones you already saw in the starting screen, but that's ok.

    Another thing you can see is that I didn't explore up into the jungle in the north, as it's normally not worth the while. Jungle cities take ages to develop, getting IW is the first thing but chopping the jungles takes forever, and I wanna have good land early, therefor, even Washington is only interessting for choking Mansa.

    I forgot: Cuzco is working the forrested plains hill, but you should have know that. Tactic in Quechuarush is to stop growth to get Quechuas every 6 turns.





    It's 3505 BC, and 6 Quechuas are rdy, enough to make an attack.

    Spoiler :


    AI rarely has 3 Archers in a city at that time, actually I've only seen it once by Bismark or Napoleon, which are some hidden Warmongers, but Cyrus certainly is none of them. I make sure to steal a worker which is very easy in this case, as one can easily tell where he could appear. Early Workers build Farms, Mines or Pastures. Cyrus has no BW, he can't at that time and if he had we would have been told so and would have attacked him with a different tactic. He can't chop the forrests, so there are only 3 spots he could enhance. I've marked them on this Screen for you:



    You see, I had Quechuas in all positions if a Worker would appear and only waited for the magical number of 6 Quechuas to be rdy. Forget the 7 I wrote off at the start, that's what you need when you're playing by the guide and attack the first Civ at 3310 when it grows to size 4 normally. Earlier is better imho, as chances for a 3rd Archer are way lower and we still want to conquer Peter and Washington, we'd better be fast. 6 is definately enough for the first victim, and if I would have been terribly unlucky and lost too many Quechuas, I still could have produced some more for Pasagarde, as after a Workersteal, AI normally produces another worker for as long as the Cities are protected. If you don't know, watch the tiles a City is working, if it's working more Food than Hammers it's producing a Worker or tries to grow, if you're unsure, choke the production heavy tiles.

    Its 3460 BC: Islam is founded in Cuzco and Quechuas are moving into attacking positions. Make sure to choke the best tiles of the city, especially the production ones like the forrested plains hill. We don't want a 3rd Archer in that city.





    Persepolis falls with two lost Quechuas on side of the Incans. These are normal loss rates for attacking Archers with Quechuas, as a Quechua only gets an 18% Chance against a fortified Archer, if it's a 20% non-hills city like this one. That is also, why 6-7 is the magical number for the 1st target, having two cities with two Archers each at that time.

    Perspolis continues the Quechua production, with it's size and the plains hill it can pump out Quechuas even faster than Cuzco, and Troops move into position for Pasargadae, which is still size 1, and never was bigger, so I decide to wait. Either, Pasagardae is producing another Worker, then I will wait till he appears and after that attack and accept autoraze, as there is a slim time limit, or it tries to grow. You can see on the screenshot that again, I choke the production tiles, so that no further Archer can appear.



    3235 Pasagardae grows to size 2 and one turn later it falls. This time, I'm lucky as iirc I had no losses, but Pasagardae had no cultural defense and I was attacking with already Cover promoted Archers. Know, it's always better to attack with unpromoted Archers if a city has 20% cultural, as they can get to lvl 3 with a single attack, but if a city has no cultural defense, take your single promoted Quechuas from the attack before that, as they will get lvl 3 then or the ones attacking after them will get Cover, for the case the first Cover ones die, so you basically can only win, not loose. Better to have the chane for two rambo Quechuas with a backup of 2 Cover Quechuas than possibly 4 Cover Quechuas for which one has no need.

    Research went to Mining after Meditation, and Cuzco is still producing SH, but now, with the Corn having come online, it tries to grow first and is not working the forrested plain hills any more, but the corn instead. SH is usually constructed between 2800 BC and 2400 BC, and I really ran some math there, and letting the city grow and after that working two production tiles like the plains forrest + the forrested plains hill were equally fast, of course with a size 2 city being better than a size 1 city, cause it could work the gems instantly after SH would be complete. If I'd had missed SH, it wouldn't have been bad either for the Failgold, at least HC doesn't need easy culture as he gets culture from Granaries, and Failgold is awesome, as you will see.

    1st Target down, everything developing as planned.



    3070 Ramesses founds Confucianism, a little late, but remember, we have no Mysticism starting Civs in the game. In the meanwhile, Islam has spread to by the river, which is good, as Pasagardae is connected by roads to Persepolis which is connected to a better river, giving Religion more chances to spread.

    By this time, I make one of the biggest flaws in the whole game, by researching AH. I thought, I'd need it to get to writing, forgetting that I was gonna go for Priesthood which would also unlock writing... Too bad, but decisions can't be changed in a HoF attemp.

    I send out 4 Quechuas to scout Peter and 1 Quechua who shall scout the jungle to the north, to see who is sitting there. 2995 BC they make a gamechanging discovery:

    Spoiler :




    A Pasture without Animals in it? Peter has Horses in the BFC!!! "All Quechuas move into attacking positions!" "All Quechuas?" "No, just the Cover promoted ones, we actually can only afford 5 troops being out of borders without paying maintenance and we need the ones, that can fight on open field. All other Quechuas shall remain on the outer border of Persepolis until we have 9 of them, which are enough for the 2nd attack!" "Aye Sir!"

    2905: The Troops are in position. Again, I wanted to conflict maximum damage to Peter in the attack and steal as many workers as possible, forcing him to produce new ones instead of more Archers, so I took my time. Look again how I positioned the Quechuas, there is at least 1 at every spot a Worker could appear, and there are more where the Archers protecting the Workers are. Don't be too afraid that the AI will produce a Chariot, if non-aggressive-AI's are in peacemode, they normally produce Settlers, Workers and Archers. Wait till you are in a fine position to attack but don't wait too long, you don't wanna throw down the gauntlet, don't you?





