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Rise and Fall of House Julii

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Creation & Customization' started by The Guardian, Jan 30, 2011.

  1. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    The Early history of Rome is shrouded in myth, legend and conjecture.​
    But there is one thing that we do know;​
    For Romans in Rome’s quarrel
    Spared neither land nor gold,
    Nor son nor wife, nor limb nor life,
    In the brave days of old…..​
    The Romans were like brothers
    In the brave days of old.​
    Thomas Babington Macaulay, Lord Macaulay
    How Horatius Kept the Bridge​






    [Coin of Antoninus Pius Augustus 138-161] Reverse: TR POT COS III Wolf standing right, suckling Remus and Romulus; cave ceiling above.
    While most would have it that Rome was named for Romulus who outwitted his brother Remus for control of the new settlement, Plutarch is clear that:
    "from whom, and for what reason, the city of Rome, a name so great in glory, and famous in the mouths of all men, was so first called, authors do not agree..."
    The fact is that the origin for the name of the new settlement of Rome is as likely a woman as it is a man. Plutarch explains:











    "at the taking of Troy, some few that escaped and met with shipping, put to sea, and driven by winds, were carried upon the coasts of Tuscany, and came to anchor off the mouth of the river Tiber, where their women, out of heart and weary with the sea, on its being proposed by one of the highest birth and best understanding amongst them, whose name was Roma, burnt the ships. With which act the men at first were angry..."

    [Coin of Titus Augustus 79-81] Reverse: ROMA SC Helmeted Roma standing left, holding Nike Goddess of Victory in right hand; spear in left.
    then later:
    "things in a short while succeeded far better than they could hope, in that they found the country very good, and the people courteous, they not only did the lady Roma other honours, but added also this, of calling after her name the city which she had been the occasion of their founding...."
    The early history of Rome is mythical and legendary, and our sources come centuries after the facts.




    Work has begun. This scenario will contain two seperate Biq files. The first Biq file will allow the player to select to play as any one of 31 ancient civilizations. The start time of the scenario under this Biq file will be 753 BCE the Legendary time of the founding of the City of Rome. There will be no preplaced cities on the map and all civs will start from scratch.



    The second Biq file will all cities preplaced on a huge 360X302 map. The player can again choose from any of the 31 civs to play as. All cities will be placed and named as accurately as possible according to historical records. Terrain features will placed as close to historical references as possible.


    In addition, I have obtained permission from King_Louise Assurbanipal (KLA) to convert/duplicate his units which he created for Rome Total War for use in this mod. KLA is one the the best unit designers contributing to the Total War Center Forums. There will be 200 +/- Units new to civ 3 added to this mod. Here is a sample of what you can expect.


    Spoiler :

    Imperator1961 has agreed to take on the huge task of recreating these historically accurate units for Civ 3 and this mod.


    In addition to the new units I will be converting approximate 200 improvements/buildings from various sources. I will provide pics of the improvements as we go.


    We will be using the terrain graphics created by Ares de Borg. here are some screnn shots of the map​
    Spoiler :






    We will also be using the interface created by Balthasar and modified for this scenario by me.
    Once again here is a sample;
    Spoiler :



    This project is going to take quite some time to complete. At this point, I would estimate the time at one year. We will of course keep you informed of our progress and will from time to time, seek your advice and assistance regarding various development matters.
     
  2. Quintillus

    Quintillus Archiving Civ3 Content Supporter

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    Wow, looks like it will be quite a scenario. The introduction was splendid, and I enjoyed reading it. I am curious how you are going to reconcile the 512-city limit and the gigantic map - are literally all cities going to already be pre-placed in the BIQ that has cities, and no settlers be available?
     
  3. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    First, there is a no city limit patch available which I have used before and it has been tested, and works quite well.

    There will be settlers, and thanks to Plotinus and others, each civ will have its own settler and worker unique units.

    I have given a lot of thought to the question of whether all existing cities should be placed on the map. I am using maps from IAM map index ( [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Interactive Ancient Mediterranean Project [/FONT] ) as well as [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]the Barrington Atlas of the Greek and Roman World from Princeton Univercity. I can assure you that there are far too many cities listed on these maps to place them all in the scenario. I am going to try and select the most relevant cities based on their importance and location of important events that occurred during the time period. As I mentioned above, one Biq will have only starting location and no pre-placed cities and the other will have pre-placed cities but it would be impossible to place all existing cities. Here is an example of one of the many maps I am using.



    This is a map of Asia Minor as you can see. There are well over 50 cities on this map and this map represents less than 11% of the scenario map. It also illustrates another problem. Near the center of the map under the second A in Asia and under the N in Minor you will see two cities both named Caesarea. This is an occurrance that repeats itself again and again. There is a city in Rome called Neapolis, there is also a city in Greece named Neapolis. This of course is not a major problem and can easily be rectified by including the name of the country or region, but do you have any idea how many Caesarea there were? :lol: Neither did I until I started putting this Map together.