    Peter looses two workers, which will help our empire very much, and he looses two Archers. Chances for a Cover promoted Quechua on open field are like 95%, even unpromoted ones have 80%+ chances. It's the City Defense Bonus and especially the Hills Defense Bonus that makes Archers hard Units, on open field they are Quechua breakfast. I actually ed up again at that part, as you can see on the screen with the low health Quechua. I wanted to max out promotions and didn't think AI would attack, if there were only two Archers in St. Petersburg, and I wanted the Cover Quechuas on the Horses as I expected an AI attack there, well, I was wrong. Next turn AI attacked the low-health Quechua with an Archer from St. Petersburg, leaving only 1 Archer in the city, and the Quechua of course died, but of course, I payed him back by destroying his wounded Archer on a hill, so it was 3:1 for me up till this point, a good ratio. Next move the Cover Quechuas move onto the Horses, one move after that they pillage it to be free at moving again, Peter had no chance to build a Chariot :)

    After attacking all those Archers, some Quechuas had to heal, so at 2845, only 4 Quechuas were able to reach Moscow. Moscow had 2 Archers again, 4 Quechuas are barely enough for that, 5 would be better, but as they are promoted, I take the risk. I attack with the unpromoted ones first, as they would get lvl 3 again, and guess what happens: Though only having 18% chances both of them win, Moscow is taken without losses and I got two new Rambo Quchuas! Wouhou!

    2785, St. Petersburg grows well behaved to Size 2, 1 turn later it again falls without any losses. Well, it had only 1 Archer defending it, and all my Quechuas were promoted at that time, having like 40%+ chances, and I've already lost fights with equal chances in this round, where there is bad luck, there comes luck.

    Shortly after that, the newly settled city Novgorod also falls without any losses and I Raze it, because it sucks so bad. I attacked with the Rambo Quechuas having Cover + CR promotion as I wanted to make a lvl 3 Unit for HE, they had like 70% Chance on the city without any culture, and even if I had lost one, there would have been 4-5 others available to kill the single Archer in it. Just one thing to moving Settlers: Do not attack them! I don't know what happens with AI if you attack their settlers, but AI actually enrages if you do and will throw everything at you that it has!

    As you can also see on the pictures, there is Hannibal, and it's possible to completely choke him with borderpops from St. Petersburg and Persepolis, leaving him with mostly Tundra land, guess there won't be heard much from him, will there?



    2725 SH completes, and 1 turn later, 2nd target Peter is down, with his last city giving a pity of only 19g, guess he was just a poor fellow :( Remember: I've researched Meditation -> AH so I neither have roads, nor have cottages, all I have is, oh, 60g and I'm at -2g with 0% research? "I need commerce! Lets go Fishing... Oh noez! We don't have enough money to research Fishing, we're stuck! What can we do?"

    I ed up, and there is only one chance to get out of this. Attack a third Civ fast, a Civ that has lots of money. Remember: 2nd or at least 3rd tech on Deity Huge Marathon has to be a commercial one with HC, having 2 Lux doesn't pay for an empire of that size. Otherwise, you have to skip SH and go for extensive Failgold, but we don't wanna do that in this scenario.

    Spoiler :


    "Hey, Mansa is know for having lots of Money!" "Yer, but we wanted to keep him alive to choke him and techtrade with him." "Do we have a choice?" "Ahm... Actually we are loosing so much money, even at 0% Research, we can be happy, if our troops even make it to Mansa, no way they would reach Washington Sir!" ""%§=(/?§$=)§%"§% Attack Mansa with all Force! Rob every cent he has hidden under his pillow! Salvage his pallace and let his people work overtime for us, they're known for being good with money!"

    Thats the problem with early HC rushes. I'm paying 8 on troop maintenance and 17 (!) on city maintenance, leaving me at the -2g / turn at 0% Research. One normally has to use Failgold or get economy techs, but I couldn't, as I made the misdecision to go for AH instead of sth. usefull like Fishing, or Masonry, or Pottery, or whatever!

    I'm planning the moves. I let the healthy Quechuas move first and try to keep them in borders, so at least unit supply is low (remember, only 5 Troops out of Borders on Deity Huge), and when they reach Cuzco's borders, I move the not even fully healed ones after them. Note: I can't even let some units heal, as I wouldn't have simply gotten the time and money for that, all troops had to arrive as quickly as possible with the highest health status as possible. I work every commerce tile there is, not being much to be excact, but 2450 all Troops make it to reach the Borders of Mansa Musas Capital Timbuktu. While Cuzco is building an Islamic Monestary, yes, no Oracle till now as I still went AH instead of something usefull allowing me Priesthood. It's only 10 Quechuas against the fearful Skirmishers of Mansa, which can be compared to Archers on hill cities, one needs 3 per Defender.



    Timbuktu falls with only 3 losses, due to the high promotions of the Quechuas and lots of luck, and... AND... 120g :D

    2390 BC: Djenne falls, again 3 Losses, 130g and Gustavus Adolphus, our first GG :D I'm researching Fishing + Priesthood at 100% with -40g / turn, but it's enough, Mansa was really a good target till now. I have to produce new troops for his last city though, and decide for 9 Quechuas for the 3 Skirmishers in it, should be enough, shouldn't it? Production takes place in the newly conquered cities, as they are decent with having things like mined Pigs.

    2320: I settle Gustavus Adolphus in Moscow, as it has the highest production capacity of all cities imho and shall become the HE City.

    2310: Hannibal converts to Confucianism, that's just what we needed, a neighbour with another religion than ours :rolleyes:

    2280: Pyramids are built! What? At that time? I later discover that Bismark was the Maniac, sacrificing everything to get them.

    2230: Joao converts to Confucianism, again, not good, and not good either, Lizzy reaches Alphabet first. She's just a strong financial Techer and must have had a good start.

    Again 2230: The Attack on Mansas last City, "Kumbi Saleh" fails, from 9 Quechuas 8 die horribly and only 1 survives, only 1 Skirmisher is killed :o Now you know how hard Skirmishers can be if attacking with low-lvl Quechuas, the cities before Kumbi Saleh only went so well, because I had so many Rambo Quechuas, but the newly produced ones didn't even scratch the Skirmishers inside Kumbi Saleh!
    I decide to make peace with Mansa, he is willing to agree with the these words: Now lets go together and slaughter someone else!

    Guess good old Techwhore Mansa is bloodthirstier than I expected. 1 turn after the peace treaty btw he got BW so mainly Slavery, so my attack came in the last minute, one turn later and he would have had twice the Skirmishers in the City, which wouldn't have made a huge difference when it comes to peace negotiations. Guess I was REALLY lucky there.

    Again in 2230 I trade Meditation against Roads with Lizzy, at least, now my workers, who have been busy building unnecessary farms have something to do.

    [/SPOILER)

    That was the early Crusade of Seraiel, Leader of mighty Inca. 7 Cities were conquered of which 1 was razed, 2 Empires were destroyed and 1 is down to bits and pieces from which it will never ever recover. Later, I will discover, that it was even better that Mansa survived this, be sure to follow also the next posts, as they will get quite interesting. Best of all: Gustavus Adolphus was born and will work as a Military Instructor in Moscow so I will be able to produce lvl 3 Units!

    At last there are only two things: The Oracle and the big picture. The Oracle is completed in 1960 BC and I take CoL from it, as Lizzy already has Alpha, and I want to trade it. Which trades I make will be in the next post. Just a quick look at the Cities and the overrall developement plan:

    Spoiler :


    The great Prophet will be born in Cuzco in about 40 Turns, so I have to sit there and cut low on Research and Unit Building for not so much time. It is very early due to getting SH + Oracle. I haven't taken a Religion yet, as I don't want to piss of Hannibal before I can build enough units. Religious Situation doesn't look so good, but not so bad either. Our closest Neighbour Hannibal as mentioned is Confucianist, as Ramesses and Joao are too, but we will have mighty Suleimann on our side, who atm. is an Islamist like we will be hopefully. Most of the Civs haven't gotten a Religion yet, so we still have the chance to convert some of them to Islam by building Missionaries from the two Monestaries.

    Two Monestaries? Lets take a look at the Cities:



    Moscow and St. Petersburg will both be production cities, as they simply have the most Hammer-Tiles. Moscow will get one of the weakest HE Cities I ever had, with actually only 2 Hills, the Horses and a Marble that can be worked, but it still is the best production city imho and with 2 Food Ressources it will be good for whipping. It's a shame, it got the holy city of Judaism when I took CoL as it will never see any money-building but only get a Courthouse, a Barracks, a Stable, and maybe some time a Lighthouse, but not more. St. Petersburg also is incredibly weak as a production city, as it has nearly no food, only 1 grassland Cows, not enough to support the Hills and I consider normal Farms or grassland Forrests as weak tiles.



    In contrast to Moscow and St. Petersburg being weak production cities, Persepolis, Pasargadae and Cuzco though are very strong cities of their kind. Cuzco will first serve as a GP Farm for great Prophets. Later in the game, Persepolis will overtake this task, as there is simply not that much need for great Prophets after the Shrine and the Theology bulb, great Scientiests become more important then. Persepolis, having 4 Food Ressources + Hills to work for building Wonders is supermegaueber, it will become one of the strongest GP-Farms I ever had and will work a ton of Specialists + get many many Wonders.
    Cuzco will then be transformed into a megagiant commerce city, as it already has the shrine making money, so it will get all money buildings, it will be cottaged as soon as I get cottages (I still don't have them at 2000 BC, but working financial coast is fine) like crazy and run as an Oxford + Wallstreet fueled Burocracy Capital.
    Pasagardae having a river will be a decent commerce city and with Cuzco our Missionary Pump.



    As our production Cities are so weak and I intend to go for a Domination Victory as you know already, Timbuktu will become a commerce / whip city as it has much food. Same for Djenne which has also enough food and enough weak tiles that can be whipped away often, so these cities will get cottages + Libraries + Barracks.



    These are the 4 Cities I want to settle in near time, to get up to a total of 11 Cities, which should be enough to fulfill every purpose. All of them are at quite strong sites, I wonder though why none of these spots were advised by the Civ-Settler.
    Blue is there to get the stone, the dry Rice was the only Food Ressource available in that region, except if I had taken the corn from white, but that would have meant 1 city less, and 11 is already not that much on a Huge Pangea. White, having dual Food + lots of Hills will become a great production site, though it will take time to get rid of all those jungles. Purple has enough Food + good River, so it will get commerce and Green will again be a commerce / production mix-city, getting a Library + a Barracks.

    This leaves us with 3 pure Production Cities, 3 pure commerce cities of which one will be the super-Capital, 1 GP Farm that will later get switched and 4 commerce + production mix cities. After all, the land does look decent, but besides the capital, it's not overly good or something, being the biggest factor in the whole game, but well, this start worked perfectly, I got SH + Oracle which will give me a Shrine if I can hold out long enough, now you have to hold long enough for the next post after having read this WoT :)


    That were the years 4000 BC til 2000 BC!