    To answer your question - yes there will be settlers but they will be expensive.
    [/FONT]
     
  4. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    I know many people may also be concerned about load time and time between turns for such a big map. I am working on a new method of creating income thru trade that should eliminate the delays cause by the computer having to recalculate all the possible trade routes each turn. If it works, then the delays will be eliminated.
     
  5. ThERat

    ThERat Chieftain

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    this looks very promising and really sounds good.

    How do you overcome the hard coded 512 city limit? Do you also raise the hard coded unit limit?
     
  6. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    You can get the patches here http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=327919

    No Raze, No city Limit, No Unit Limit
     
  7. Quintillus

    Quintillus Archiving Civ3 Content Supporter

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    Huh, seems I completely missed the No Unit Limit patch. And good to hear that the No City Limit patch is working well, I recall when it first came out that wasn't completely certain, but I'm sure both of those limits being removed will be useful for this scenario!

    That is something else that I was concerned about. That's the reason I've never completed a game of WWII-Global by Rocoteh, and don't expect to try again until I get a faster computer. If you can come up with a method that significantly speeds up the AI turn times, that would greatly increase my chances of playing more than just the first few turns, and I'm sure the same applies to many other people.
     
  8. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    I am pretty sure that I can. We have had some success by limiting ocean and sea trade and by manipulating trade routes with impassable terrain. I think I can duplicate or replace the benefits of trade by another means and thus eliminate the need for trading strategic and luxury resources.
     
  9. tom2050

    tom2050 Chieftain

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    It sounds like you are planning on using micro-zones (which SOE team used for Storm over Europe). IIRC, they tested them and they work well.

    Sounds interesting, agreed that the introduction is very compelling. Look forward to watching this progress.
     
  10. nick0515

    nick0515 Fantasy World Builder

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    Looks very interesting! I love Roman history and RFRE is one of my favourite mods. Will be following this thread carefully.

    I have always wanted to do some kind of Roman project, but it's just always seemed like too big a task and I have too many other unfinished projects.

    I too missed the no unit limit patch so thanks!
     
  11. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    The NORaze and NCL have been available since July 2009. The No Unit limit has only been available since Nov. 2010. S0, don't feel bad about missing it. Be sure to read the thread, there are some caveats when using it.
     
  12. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    That's exactly what I am planning Tom, with the introduction of a few other twists. I am also planning on using techs, building/improvements, and careful manipulation of strategic and luxury resources.
     
  13. Ares de Borg

    Ares de Borg Norman Knight

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    Thank you for considering to use my terrain. :) The screenshot shows another terrain mod, though. Good luck for your project!
     
  14. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    NO NO NO NO! Thank YOU Ares. Your terrain is perfect for this scenario. I also used it in my Napoleonic Wars Global scenario and I love it. I hope you will continue working on it as this is nearly a perfect media to work with.

    The screen shot is a beta version I took before applying the terrain graphics. I will post another one soon so everyone can see what It REALLY looks like.

    PS
    I don't know if you realised this, but one of things I really like about these terrain graphics is that when I zoom way out it is very easy to establish the topographical effect that I want the terrain to have, mountain ranges, plains deserts etc. and when you zoom in, the detail of the terrain itself is magnificent. It makes creating maps easier.
     
  15. Bowsling

    Bowsling Chieftain

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    Funny, I'm working on a scenario set in just Italy based on the Roman conquest of Italy, with pre-placed cities. This looks quite good though!
     
  16. Mithadan

    Mithadan Wandering Woodsman

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    When does the house of Julii fall? With Nero in 68AD? Perhaps you won't have much time to use those lorica segmentata graphics?
     
  17. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    I would be interested in seeing it when your finished. What is the scope of your scenario? How many factions are you planning on using? If there is anything I can do to help, let me know.

    My scenario is an epic mod, including 31civs. I am trying to make the map as historically accurate as possible. The timeline will probably be not as historically accurate, as much of what happens and when it happens will be up be decided by the player or players choices. There are other things also that will not be historically accurate. Troy was destroyed long before Rome became a power. In fact it has been proposed that Rome was actually founded by survivors of Troy. In the first scenario BIQ all civs start equally with only a starting location.

    Right now, I am still working on the building and improvements. I have finished the Romans Carthaginians and am just finishing up with Egypt. The Persians will be next.
     
  18. Bowsling

    Bowsling Chieftain

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    Small. Just Italy. The civs are:
    Rome
    Etruscans
    Umbri
    Volsci
    Veniti
    Liguri
    Samnium
    Iapyges
    Magna Graecia (southern Italy, mainly Tarentum, Croton and Cumae)
    Syracuse
    Massalia
    Carthage (non-playable, in there to win an economic victory if not dealt with, and to harass Italy)
     
  19. The Guardian

    The Guardian Praetorian

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    You mentioned that all the cities were pre placed. Do you have only one city for each civ? If not, how many cities do you have and to whom do they belong? Do you have settlers or no settlers? How large is your map? I have a nice large map of Italy if you need it.
     
  20. Bowsling

    Bowsling Chieftain

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    No settlers. The map is already done, I'm just working on techs, building, units, graphics. I don't know how big the map is off the top of my head.
     

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