    If you made it to read the text and enjoyed it, I'm glad. I'm open to any suggestions, any comments, critique, questions, anything. Be prepared for the next post to follow soon, and I will, I promise, comply to your suggestions. Only thing I can't change is what I did, as it's already done :)

    Savegame of 1960 BC attached.

    Till then,

    Seraiel
     
  19. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2011
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    Ok, after having played (and lost :D) some other games, and after having slept a whole day after it, I'm rdy to continue this story. Hope you're in a good mood and will enjoy reading again.

    Here are the years 2000 BC to 500 BC!

    Spoiler :


    2130 BC: Ramesses gets his first great Prophet and builds the Dao Miao!

    1950 BC, Bismark is the 2nd Civ to reach Alphabet. I instantly trade away Mysticism (against very usefull Hunting ^^) to be able to conduct further trades. Aim is, to trade away everything until CoL for anything and then CoL against Alphabet. My own Research is at 20% with +1g / Turn as I work every commerce tile there is, mainly the coast, as we still have no Cottages. Lizzy already has Alphabet and isn't willing to trade it against CoL, so I have to put in a few rounds of Research in it, so that this trade will be possible.

    1940 BC, I trade Meditation + Fishing with Bismark for Pottery. We can finally build cottages! Again, trading away Meditation was necessary, to be able to trade away CoL later.

    Remember: 2000 BC - 1500 BC is the time, where the first DoW's will be made, so it's absolutely needed to continue the production of Units in "at least 1 City!" Therefor, Moscow, though it's quite far away from the Capital, skips the Courthouse for the moment, and produces some Chariots, as they are good for defending against Axemen, have a high strenght which pushes military score and they are good for scouting and being fast. Better would be to produce Axemen, as they have an even higher strength and push military score even further, but we don't have BW till now. We will soon.

    I also found the City of Tiwanktu at the spot of purple (see last post) as I was dumb enough to open up Borders with Mansa. After Writing, I usually open up Borders with everyone for better diplomatic relationships, but with Mansa, this was of course a fault, as it has the risk of him settling in our empire, should have just let him be locked out forever, but again, no corrections in a HoF game possible, live with your faults, accept them, work against them.

    What are the Cities doing at 1940 BC: Cuzco and Pasargadae are still producing the Islamic Monestaries, St. Petersburg produces a Courthouse to ease the economy, all other Cities are producing Workers followed by the newly available Terrace after the Pottery Trade.

    1930 BC I gift Priesthood to Bismark, to get him to pleased, and to prepare him for the CoL vs. Alpha trade.

    1920 BC, Hannibal is the 3rd Civ to reach Alphabet. I trade the unnecessary Archery from him against Meditation, it's again the same, prepare everyone to be able to trade CoL. In the same year, De Gaulle is willing to trade useful Fur against totally unuseful Pigs, thx De Gaulle for being so nice!

    1910 BC: I gift Priesthood to Hannibal, again for better Relationships and being able to trade CoL with him, and, at last, I've researched enough into Alpha, so Bismark is willing to trade it against CoL! Of course I prefer him over Elizabeth, who seems to be the stronger Techer with the better start, better not to give her more good Techs.
    Bismark in any way is the better tradepartner, as he got Taoism from Ramesses, who was first to reach Monotheism. Bismark will be quite isolated, so we don't have to worry soon about him trading our CoL.

    Taking CoL instead of Alpha from the Oracle, seems to me to be worth of an explanation. As you see, not taking Alpha slowed our Tech-trades down quite a lot. We would have been able to get anything in 1960 BC already if we would have taken Alpha, but then again, we would not be able to build Courthouses for a long time, and, more important, we would only have 1 Tech to get everything and to bribe some people from that point onwards. Now, only a few turns later, we got Alphabet, so we can trade with anyone AND we still got CoL, which will make a big Deal if we gift it to some Civs which would be willing to declar war on us. Remember again, 2000 BC - 1500 BC is the phase of the game, where there is decided who will live and who will die, it's the phase where Relations are made and where early wars are declared, deciding about most of the later game, and still, our Situation isn't that well.
    Sure, we got lots of good Cities, but we only got Suleimann as a possible Partner, we can't convice Bismark to war on anyone as he has now gotten every Tech that we have, and we still have Ramesses, Joao and Hannibal against us, as they got the wrong Religion, all of them being very strong. It's time to hurry some things, and to get them into wars, so they won't declare on us.
    Make sure to spy on your Enemies aswell as on your partners. Atm. I'm spying on Bismark and Sulei as they will be our partners, and I'm spying on the Confucianists. I must be able to see, if one of our partners would survive a war with one of our enemies, if he wasn't, there would be no need in bribing, as it would only strenghten our enemies.


    1910 BC: I finally have Alpha and can trade like hell now, I instantly trade Writing + Meditation for BW! Finally, wouhou! Now I have most of the things I need, I instantly revolute to Slavery and take another look at the Military Advisor, something one has to do EVERY TURN in this period of the game:

    Spoiler :





    As you can see, Hannibal, Suleimann and Napoleon are the dangerous people atm. Napoleon + Suleimann went into War-Mode (the Fist) and Suleimann has no worst enemy. We have some choices now: We could convert to Islam, that would stop Sulei from declaring war on us, but would piss of Hannibal. Better, to gift these three some cheap Techs and still stay without a Religion, which gives us better trading possibilities with the rest of the Civs, and we wouldn't have any use from a Religion, like ORG or THEO till now.



    Still 1910 BC, I gift Meditation to Suleimann and Napoleon, as I consider them dangerous. It gets me +1 from "our Trade Relations have been fair and forthright", so I'm at +2 with them for the moment, I do not think that they will DoW me.

    1900 BC: Suleimann declares war on Elizabeth! That was close. Good Sulei, beat up the girl instead of the guy, stop her from teching so amazingly fast, we understand each other :D
    Same Turn, I trade Meditation + Alpha with Roosevelt for IW. Why Roosevelt all the time? Well he's the low-scorer of the list, better give some Techs to a Lowbob then to someone else, hm?

    1890: Lizzy, who has a Techlead over Sulei, decides to bribe 1 City Mansa against him. Good Decision Lizzy :D
    Another good Decision from her: Take my IW + CoL and give me Monarchy! I know, that's like 3k Beakers vs. the half of them, but I take it, even though it hurtens my Relations with Sulei and Napoleon, early Monarchy is great, and it's another Tech with which I can bribe people instead of CoL, it will become VERY worthful there. Still the same turn, I gift Meditation, Priesthood and Writing to everybody, who is dangerous for me, mainly Suleimann, Hannibal and Napoleon.
    And, still the same turn: It's time to bribe! Meditation + Mining + AH to Mehmed to get him into War with Ramesses! Purpose of this bribe, is to get Ramesses from Missionary production into war production, so he won't be able to spread his damn Religion so well.

    1880 BC: You already see from the dates, how much action there is in this period. It's immensly important now, to make no faults and to stay out of everything. Let the AI's bash each other, in the meantime we will take the last worthful city sites and develop, no need for early wars with our small Military. Great Prophet still hasn't been born, and my cities have other things to do instead of producing units. Lizzy, again with her high Tech, bribes Viccy into war with Sulei. Sulei of course comes instantly to me, and wants me to also get engaged in the war, but I refuse. Viccy is a close neighbour of mine, I have not enough Military and I don't wanna piss of my close neighbours, also, I don't want Lizzy to bribe for example Ramesses or Hannibal against me, I would get slaughtered. Sry Sulei, you have to be on your own for the Moment.


    As Techtrades are almost through now, it's time to take a look at some Screens, to see, what has happened in Score and Power:

    Spoiler :





    In the Score-Graph, you can really see the Oracle + the Tech-Trades after having Alpha, it exploded there, and for sure, we are #1 with quite a lead now.

    It's something else, when it comes to military Power. Suleimann, Joao and Hannibal have developed a HUGE military, while we were eager to even get BW and still are producing Troops only in 1 City. Against non-Aggressive Civs, one is normally safe until the point, where AI has 3 times the power of the player. 4 times, and they will DoW you, I can promise you that, so it's close atm. Gotta build more Units without sacrificing my further game.


    Still 1880: Time to Bribe some more. I told you, Monarchy would become important, and now it does: I'm able to bribe the pleased Bismark with it against powerful Joao. They are close neighbours, this will get bloody.

    And Still 1880, Research, which went to Aesthetics after having Alpha, stops completely. I still don't have a single cottage, as workers are busy chopping out Granaries, Courthouses, additional Workers and another Settler, they are improving the land like roading and mining up copper and iron, all things that seem more important to me than building cottages atm. Due to getting the Oracle and taking CoL, my Civ is on a good Tech-lvl, so better expand and take the last free sites instead of Teching even further and loosing them. I swich from working the commerce-tiles to full production. I whip in all Cities to get the 2 Monestaries and to get Granaries in all Cities which will be most important for additional whipping. Most Cities are only Size 1-2 atm., some are Size 4, but not bigger. Every City is only working their most worthful tiles, like special Ressources or Mines.

    1870 BC: Roosevelt and Suleimann convert to Judaism. WTF! I was just on the way with my Judaist Missionary to Elizabeth, to isolate her completely and to keep her in War with Sulei like forever. This is the problem from taking CoL and getting another Religion.

    1850 BC: Mansa is willing to trade Polytheism! I instantly agree and give him IW for it. Good Mansa, good that you are still in the game and still willing to trade Techs, nobody else wants to trade, keep being that way!

    1820 BC, Napoleon DoW's Viccy. Puh! That was again close, good that we gifted him some Techs and that he didn't choose us!
    Same turn, it says that De Gaulle is not willing to trade Sailing because he doesn't like me enough. I gift him Mysticism + Writing to get better Relationships.

    1810 BC, so next turn, De Gaulle is only willing to trade Crab, not Sailing! What do I want with Crab, I want Sailing, to get Trade by Rivers and overseas! Sailing would help my Religions spreading superfast and to everyone, damn you De Gaulle!
    I'm seriosly pissed of at De Gaulle, so again, I trade Monarchy (yes, this tech really pays out) with Roosevelt to bribe him into war with De Gaulle. De Gaulle? Wasn't that just the one we were going to make friends with? Yes, but De Gaulle is also a Friend of Napoleon, so by bribing Roose against De Gaulle, he also pisses of Napoleon, so we won't have to fear him in any further future, and, I want everybody to be in war with somebody, slowing down the others is the most important thing one can do in this period of the game.

    1800 BC: Whip whip whip chop chop chop...

    1780 BC: Hannibal is willing to trade Sailing! Good Hannibal! GLH hasn't been constructed till now, good that we gifted you some Techs to get good Relations and that you are willing to pay us back, good good good.
    We now have routes to everyone, as I constructed two Workbouts to scout the coast, and the River at Perspolis is really awesome. For the GLH we would need Masonry though, and there is no chance to research anything now as expanding is more important imho, so Persepolis, as the City with the most food, produces a Settler.

    1740 BC, Bismark and Joao make Peace. That was a little too soon for my taste. They didn't even loose many Units, I see that by looking at the power-graph. Not good, but at least, they hate each other now, and it's likely, they will keep declaring war at each other.

    1720 BC: Lizzy converts to Taoism (good Lizzy, get yourself isolated even more) and Napoleon and Viccy make peace, without having been at war really. This is so ing odd, can you please screw yourself Napoleon?

    1700 BC: Roosevelt captures Tours, at least him and De Gaulle are faring a real War...

    1670: The Islamic Monestaries are rdy. I instantly whip out 2 Missionaries, to convert some of my neighbours, whipping anger doesn't matter atm, being fast does.

    1630 BC: While the Missionaries are still on the way, I get lucky. Viccy + Washington convert to Islam, so I can use the Missionaries to convert Mehmed and Mansa, who join the Islamic Lovefeast a few turns later, after the Missionaries arrive.

    1610 BC: Mansa is willing to trade Masonry! Good Mansa, here, take this Monarchy for it! Monarchy for Masonry? You will think I'm kidding, but I'm not! The GLH hasn't been constructed up till now, and half of my Cities are coastal, so even on this Pangea map, it could be of great use to us. I instantly send all Workers to Persepolis to chop like hell.

    1600 BC: Mehmed and and Napoleon become Islamists!

    1580 BC: Ramesses switches to Taoism, that's cunning, getting him Bismark and Elizabeth as Friends, but leaving Hannibal and Joao behind. Lets take a look at Religions:

    Spoiler :




    Looks good, doesn't it? Now, really, to understand it, you have to take a look at the Worldmap first:



    Now you see, 4 of 6 of our neighbours are Islamic. Hannibal has still the wrong Religion, we're going to change that by sending Missionaries over to his big Cities and try to convert him, and Ramesses will be a future war-target as he has a weak military, so it's good he hasn't got Islam. In the NW we have lots of room for religious Conflicts, everyone is sitting besides someone with another religion, perfect. Lincoln and Frederick do not have a Religion like we atm, and I'm not going to spread Islam there, as I want to leave room for more conflicts there too. Go Ramesses!

    And one thing: Scout your map. Yes, do it. Build some Workbouts to explore the Coast, and build some Scouts or take some Checkers (Quechuas) to explore, it is a big advantage when knowing who sits beside whom when it comes to bribing. You see, I explored the whole worldmap until 1500 BC, you should also do that.



    1560 BC: I 2pop-whip the Lighthouse in Persepolis with maximum Overflow, and let the Overflow get into the GLH. It's gonna get exciting now, GLH is normally constructed around 1500 BC, we got a Chance at it, will we get it?
    Take a look at the Workers chopping:



    Don't wonder why some of the workers are chopping outside the borders, Persepolis will have a border-pop soon. Btw, I have exactly 2 Cottages up till now :D Workers are just too busy to do more important things than building cottages.

    1540 BC: The great Prophet arrives and I build the Masjid al-Haram, bringing +15g. Research is still at 0% though it could be 20%, but I go for Binary.



    1500 BC: Cuzco hires 3 Priests to get another great Prophet as early as possible.

    1490 BC: The GLH completes, bringing in another 10g which are equivalent to another 10% Research! Economic hole, solved in under 500y by a Shrine and a Wonder!

    1470 BC is another big year. Ramesses is finally willing to trade Monotheism, Lizzy was willing to trade the whole time but I had nothing to trade for! I instantly accept, as ORG is just so strong, and convert to Hereditary Rule + Organized Religion and go Islam. I gift some Techs to Hannibal, Joao and Suleimann, because they are even more pissed of of me for going Islam atm, and I still don't wanna get engaged in any war. Later soon, Hannibal blackmails me to stop deals with Lizzy, I have to agree, cause I have nothing to hold up against his big Military atm. Later soon, Joao blackmails me for Wine, I hate him, but he shall have it for now, better giving it to him, then being DoWed.

    1420 BC: Hannibal is the first to reach Currency. I can't trade it to him until now, because I have no Techs atm., but I can get 300g for Monotheism from him, helping me immensly on the way to reach Aesthetics, and giving me better Relationships again.

    1410 BC: Hannibal + Napoleon declare war on Mansa! Poor Mansa, but good that you're still in the game, without you, DoW would have been against us, we're sry you have to suffer so much from us :D

    1400 BC: Mansa bribes Roosevelt against Napoleon and De Gaulle also takes his chances in the war against poor Mansa, now action is starting again :)

    1390 BC: I get +3 with Hannibal from a random event where he sends me food, problems with him seem to be solved for the moment.

    1380 BC: Frederick takes his chances against Napoleon, fine fine, a world war is developing :) Good that we spread some hate, and good that Mansa is still in the game and got so many Techs from us, he can bribe people with them.

    1370 BC: Hannibal looses his whole SoD against 1 City Mansa *lololololol*.

    1350 BC: Sulei, still being in War with Viccy, conquers and Razes a City! Now I got even more place to settle, good Sulei!
    Btw.: 5 Cottages!!!

    1330 BC: After gifting Washinton some cheap Techs, I get him to trade Elephants with me! Another big step on the ladder of World Domination. There were simply no Elephants around my Empire, so I had to trade for them, now I finally have them, thx Washington!

    1320 BC: Everything develops well, Frederick converts to Confucianism, so more room for conflict there, and he takes Rouen from Napoleon. No way, Napoleon will be a matter to us in any way the whole game long, now we only got the Joao problem, but Joao just got tribute from us, so he cannot DoW and he hates Bismark more.

    1300 BC: Joao declares war on Bismark! Now our early bribes are paying out! Go you two, screw yourselves while we keep expanding and winning the game!

    1280 BC: Ramesses against Joao? O_O Was that Bismark with his high Technology bribing? Now really the whole world is in war...

    1240 BC: Ramesses looses a City to Joao, good Instinct from you Ramesses, going in a war there with someone who has the largest military of all Civs!
    Aesthetics complete btw, now look at the trades...

    1220 BC: I get Math from Mansa for CoL, I still am the only one to have Aesthetics and CoL still pays out!
    All 11 Cities are settled to this moment btw.

    1190 BC: Bismark gets a great Prophet and bulbs Theology O_o That was 15 turns too early Bismark! Screw you!

    1140 BC: 400g for Monotheism from Suleimann

    1130 BC: Math + CoL + Mono against Currency with Lincoln! Economy is so good, Research is up to 100% and I'm still the only one with Aesthetics!

    1120 BC: 300g for Mono from Napoleon!

    1100 BC: Parthenon complete!

    1080 BC: Statue of Zeus complete!

    1060 BC: Shwedagon Pagode complete!

    1050 BC: Construction completed, trading Aesthetics for HBR with Roosevelt, whipping Heroic Epic in Moscow, Elephants here I come!!!

    1040 BC: Great Prophet and Theology lightbulb. 2k Gold for additional Aesthetic trades in the meantime.

    Same Turn: Upgrading all experienced Checkers into Axemen, look at the Powergraph:



    1000 BC: Calendar complete!

    920 BC: TGL complete! :D After that, I trade Literature to everyone and get tons of money, money that fuels my 100% deficit Research.

    910 BC: AP complete! I gift Techs to the Islamic Civs so that they vote for me.

    900 BC: MoM complete! In addition, I get Leader of the AP.

    870 BC: I win the Music-Race now, after all Granaries, Libaries, Courthouses and Barracks are complete, I convert from Organized Religion to Theocracy! Full war-production beginns!

    750 BC: Paper complete, and I finally get the Worldmap!

    Spoiler :






    670 BC: A great Scientiest is born in Persepolis, which has continued the production of great Persons after the 2nd great Prophet out of Cuzco was born. Chances were only 50%, and I'm very happy about him, as he can found an Academy in Cuzco. I'm researching Education and have 8 Cottages, 9 Hamlets and 2 Villages up till now!

    580 BC: The national Epic is complete, and I use the GA from Music to start my first golden Age, to get more great Persons, to get more Units and to convert to Vassalage for the Moment and to Burocracy at the End of it. For the duration of the golden Age, I will be running hereditary rule (as I got nothing else, no Mids :/), Vassalage (for lvl 3 Units), Caste System (for more Specialists in Persepolis during the golden Age), Pacifism (for even more GP's during the golden Age).

    560 BC: Mehmed, being in war with the still holding on 1 City Mansa, wants to become my Vassal by free will! I agree to his proposal, having a vassal will help me a lot, and I do not think, that he will cancel the contract. Explanation of 1 point of the Vassal system: Vassals that come to you in free will, can always cancel the contract, in contrast to Vassals you've conquered, which can only get free again, if they reach certain conditions, like loosing half of their land, or reaching 50% of the masters land and pop, which is vera unlikely. I've only had good experiences with free Vassals, so I advise you, to take them, if they come to you. Don't be afraid, that they will leave you, they will only do that, if you seriously screw them, and you shouldn't do that with a Vassal, as he belongs to you!

    520 BC: Philosophy Lightbulb!

    500 BC: Military buildup complete, Units move into position for the war against Ramesses II! Why Ramesses? Because he's a close neighbour to whom we have bad relationships, he is not too strong, and he has a shrine, which we want to have!



    Marked: Our military power, how Joao never will do anything again after war with Bismark, and the amazing Hannibal being in war with little Mansa!

    Be prepared for the next post, when there is finally war again from the Incans! I hope you enjoyed the Wonderspam and the solvation of the economic hole by the shrine and the GLH.


    Again, I hope you enjoyed the reading, again I will be happy for some feedback, as this was a lot of work. Btw, has anybody played the game yet? :)

    Savegame of 500 BC attached.


    Seraiel
     

    Attached Files:

  20. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2011
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    Hi again :)

    After having played another round, where I topped the Score but not the finish Date, I'm rdy to continue the writeup of this round. I have to, because my next game, scoring #1 in HoF for Deity Huge has already been accepted, and I do wanna make a writeup of that also, as I'm still testing several things and took some different approaches in that game, you can be excited, next time I conquered a whole Huge Pangea in 500y!

    But lets stick to this game for the moment, what has happened:

    Spoiler :


    Hannibal, being in war with Mansa made a huge military buildup, which we'll have to counter at some time. It's still better though, to not engage him anytime soon, but to conquer more land and aquire more vassals to have a better chance against him.
    Most of the other Civ's are not worth talking about anymore. Lizzy is amazingly fast in Tech, but she's isolated and in lots of trouble, best Civs after Hannibal have the same military quotient we have, with decent tactics and strategy one always wins a 1:1.
    Ramesses is our next target, as he hates us, sits next to us, is quite weak and has a holy City.
    Mehmed is our first Vassal, though only one by free will, which is sometimes risky, if one screws up. Will he be loyal?
    One major problem of the round is already solved. We didn't start out with Elephants, but I was able to convert Washington to Islam by spreading Religion with Missionaries to his big Cities, after that gifting him some Techs so he likes me, and after that convert him. Once we had the same Religion, trade was easy and the connection seems safe.
    The first golden Age is still lasting, main purpose of it is to create more great persons in a short amount of time.
    Even though I did some serious Wonder spam in the last period, I was able to produce enough troops to conquer a target. The HE City Moscow produces 2 Elephants / 5 rounds and other Cities having a Barracks are supporting by producing CR2 Cats.
    It's 500 BC and I'm researching CS atm. I waited for as long as I could, but nobody wants to trade it, and it has to be rdy before the GA ends and we need it for Nationalism. Most of the Cities are building Universities already as we have Education!
    Some researched MC but again, nobody is willing to trade. What would we give for those cheap forges...
    The important Cities have a size of 8-10 atm. Less important Cities are about size 4 now.

    Here are some Screens for you:

    Techscreen:



    An Elephant rolling to Persepolis:



    The first SoD standing in position for Byblos:



    The second SoD standing in position for Giza:



    Overview & Religions:



    City Improvements:





    And now come the years 500 BC - 1 AD!

    Spoiler :


    490 BC: Hannibal builds the Colossus :/ With so many coastal cities, he now gets even stronger.

    Also 490 BC: Attack on Ramesses begins. As you've noticed from the Screens above, I've splittet my SoD and attack from two sides. Aim is, to take out his city owning the Elephants and to push from there forward to the holy city, while the other SoD pushes towards the Capital.
    Troops stood there for only 1 turn, as AI gets wary when it sees so many troops at it's borders, so hold back, time well, be fast.

    480 BC: Giza falls, Ramesses without a source of Elephants now. There are no real losses except the few suicide Cats. Byblos fell already 490 BC, City was razed by me as it had crappy positioning imho.



    470 BC: Ramesses is so amazed by my Shock & Awe, he instantly wants to capitulate:



    Sry Ramesses, you still got that holy City of yours which we wanna have, at least put up a decent fight.

    440 BC: Next City of Ramesses falls and is razed by me, as again, it's positioning was poor. In the meanwhile, De Gaulle gets afraid and becomes Hannibals Vassal by free will.

    430 BC: Another GS is born. SoD 2 which took Giza is already fully healed and heads towards the holy City. SoD 1 which took 2 cities already, both of them being razed, has to wait, healing in neutral territory takes quite a lot time.

    390 BC: Ramesses gets a GS, so I capture the holy City one turn later, hoping it will have an Academy.

    380 BC: Holy City falls, it has +46g income by the shrine! Ramesses down to 2 Cities now after this ancient Blitzkrieg.

    360 BC: I notice, that healing without a Medic 3 Woods 3 Healer takes forever -.-

    350 BC: GA ends, I switch to HR Buro Slavery Theocracy for amazing Research with lvl 3 Units from Barracks only Cities. Units are still healing. Research is at 500+ BPT at 100% with a deficit of 130g.

    330 BC: The Hagia Sophia completes :D I admit, I built too many Wonders in that round, even the mostly worthless ones, but it was great fun :D And what I forgot: I joined in the war against poor Mansa some time ago to get better relations to Hannibal, don't wanna be attacked soon.
    Troops have barely healed, but I have to advance further onto Ramesses, as Mehmed has arrived with his SoD, I don't want him to take Ramesses Capital! I leave the wounded in the captured cities behind with a Healer, thats why I always produce 4 Healers, 2 for each SoD or 1 if attack with 4 SoD's.

    310 BC: A GE is born! There is a sense in constructing Wonders like Hagia Sophia, at least a small one. Same turn, I gift military Techs like CS + Machinery + Feudalism to Mehmed to make him stronger, and to make him able to research Guilds!

    300 BC: 2nd GG "HEINZ GUDERIAN" is born!!111 I settle him in Moscow for lvl 4 Troops.

    270 BC: Egypt down! Same turn, I realize something you'll love, if you don't know it yet: You can make tons of money by trading maps! Same turn, I made about 1k money only by map trading! Enough to upgrade lots of the obsolete Axemen to Maces.

    City of Thebes btw has a settled GG, but is the crap city of crap cities. Only good City Ramesses had was holy Heliopolis with its +46g.

    260 BC: Washington is afraid of Hannibal too, so he agrees to become a Vassal of mine!

    250 BC: R. I. P. Mansa :(

    190 BC: LIBERALISM!!! I take Nationalism as a free Tech, as it's expensive, and I was afraid of not winning the Economics Race also.

    140 BC: Bismark agrees to become a Vassal of Hannibal -.- This is now a race of who can aquire Vassals faster.

    90 BC: Hannibal declares war on Roosevelt after Mansa is dead now. This is bad, Roosevelt has no chance against Hannibal and his Vassals. I instantly gift Roosevelt Ivory and, 2 turns later:

    70 BC: The Apostolic Palace! Stop the War against Roosevelt!

    Hannibal lost quite some Troops in the attack, peace now would be a deep strike against his aquiration of Vassals.



    60 BC: While I'm preparing for war against Joao, the vote fails! I can't believe it, but Roosevelt, this dumbass idiot, wants the war, he defied the vote!

    40 BC: I decide, War against Joao has to happen fast. Roosevelt will become a Vassal of Hannibal soon, so I prepare for a frontal attack against the now, after endless years of war, weak, Joao. Another possibility would have been, to join the war of Hannibal against Roosevelt and to steal the vassal from him, but all my troops are in ex-Egypt atm, so I decide to take on the race and attack the closer target, I believe in Mehmed! (I guess he never heard that :D)

    10 BC: Oxford complete! Research up to 750 BPT at -200 GPT!

    1 AD: Roosevelt goes down, and while still researching Military Tradition, I push against Joao's Border Cities. Note: My Stack Composition is so good, Joao did not even try to attack me with Cats on the open field, he just sits in the City and awaits his doom. Only thing: I have few Cats left after the war against Ramesses. Here is a picture of my now single SoD and the defenders in Joao's border City:



    What will happen in this war? Will I win the race of Vassal-aquiration against overpowerful Hannibal? Be prepared for the next episode of "Replay 01" !



    I hope you again enjoyed reading, cya soon,

    Seraiel
     

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